The Encouragement Thread

gyuujuice Member

From: USA Registered: 2008-09-24 Posts: 828

So I had to look a a bunch of schools and sign up for tests etc. My September goals were to finish 完全マスター文法 ( 173 grammar points) and 毎日聞き取り50日. I am only at grammar point 20! I want to finish the grammar points early so I can have more time to review them. So I guess I ave to do 15 points a day. (1 point takes 5 minutes on average so over an hour of work.)

I'm typing out ALL of the stories and information in the　毎日 series so I can:
1) Get practice in dictation (but I still use them pamphlet as well)
2) Edit the stories and read them on a PC
3) Copy&paste into Anki

I am halfway through one book so I have to copy 6 stories per day if I want to finish! =___=' I guess I should stop wasting my time here and start working. :L

EratiK Member

From: Paris Registered: 2010-07-15 Posts: 874

truando wrote:
Today, after not being able to review yesterday, I reviewed all of my due reps in 4 hours (!) and I am back at zero again.

I needed a lot of stamina to go through this, especially considering the bad retention.

But now I feel better. This was a very crucial moment and I was close to quitting the whole RTK thing. Today was key.

This forum helped me a lot. Thanks!

Well done!
Remember it'll become easier as you go by.
Near the end, you'll be able to do 150 cards/hour (writing included).
And don't be afraid, the retention will go even lower.

Keep making good, personal stories. When a story is good, and I can see the image, it's like something clicks in my brain, and I know I'm going to know the kanji (even if I fail at first). Look for this clic and try to see how your mind works. The clic makes the retention higher (test it, you'll see).

Last edited by EratiK (2010 September 17, 5:14 pm)

WolfOfCampscapel Member

From: Oslo Norway Registered: 2010-09-22 Posts: 17

Whee!

At 52 after the first few days. Feeling good so far (obviously).

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breakies Member

From: France Registered: 2009-07-17 Posts: 46

I would like some advice.
I've started RTK1 in July 09, and I was advancing slowly but surely (something like 20kanji/week).But due to lots of work and exhaustion, I didn't learn or review regularly for the last three months
I've learnt some 1300 kanji, I've 600+ kanji to review and my error rate is something like 50%.

I would really be disappointed to have worked so much and give up now. I don't have a lot of time - but it's better now than the last three months - and my motivation is quite low.

I try to review a lot during week-ends, with sessions of 60 kanji to review, re-studying and reviewing the failed ones, do another 60 kanji etc...but the trouble is, the number of kanji systematically comes back to 600+ the next week-end. @__@

What do I think I should do now ? Try to vanquish my 600+ kanji in a minimum of rows ? Restart again ?

Last edited by breakies (2010 September 26, 1:45 pm)

EratiK Member

From: Paris Registered: 2010-07-15 Posts: 874

Hey breakies.
Sorry to hear that...

A logical suggestion would be to review daily and not just during weekends (this way you feel less the impact through daily routine).

I understood you stop adding: continue not to until most of your cards are in stack 4: by then the reviews are every two weeks, so that should give you a breather to decrease your error rate. At around 75%, reps are done quite quickly, so your motivation will come back all by itself because you will then be bored and you will want it to be other with so you'll start adding again.

Yeah, I had a burn out between 1300 & 1550. So hang in there. You're nearly out of trouble.

Last edited by EratiK (2010 September 26, 1:59 pm)

truando Member

From: I wish it was Japan Registered: 2010-07-19 Posts: 363 Website

My suggestion is this: get up 20 minutes earlier and get it done every morning before you leave for work.

Just 20 minutes, but every day... It'll do wonders.

You will feel great about yourself.

Daily rituals - the best thing for your Japanese!

You may also buy Anki for your phone (if you have an iphone) and review during the day in small chunks of 5 minutes. There's always 5 minutes here and there when you just waste time. Do that 6 times during the day and you have a total 30 minutes of review.

