Check out my post in the essential resources thread:

http://forum.koohii.com/viewtopic.php?id=480&p=2

I have it on good authority that Shirakawa Shizuka is the man to reference when it comes to etymology theory.

I watched a program on TV recently talking about how he overturned the generally accepted etymology for the pinnacle primitive (as in the radical in 陽 and others). Everyone thought that it represented a hill as Heisig describes. After some heavy research, Mr. Shirakawa came to the conclusion that the primitive actually represents a stairway that god descends from heaven. Some of the more original forms of the primitive have more bits jutting out and it does look like a stairway or a ladder. It sounded a bit odd to begin with but the more I watched, the more it made sense.

Last edited by wrightak (2008 March 18, 10:33 pm)

pm215 wrote:

Interesting recommendation, wrightak -- I've put it on my maybe-buy list.

I've never heard of a maybe-buy list. Obviously didn't sell it to you well enough!

Henshall's etymology for the pinnacle primitive is "from a pictograph of a terraced slope", incidentally. Dunno whether he knew Shirakawa's theory and discarded it or if it was a later development (the book was written in 1988).

I don't know for sure, but I don't think he was aware of Shirakawa's theory. I'm told that even the leading scholars in China recognise Shirakawa as the premier authority on kanji origins. Of course the information I'm receiving may be exaggerated but I don't think by too much, if at all.

I bought Henshall a long time ago and I wouldn't rate it much better than average now. Unfortunately it's the only English book on etymology that I know of. Since it was written in 1988, it's certainly in severe danger of being outdated. The book I referred to in the essential resources thread was printed in 2003.

pm215 wrote:

I don't suppose I could persuade you to quote a sample, could I? The entry for 楽 (MUSIC), say...

Good idea. A bit of a pain, but a good idea. Here's the entry for 楽, with my hasty translation after it. The book also has a series of pictures showing how the character evolved from earlier forms. I must say, the image of the bell is very clear in these earlier forms. There is quite a lot of furigana since it is meant for school children.

楽　13画　（樂）15画
ガク・ラク・ゴウ（ガウ）
たのしい・たのしむ・おんがく・このむ

解説
象形。もとの字は樂に作り、柄のある手鈴の形。白の部分が鈴、その左右の幺は糸飾り。もと舞楽のときにこれを振って神を楽しませるように使用した。また病気のとき、シャーマン（神がかりの状態となって予言や病気を治すことなどを行う巫女 ）がこれを振って病魔を祓ったので、病気を治すことをりょう**という。療はのちに作られた形声の字である。「おんがく」の意味のときにはガク、「たのしむ」の意味のときにはラク、「このむ」の意味のときにはゴウの音でよむ。

用例
楽曲　音楽のふし　／舞楽　舞を伴う音楽　／楽天　天命を楽しむこと。また、のんきなこと　／行楽　観光などに出かけて楽しむこと　／楽好（ごうこう）　愛好すること

Explanation
Pictograph. The original character was written as 樂, in the shape of a bell with a handle. The white part is the bell and the 幺（よう） on either side are the decorative threads. Originally, one would shake the bell during the Bugaku*, thus rejoicing in the glory of god. Additionally, the bell was used by shamans (a priestess who would enter a state of being possessed and cure ill omens and illnesses). The shamans would wave the bell and this would expel the curse of the disease. In the case of curing illnesses, the character ** is used.  The character 療, of type keisei***, was subsequently created. When 楽 is used to mean 'music', the reading ガク is used. For the meaning of 'enjoyment', ラク is used, and for the meaning of 'liking', ゴウ.

Examples
楽曲　a piece of music　／舞楽　music that accompanies the dancing in the Bugaku　／楽天　Enjoying one's fate, or being optimistic　／行楽　Going sightseeing and enjoying it　／楽好（ごうこう）　to like or to love

*bugaku; traditional Japanese court music accompanied by dancing
** I couldn't type this character in. It's got the sickness primitive on the outside and 樂 on the inside.
*** Keisei; one of six types of Chinese character, comprising a semantic and a phonetic element

Last edited by wrightak (2008 March 19, 10:16 pm)

wrightak wrote:

Good idea. A bit of a pain, but a good idea.

Thanks for taking the time to do that; very interesting.

it is meant for school children

Does he censor the etymology for characters like 色 ? :-)

Ryuujin27 wrote:

I absolutely can not wait to be fluent enough so I can read this book. I love etymology, and I love kanji. So what could possibly be better?

I don't know what level you're at but I wouldn't be put off trying to challenge yourself. I find that it's always the case that when I glance at a chunk of Japanese text, it looks impenetrable but when I get into it, it's not too bad. For this book, the vocab is quite obscure but the grammar is pretty easy.

There is this site I found wwwkanjinetworks.com
Looks like a sunstantial list but i'm rather poor at taking in information that's not in a book.