How do you pronounce this? @_@

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kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

TSUTSU

As is in 包む. Or better. に包まれた

I have an audio recording where the speaker sounds as if he's saying につまれた. It's like he skipped and entire syllable.

Jarvik7 Member
From: 名古屋 Registered: 2007-03-05 Posts: 3946

It's pronounced... tsutsumu.  Although the u vowel in Japanese becomes devocalized very easily so you might hear it as tstsumu/tstsmu depending on the speaker.

Maybe the recording is saying 積む(つむ), which has a somewhat similar meaning in some usages?

Last edited by Jarvik7 (2008 October 14, 6:58 pm)

kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

Perhaps, there are points where the books says ゆ but he says い for 行.

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kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

I just checked the meaning of 積む. It was not what he intented. This is driving me nuts.

Is it possible that when read fast に包む can be pronounced にっつむ.

Edit:

Okay, now after listening to it for the umpteenth time it sounds like Nit-tsumareta which I guess is what you were saying when you put "tstsumu."

Last edited by kazelee (2008 October 14, 8:44 pm)

alyks Member
From: Arizona Registered: 2008-05-31 Posts: 914 Website

This kind of thing is why I like to watch J stuff with the script. I never put anything in my SRS without written confirmation. I would if something was totally obvious, but if it's that obvious, I already know it and don't need to put it in.

kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

Yeah. It was written. It just didn't sound like what was written there. I'm not adding this to the SRS just yet (splicing an mp3 is not fun). I was just shadowing a Soseki story.

The reader makes many small changes, like with 行, so I was wondering if there were some sort of alternate pronunciation.

samesong Member
From: Nagano Registered: 2008-06-13 Posts: 242 Website

What's the context? に is commonly placed before 包む to show what something is wrapped in.

nac_est Member
From: Italy Registered: 2006-12-12 Posts: 617 Website

Unless I'm mistaken, I think 包む can also be pronounced くるむ. I guess it depends on the context.

Tobberoth Member
From: Sweden Registered: 2008-08-25 Posts: 3364

nac_est wrote:

Unless I'm mistaken, I think 包む can also be pronounced くるむ. I guess it depends on the context.

Correct, looking them up on Sanseido shows that the meaning is different though, tsutsumu seems to have a broader meaning.

Reply #10 - 2008 October 15, 8:17 am
kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

samesong wrote:

What's the context? に is commonly placed before 包む to show what something is wrapped in.

大きな潤いある眼で、長い睫に包まれた中は、ただ一面に真っ黒であった。

Mp3 can be found here.

http://speaking-japanese.com/breaking/lite_01.html

It's at around 1分20.

albion Member
From: England Registered: 2008-05-25 Posts: 383 Website

I can hear the つつ part (but maybe that's because I know it's supposed to be there). It sounds like the vowel of the first syllable isn't voiced, so it comes out more as "tstsu".

samesong Member
From: Nagano Registered: 2008-06-13 Posts: 242 Website

You heard correctly, kind of smile. He is in fact saying つ twice, but the first time he says it, the う isn't voiced. It's kind of like how you say です and it comes out sounding like 'Dess'.

edit -- albion beat me to it!

Last edited by samesong (2008 October 15, 10:07 am)

kazelee Rater Mode
From: ohlrite Registered: 2008-06-18 Posts: 2132 Website

Thanks guys big_smile

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