Ganbatte ne!

Anna B Member

From: Hawaii Registered: 2010-06-27 Posts: 71

@breakies: Since I, like you, have a really full life even without Japanese, and I'm doing RTK slowly, I'll tell you my experience in a similar situation.

When I started the first time I got to about 750 in three months, but then I had to stop for four months. When I was ready to start again, I asked for advice and someone mentioned RevTK Lite. I researched (both RTK Lite and RevTK Lite) in other threads on the forum and ultimately decided to start over again, but this time with RTKLite. (I opened a new account instead of deleting my old one, in case I changed my mind.) That was three months ago, and I'll be adding my last 30 cards next week.

Basically, RTKLite covers the kanji on the JLPT 2 study list, and includes over 90% of the most frequently used kanji. A fuller explanation can be found on the threads, as well as various arguments for and against its use. For someone with my goals and time constraints, it was the perfect answer, and I can see good results as I move into reading native Japanese material.

I found that the kanji I'd studied the first time went very quickly, and that my retention of them was surprisingly good, which was a real boost to keep me going and enthused when I first restarted. Also, my previous experience had helped refine the way I studied, and it was more efficient and effective the second time around. The only thing I would do differently is not add so many cards at a time. Since I had more time available, I got in the habit of adding 40 cards at a time. Even though I didn't add cards every day, it's made my reviews pretty large, which is OK if I can review, but if I miss a few days the review and restudy stacks get pretty daunting.

If you're interested, this is the thread that started the work on RTK Lite http://forum.koohii.com/viewtopic.php?id=1025&p=1 and the complete list is in post #183.

Korvar Member

From: Scotland Registered: 2009-09-09 Posts: 37 Website

truando wrote:
You may also buy Anki for your phone (if you have an iphone) and review during the day in small chunks of 5 minutes. There's always 5 minutes here and there when you just waste time. Do that 6 times during the day and you have a total 30 minutes of review.

You can also use the iAnki plugin, even if that's a bit fiddly to set up. That's what I did, and what truando says is so true - there are all these little "dead" times in my day when I can just get out my iPod and do some reps. I barely have to schedule specific study times at all, except at weekends when I don't have to travel in to work!

breakies Member

From: France Registered: 2009-07-17 Posts: 46

Thanks for you kind messages and encouragements.

For the moment, I'm trying to vainquish my 600+ kanji moutain...I've heavily reduced its head during two 100-kanji-nights and I'm reviewing and re-studying a bit every day. For the moment, it's 'just' 400 kanji, lower pile since I don't know how many time ^^'.

I don't have one of those Apple toys for the moment...but since I drive to go to work, I wouldn't be able to review so much during the week. But I've discovered that Ipod Touch was a bit like the phone without being a phone, and I wonder if I'm not tempted to buy one of them to study about stupid subjects like kanji or anatomy or astronomy thanks to Anki everywhere. :]

I'll let you know the situation and consider RTK lite as a second solution if the first is impossible

Last edited by breakies (2010 September 29, 4:21 pm)

toekutr New member

From: California Registered: 2010-07-05 Posts: 4

After a short RTK hiatus I'm back in the game @ frame 300.

Give me encouragement to keep me going

gyuujuice Member

From: USA Registered: 2008-09-24 Posts: 828

2000 kanji is quite the feat. Sometimes it just seems impossible, but look how far you have came so far. Before starting Japanese did you think you could learn 100-300 kanji the first week? I didn't use heisig until I reach the "peak point" of 350 kanji. I was desperate with kanji and I never thought I would cover 50 kanji a day.

On a side note. I signed up for the JLPT2 and I am freaking out! I have gotten halfway through 完全マスター but I don't think I will pull through... Can I learn all the grammar in a month and a half? T__T (泣)

Asriel Member

From: 東京 Registered: 2008-02-26 Posts: 1343

I hear ya gyuujuice!
I'm signed up for JLPT N1 this year, and taking the maximum amount of credits I can, I have no time to study japanese anymore! I can't remember the last time I added a card to anki!

