vix86 wrote:

That secondary list is still missing some "I"s. うち　and 自分 in particular...

Not to mention the archaic and/or self-aggrandizing ones, such as 麿, 妾, 余/予, 朕, 儂 and the ever so popular 俺様. And that's just a small fraction of utterly useless vocab one can pick up from anime. Too bad SNL couldn't have made fun of that aspect of Western otaku-ism without getting too far into esoteric territory. I guess that one is for Japanese comedians to ridicule.

astendra wrote:

This reminds me of a picture I saw the other day:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= … 5463209257

The problem with this though is that it gives a wrong impression of the word 'otaku.'  I actually have a worse impression of manga/anime otaku in Japan than weeaboo in America/Europe.  Ever been to Akihabara or Nipponbashi?  You know those guys who hump those half-naked girl pillows and can't talk above a whisper?  Yeah, those are otaku.

Last edited by Tzadeck (2011 October 18, 6:25 am)

nadiatims wrote:

Tzadeck wrote:

You seem pretty confused.  For guys in their early 20s using 僕 is completely appropriate when talking to friends (and anyway, how the hell can a masculine first person pronoun sound 'effeminate?').  Both male and female Japanese friends have advised me that 僕 is completely appropriate for my age and personality type.

Maybe 'effeminate' was the wrong word. I guess I meant slightly wimpy, or non-manly. I think among guys, no one will care too much if you're saying 僕 or 俺. 僕 may be slightly less confrontational and fitting for quiet or well-natured people, and more 'alpha'ish guys may use 俺 more. But among women, there are people who for example don't want their boyfriend to refer to themselves as 僕. I think it is a bit of a 人それぞれ thing and probably differs by region/upbringing etc. I still think your friend was probably friendlily poking fun of you slightly though.

You're right about the distinctions between 僕 being more reserved, and 俺 more aggressive. I don't agree with the idea that a woman wouldn't want their boyfriend to use 僕. I also don't understand what you mean by 僕 being wimpy or non-manly. I acknowledge you may have more experience with Japanese people/culture/etc., but it doesn't seem right to refer to 僕 as having those characteristics.

TheVinster wrote:

I don't agree with the idea that a woman wouldn't want their boyfriend to use 僕. I also don't understand what you mean by 僕 being wimpy or non-manly. I acknowledge you may have more experience with Japanese people/culture/etc., but it doesn't seem right to refer to 僕 as having those characteristics.

I'm not sure what you mean by disagree. My girlfriend has said exactly that to me. When I asked my other friends, they said it was probably a bit boyish and stood out a bit, while the older women I asked on Shared Talk said 僕 is more appropriate.

It can feel a bit "rough" using 俺 with strangers or older people, and when I'm talking to a group of people and I'm the only guy using 僕, then yeah, I feel a bit wimpy. Basically, you can't even give them labels like "aggressive/passive" without taking the situation into account.

俺 seems to get a lot of bad press for being "macho," but in many instances it says about as much about you as 'I/me.' I found it difficult to adjust to using it because of the early impression I developed of it, and I still only use it in limited situations. Can't remember the last time I said 私 though

vix86 wrote:

ta12121 wrote:

I've never actually been to anime convention, my gut always told me to stay away from there but if it was in Japan, it would probably be another story. I wouldn't mind visiting it there. Then again, I'm not the type of person to dress up and discuss anime/manga like crazy.

Japan doesn't really have anything like the anime conventions in the states. State conventions tend to have guest speakers and what not, as well as contests. The closet thing to anime cons in Japan are 同人誌 markets and possibly some of the smaller cosplay events.

---

On the topic of people cringing at weeaboos using Japanese. I want to point out that Japanese among this crowd of people tends to have VERY similar characteristics as the adults that go to eikaiwa's in Japan. Its a passing hobby that probably won't ever go anywhere far. They want to learn a few catch phrases here or there and maybe learn enough Japanese/English so that when they visit another country they can get around. Most lack the motivation or are too busy to ever hope to progress it to any depth that will give fluency.

True, not everyone has the motivation to get to fluency but not everyone finds it useful. I know a few people who like it but are not dedicated enough to learn it

Tzadeck wrote:

astendra wrote:

This reminds me of a picture I saw the other day:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= … 5463209257

The problem with this though is that it gives a wrong impression of the word 'otaku.'  I actually have a worse impression of manga/anime otaku in Japan than weeaboo in America/Europe.  Ever been to Akihabara or Nipponbashi?  You know those guys who hump those half-naked girl pillows and can't talk above a whisper?  Yeah, those are otaku.

