magamo wrote:

konakona50 wrote:

Sweetness! I didn't know this thread existed. well anyways "カラメルの膜まで綺麗に食べれるだろう" this is the sentence that's being a total pain since i can understand basically all the words, but still can't understand the gist of the sentence. It's driving me crazy! help would be greatly appreciated.

from what i have, i understand it to mean something like "i can probably eat to the skin of caramel." but that 綺麗に is not clicking with the rest of the sentence in my mind...

きれい can mean "completely," "thoroughly," "entirely," "cleanly," and so on when followed by に and used like an adverb. If you're using 研究社's J-E 新和英大辞典, you can find a bunch of example sentences for this meaning such as きれいにだまされた (I was completely taken in) and そのことこはきれいに忘れてしまった (I forgot all about it).

dbh2ppa wrote:

two questions from the same story. 猫が鼠を追い掛けるわけ.

すると神様は、
「遅かったね。残念だけど、昨日決まったよ」
と、言うではありませんか。

i know it means "神様 said...", but, i can't understand what the "言うではありませんか" is supposed to mean. why is it in negative form? what's that か doing there?

「鼠め、よくもだましたな！」

i really don't get what this is supposed to mean at all...

か is often used with a negating word such as ない and ありません to express a certain emotion like surprise. This type of ないか and ありませんか aren't negating the sentence, so the ありませんか in your example is there to mean what God just said is counterintuitive/surprising/whatever to the cat. You can put "驚いたことに (to Cat's surprise)" after すると神様は without changing the meaning of the sentence.

As for 鼠め、よくもだましたな！, Jarvik has already gave a solid explanation, and there is nothing to add.

Edit: Ah, ocircle beat me to it.

IceCream wrote:

もう一軒どっか行く？　
あー、いえ、今日は帰ります
what does 一軒 mean? is he asking her to go for another drink, or to go back to his house or something?

女なら誰でも見てるし、お前一人なんか全然見てねー。自意識過剰。
お前一人なんか全然見てねー i'm not sure if i get what he's saying here... does he mean, "i wouldn't look at you if you didn't have a boyfriend", or, "i don't look at only you" or, something else? and what would the sentence look like instead, if he was saying / implying those other things?

thanks ：）

もう一軒 is "another bar." So he's asking to go for another drink. If he's asking if she comes to his house, it should be 今日うち来る？, 俺んち来ない？ or something along those lines.

About 女なら誰でも見てるし、お前一人なんか全然見てねー。自意識過剰。, it requires more context, but probably he means "It's not like I ignore other girls." お前一人を見る can mean "I love you and only you," but he may be saying it literally. Either way, he's saying that he's interested in girls like your average guy and that it's not that he's particularly interested in her. If he meant "i wouldn't look at you if you didn't have a boyfriend," it'd be 彼氏いなかったらお前なんか見てねー。(using the same polite level, language register, etc.).

thanks for the help! can't believe i didn't see it... nice to have experienced ppl on this forum.

cmertb wrote:

magamo:  It's a teacher talking about his students.  So nothing disgusting.

Ah, I see. It's often said teachers and bureaucrats are easy to spot because of their unique word choice. The Japanese sentence you posted sounds as if the speaker is superior to others and the love he's talking about could be fake. You can use a simpler sentence structure, for example, きちんと愛情を伝えることが大切です so that it's clear that your love is real and you don't sound condescending.

From EDICT:
捲る    【まくる】        (suf,v5r) (1) to turn up, to roll up (e.g. sleeves), (2) verb suffix to indicate reckless abandon to the activity, (P)

Hi all. I came across the following sentence:

うち一体が、もぞりと動く。

The prior context is that the main character knows there are two hostile creatures behind, and I assume the meaning is something like, "One of them moves (in such and such a way)". The (such and such),　もぞりと, doesn't appear in dic.yahoo.co.jp or dictionary.goo.ne.jp, and I googled the term to see if Tae Kim has anything, but no luck.