I'm pretty sure I'm going to fail the test, but I figured I'll never pass if i don't take it

gyuujuice Member

From: USA Registered: 2008-09-24 Posts: 828

Last week I had a tournament (Sat). This week I have to take the SAT and I have a senior culmination project (Sat). And I am visiting colleges every Saturday of this month. XD

So I have been putting Japanese on the side, especially on weekends. Maybe I should do JOI again? http://www.japonin.com/level-intermediate.php

But I'm not going to let myself fail. 1000 kanji is not a big deal -- I am just focusing on kanji through vocabulary. I have to memorise another 100 grammar points and a LOT of vocabulary though.

EratiK Member

From: Paris Registered: 2010-07-15 Posts: 874

@truando:
Ah! the three-quarter life crisis...
がんばってよ!!!

truando Member

From: I wish it was Japan Registered: 2010-07-19 Posts: 363 Website

EratiK wrote:
@truando:
Ah! the three-quarter life crisis...
がんばってよ!!!

How do you know I'm suffering from it? Did I mention that?? Or did you feel my vibe?

Man, it's really hard right now. At 1490, aiming for 1531. Motivation moving down to nearly zylch. Some tough words in there. They mingle with the rest. Mingle. I know that one...

Thanks. Your post might help...

EDIT: ah, you've got it from the I'm finished thread... I forgot about that.

Last edited by truando (2010 October 16, 11:09 pm)

EratiK Member

From: Paris Registered: 2010-07-15 Posts: 874

Small tip:
to avoid confusing keywords that look alike, I have a special sheet where I write them (only the keywords) down regrouped by theme, and sorted by learning order: by remembering which one I learn first, I remember the specific connotations I associated with each.

For example: rank, class, grade
or, cape, promontory, headland
etc.

Hope you can come up with something of your own if this doesn't work.
Good luck!

Last edited by EratiK (2010 October 17, 7:28 am)

truando Member

From: I wish it was Japan Registered: 2010-07-19 Posts: 363 Website

Excellent tip! I'll start an excel sheet at once.

Thanks!

Just made it to 1531!

安心しました！

Last edited by truando (2010 October 17, 9:50 am)

Tori-kun このやろう

Registered: 2010-08-27 Posts: 1193 Website

I'm stuck at 1920 at the moment.. -_- Seeing how much i mastered already is boosting sometimes but right now i just the restly 140 kanjis starring at me teasingly, which discourages me absolutely.. It's difficult to invent stories and create pictures sometimes to keywords and RevTK is not useful as my level of english is still too bad to understand some keywords (which are sometimes different in the english language, compared to the german edition of RTK1).. Uah, i just want to finish of and not to give in, just a few meters before the fin~

truando Member

From: I wish it was Japan Registered: 2010-07-19 Posts: 363 Website

Tori-kun - you'll make it!

You speak German? Me too. My mother tongues are German and French but I use the English version if RTK.

What I do is this.

I use the following homepages to help with keywords I don't understand 100%:

Here I look at the meanings, then look for compounds to check how the Kanji is used:
http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi- … dic.cgi?1B

Here I look for synonyms or definitions:
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wiktionary:Main_Page

And for stroke order if I'm not sure:
http://www.yamasa.cc/members/ocjs/kanji … 3?OpenForm

I then adjust the keywords to words I understand, after checking on RevTK if they are used later to avoid confusion. Seems to work well. Didn't run into problems so far.

Sometimes I use a short explanation behind the keyword, e.g. "promontory - a high point of land extending into a body of water"

I use Anki, so that helps. When I have a group of Kanji with the same primitive, I may adjust the primitive so it works for the whole group. For example the grass skirt primitive I changed to a bungalow in Thailand that I once wanted to buy. Worked perfectly for frames 1527 through 1530.