I think it's funny how the "otaku" image is cool. That stereotype is never true anywhere you go.

As for Japanese otaku, yes, the pillow humping creepy greasy guy with plaid shirts and the backpack full of posters is a common image. But there are otaku who go out and party and are social, etc.

The manga Genshiken is pretty accurate when I think about it.

this one made me lose it XD

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= … permPage=1

kainzero wrote:

I think it's funny how the "otaku" image is cool. That stereotype is never true anywhere you go.

As for Japanese otaku, yes, the pillow humping creepy greasy guy with plaid shirts and the backpack full of posters is a common image. But there are otaku who go out and party and are social, etc.

The manga Genshiken is pretty accurate when I think about it.

Genshiken is pretty accurate I think. Their are plenty of socialable otaku in Japan I think, but I think it depends within what circle you are talking. I always see guys in groups in the anime/manga/doujin stores in Akiba; so these guys have friends. I also on the rare occasion see them with a girl too, so many have working relationships. And I'm pretty sure that a good number of these people also work too, so they aren't all NEETs (those humping pillows are not cheap!). Far fewer people fit the stereotypical image in Japan. Not many are married though I think, but thats pretty persistent throughout all of Japan for that to even classify as an identifier for an otaku.

Otaku in Japan = obessed over something (as has been stated). But 'otaku' in the states just means "I like anime, games, or manga." Plenty of people in Japan like manga in Japan and games have become so pervasive in the culture that just about everyone plays some games so many people can also say "I like games here." Maybe its different when you start talking about the genre of stuff though. Anime is kind of hit or miss though after a certain age. Many of the things that we have used to classify "geeks" in the states just don't work any more. Not only that but as was mentioned, "its cool to be a geek now."

The only detailed comparison I've seen of Japanese vs. Western anime fans was here, and it explained I lot of things I ran into talking with Japanese anime/manga fans. Overall I think the core difference is that in English speaking countries, there is the added factor of Japanese stuff being "cool", which doesn't happen with Japanese anime/manga fans because they are Japanese. Xd

Last edited by Bokusenou (2011 October 19, 1:29 am)

bokusenou wrote:

The only detailed comparasion I've seen of Japanese vs. Western anime fans was here, and it explained I lot of things I ran into talking with Japanese anime/manga fans.

Ah, that is a good post. I still have some trouble associating some of the points to some of the otaku I've seen in here. I go to the large events like comiket and that's where the crazed fans come out of the wood work and buy 1.2man - 2man dakimakura covers and stuff. The thing about there being a lack of continual fanbase is pretty real though. Nothing stays popular for long in Japan....except 東方.

kainzero wrote:

On the other hand I don't think that many people identify themselves strictly as オタク and would probably say what kind they are.
Like we all have a notion of what a nerd is, but if you say you're a computer nerd then it changes your image completely.
At least, that's my experience.

Ah this is a good point, I had forgot about that I've heard made. Japanese otaku rarely self identify as otaku and usually get the label, while the west does otherwise.

How do you know the girl isn't the otaku?!

I never said they wern't :p. I think some might not be but most probably are. Except they are likely 腐女子.

it's hard to define myself as an otaku. I think it's because, most people associate it with obsession with anime or manga. While my interests are general (get manga books,watch anime,play the games,download wallpapers to my computer,etc.) I don't really do anything else than this(don't watch too much series) haha.

ta12121 wrote:

Most of the Japanese Studies I do are at home, but now that I have a laptop. I can pretty much do it anywhere in school now. If it was me, I'd just use it as means of meeting more people but I've had the occasional dirty states on the bus+at school.
One time I heard this Japanese girl talking on her phone, inside the bus. I was thinking whether to talk but I decided might as well just listen in(not be a stalker or anything but I can't undo my listening skills in jp lol)

I was actually on the other end of this today.  I was getting on the bus, while reading Ouran Host Club.  This Japanese woman beside me looked shocked, and asked if I was reading it in Japanese, and if I could understand it.  Admittedly, my understanding is spotty, but we ended up having a conversation, about 3/4 of it in Japanese.  For me to converse with someone mainly in Japanese is a huge deal, because, well, my Japanese is really bad.  Reading Japanese while out and about pays off sometimes.
Oh, and I'm the same as you. I can't muster up the courage to initiate a conversation with a Japanese person.  The fear of them being annoyed with me, or thinking I'm an idiot is too strong.