If anyone knows the meaning, I'd really appreciate any insights.

Thanks!

That's really useful, and fits the context just right.

Thanks for your help!

A J-J dictionary is a good place to look for this -- generally if the J-J dictionary does not give any information on the differing kanji usage, that means that the majority of native speakers would have no idea and you don't really have to worry about it.

For きく, the Koujien has a note at the end: 広く一般には「聞」を使い、注意深く耳を傾ける場合に「聴」を使う。  You can take from that what you will, for me, it means that I would just use 聞く all the time.

The Microsoft IME also has information as well in the yellow bubbles to the right when you use the converter.  It also basically says the same thing as the Koujien, that 聞く is 一般的.

For なみだ, 涙 is the only kanji of the three on the Jouyou list, so you're going to see that more often than the other two.  Neither the Koujien nor the IME give any information on the difference, which means that if there technically is one, it's so minute and such obscure knowledge that most people wouldn't notice or care.

The Kanjigen sometimes has some additional information, but it's often very hard to make actual use of -- for なみだ, it says that 涕 is 下へおちるなみだ, and that 涙 and 泪 are はらはらとおちるなみだ.  But I doubt you could find one native speaker in 100,000 that actually knew that distinction and observed it in their writing.

Oh, 明鏡国語辞典 does explain the difference and usage of 聞く vs. 聴く.

It lists six meanings for 聞く・聴く. There is a mark for each meaning to indicate which kanji is used. Either kanji is acceptable for two of the six meanings (the remaining four cases only accept 聞く), and there are short remarks on the difference in nuance between 聞 and 聴.

One meaning also accepts 訊く, and there are a comment about why it's acceptable and an example sentence for the case when 訊 is common. One other meaning accepts 利く too, and if you look in the entry of 利く・効く (these are also read as きく), you'll find nine meanings, each of which has a kanji mark, and notes on difference when multiple kanji are acceptable.

Anyway, 聴く is only used in very specific cases. If monolingual dictionaries are too difficult for you, maybe it's better to always use 聞く when you don't know if 聴く is ok.

The difference between 涙 and 泪 lies in the origin of the kanji, not in usage or meaning, so J-J dictionaries don't have information. Either is acceptable in any situations except proper nouns, but 涙 is commoner probably because it's Jouyou. Technically 涕 is different from 涙 and 泪. It's very rare, though it appears in famous classical Chinese poems taught at high school (...wait, was it junior high?). You might need larger J-J dictionaries than 広辞苑 to find a real example.

Last edited by magamo (2009 October 16, 10:36 pm)

One of the most common usage of 聴く is with music. If I see this word with this kanji, I almost immediately think of listening to songs and such. (It can be used pretty freely in this context without sounding weird.)

Last edited by Smackle (2009 October 17, 2:20 am)

Are you sure it's not おすすめ?

In this sentence: 別に何も急いでなんかいないよ. Can anyone tell me why なんか is coming between 急いで and いない？Or is it just something without any particular rhyme or reason that I should get used to? It's the first time I've seen something come between a ～て and いる.

It has the same function as なんか in other places, it sort of humbles or discounts what it comes after -- "It's not really like I'm in a hurry or anything."

You can put other things between the て and いる as well, like は, も, and さえ.

timewastin wrote:

timewastin wrote:

頭の良い夫婦の気配りのおすすめ

Does anyone know this?

Google tells me that 「頭のいい夫婦 気くばりのすすめ」  is a book title: http://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/4877950982 (in the marriage guidance self-help genre). 

Especially the meaning of 気配り in this context..

Not a word I'd come across before, but the dictionaries give things along the lines of consideration/sensitivity, which seems about right to me... The impression I get from pages like http://www4.plala.or.jp/k-k/komoku120.html is that we're basically talking 'that regard for the other person's feelings which makes human relationships work smoothly'.