Good luck!

Tori-kun このやろう

Registered: 2010-08-27 Posts: 1193 Website

The mass of kanjis appearing throughout the book sometimes having a.. rather cryptic keyword (i do not know even in my mother tongue! never heard of words like 'Bierseidel', heh?!) are difficult to jump 'just' over, you know. You cannot skip a few Kanjis, that'd mean you did not absolve Rtk1 successfully... I guess i am out of the woods once again here -_-

@truando: well, having french, german and english as mother tongues seems to be rather useful and you at least have the possibility to play with your language skills already with the heisig book, don't you. I just wish you a boost, like i got it on my holidays now, i'm 17, and good luck - you will make it, too! It's just so well possible as you see here in the forums posted already on 26 pages. Thanks for your motivational words~

adoette Member

From: B-ham, Alabama USA Registered: 2010-09-21 Posts: 64

How is it I spend so much time lurking on these forums, and still manage to miss threads like this?

Sitting here, staring, angrily, at 400. Stupid men with their ten eyes and their demolition.

Oddly enough, I was reading through the earlier parts of this thread and where someone was having trouble with chastise/admonish/rebuke.

I have trouble with admonish for some reason, but not the others. I don't get them confused, it's just so weird. 'Awe' doesn't come with a strong mental image.

One came from nowhere. Anyone else seen waay too many Disney movies? If you've ever seen Mulan (very good movie) you may remember this scene from the beginning. Mulan goes to the matchmaker (a very scary woman) and is ordered to 'Recite the Final Admonition'.

Oh god. I will never get the dragon lady's face off the taskmaster primitive now. I think I'll use Disney from now on. Don't know why it's never occured.

You people give good ideas and inspiration without meaning to! What better place to learn.

Tori-kun このやろう

Registered: 2010-08-27 Posts: 1193 Website

adoette, i guess throughout the book i experienceded this problem as well.. You mentioned this (some ppl might consider watching Mulan and various types of other Disney movies as 'childish' de facto, i do not) movie you watched. Watch films, look at pictures and maybe even watch news on television to be on the actual state and combine Kanjis with stories (and resulting intense pictures) with actual stuff, like the rescue act in chile of the mine workers taking so long, or the worm in the gouverneur's dish in russia while havin buffet with the russian president..

Get something to pleasure yourself (in which way ever~) for your 400 Kanjis it's already a lot an certainly more than people who have no idea about these "heroglyphs" and you *will* for your own sake finish it, like me, like any other guy wrote into the "I mastered RtK1!" thread. Just believe it and take breaks, maybe combine two kanjis if you feel safe enough to create an even more powerful picture in your mind.

Good luck and you'll get it!!

Raschaverak Member

From: Hungary Registered: 2008-12-30 Posts: 362

**** this. I'm ditching japanese for good. Gonna have to find an easier language to master, I'm afraid.....

truando Member

From: I wish it was Japan Registered: 2010-07-19 Posts: 363 Website

That's too bad...

I heard Hungarian was quite difficult - you mastered that, didn't you? And English...

Give it another chance!

EratiK Member

From: Paris Registered: 2010-07-15 Posts: 874

Raschaverak wrote:
**** this. I'm ditching japanese for good. Gonna have to find an easier language to master, I'm afraid.....

Sorry to hear that...
How far have you come? If you've invested much time, why quit?
Any JLPT?

And Japanese is difficult, but not that much (I'm learning Czech (7 declensions & 4 genders) right now (mandatory third language for my course (I showed up late)).
If you're wiling to quit, there's the last resort:
move to Japan tomorrow. You'll do physical types of work, but in 3 years max, you'll be talking.

Anyway, good luck for whatever's next.

Last edited by EratiK (2010 October 19, 4:55 pm)

Index » RtK Volume 1

truando wrote:

truando wrote:

EratiK wrote:

Raschaverak wrote: