comeauch wrote:

There's a new video from JapanChannelDotCom today about how Japanese people generally don't want to see or hear negative things:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNGSaeFgLME

I've never been to Japan, so I don't know how much true this is, but watching anime and movies (lol, this is sad), it seems like there might be some truth in it. The main character is pretty much always either positive or turns into someone positive. I really don't mean to say I'm judging Japan from animes and movies lol so to those of you who lived there for a while, what is experience with this? How did you put up with this?

Also, I do like slightly ironic/depressed/cynical people and stories. Do you know any films/anime/novels/drama featuring a main character or a plot like that? Oh, and I mean, sure, there are a lot of cases (like Nodame Cantabile or Zetsubou-Sensei) where the guy is not all-smiles, but then again, there's always the other part (Nodame, Kafuka) without whom there'd be no story (and the overall feel of those is mainly positive). Plus their negativity is way exaggerated/funny. Aren't there any cool antiheroes?

If you're wanting some feel-bad stuff to watch/read, I'd recommend something like Evangelion or Saikano.  End of Evangelion in particular is the most depressing movie I've ever watched.  Naturally I've seen it at least 30 times. Welcome to the NHK!, Hellgirl, Another, Monster (the premise is is that the very positive and upstanding protagonist has his life utterly ruined because he did the right thing), and Requiem for the Phantom are all quite dark, and stay that way the whole course of the show.
I'm like you in that I don't always want to watch stuff that's sunshine and rainbows.  There are lots of Japanese series out there that are quite gloomy and depressing, you just have to know where to look.

At first, thanks for making this thread, I watched that video earlier today and the topic is very interesting so I though about making a thread here, and here you are!

I'd like to add that I'm all ears not only for those who's been to Japan, but also for those who had contact with Japanese people, what do you think about the Japanese view of complaining, criticism and negativity in general? Is it really as stated in the video? (They hate it and aren't negative because it bothers other people).

I don't think it's just about negativity. I generally think controlling your emotions is very important in Japan and a sign of maturity and emotional strength. This is something that my husband and I talk about a lot. I am a "typical" "emotional" American and I often find that I have to control my emotions much more here than I would in America.

I remember one time I was out with my husband's family and my little nephew who was maybe 3 or 4 at the time wanted a toy and started to cry because there wasn't one where we were and my sister-in-law said, "我慢できる？" and he literally held his tears in and stopped himself from crying and I was just amazed. I can't imagine ever seeing a little American kid doing that.

I know these are just broad generalizations but...

Last edited by thistime (2012 November 04, 6:33 pm)

Yeah, I've seen that. Don't take it too literally - I feel he states the position too strongly. It's a thing, yeah, but it's not an all-pervasive thing.
And, y'know - if someone asks me 'how's it going?' in Australia, I normally won't pour out my heart either. It would be rude.

It's funny, actually, because a lot of Japanese people misunderstand that 'how are you?' doesn't really mean a literal 'how are you?'. If you always answer 'I'm tired/hungry/unhappy/whatever' to what's a simple conversation starter people are going to stop asking you. It took me a long time to stop my high school students from telling me about how tired they are at the beginning of each class.

Negative Japanese manga certainly isn't hard to come by. Try Oyasumi Punpun, Freesia, or Bokurano.

Japanese people tend to be much more negative in outlook than Americans, but they're much less outspoken about their outlooks. Fatalism is almost pervasive in the society, especially with the younger generation raised in the Lost Decade. The outwardly positive appearance has a lot to do with 建前/本音 (appearances/true feelings) and 和 (harmony).

In the West, a great point of comparison to Japanese social customs is the atmosphere at a cocktail party. In such a situation, when someone asks, "How are your wife and kids?", the appropriate response is something like "They're doing great! As always, my wife is lovely and my kids are adorable! How about yours?" Answering along the lines of "My wife is a unfaithful harlot and my children are undisciplined scoundrels" would be a shocking breach of etiquette. Think of social interaction in Japan as a constant cocktail party, where the appearances of polite society are rigidly maintained.

comeauch wrote:

but watching anime and movies (lol, this is sad), it seems like there might be some truth in it. The main character is pretty much always either positive or turns into someone positive.

This isn't true at all. If anything don't take it literally.

Chigun wrote:

uisukii wrote:

have you seen the "Welcome to the NHK" anime adaptation?

I second this. Not to spoil anything, but the mid-to-latter part of this anime struck me as profound and deeply moving. Some people are turned off during the first few episodes, but more's the pity to them for missing out.

It stands as one of the most thought-provoking shows I've seen, personally.

Also if someone needs a genre, I guess dark comedy and slice of life hits around the mark. I once had an acquaintance who complained all through the first two episodes because he couldn't "get" what genre it was supposed to be. Cue my shaking head.

Peace.

I watched it semi-recently while going through a suicidally low bought of depression, my situation almost uncannily like the main character, only without the metaphorical aid from a certain someone, and support from a close friend. Probably the "hardest" thing I've watched in my life- also one of the things which help me get through that period. Don't think I'm strong enough at the moment to re-watch it, but yeah- an incredibly thought provoking and I think above all (if you can get through it) overwhelmingly hopeful and grounding series.


Spoilers: some of the comments in this youtube clip of one of the songs in the OST are an example of how much this series has effected how people view the world:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4VN0in4weA



/sidetrack

The whole reason happy cute culture thrives is because it's an escape from everyday depressing reality and the stress of being 受験生/仕事人間/forever alone. Depression and pessimism are rife in Japan, as it's a high-stress environment (if you follow the crowd anyways) and there is inadequate mental health care. ...hence the high suicide rate.

The original Welcome to NHK novel has great writing, I recommend it highly. The manga can be skipped.

Last edited by Jarvik7 (2012 November 05, 7:09 pm)

comeauch wrote:

Also, I do like slightly ironic/depressed/cynical people and stories. Do you know any films/anime/novels/drama featuring a main character or a plot like that?

You're kidding right? There are thousands of them.

I can name like 50 depressing mangas off the top of my head.

Last edited by Realism (2012 November 06, 1:54 pm)

There are plenty of Japanese living outside the structure, to an extend, and are viewed in a similar light as gaijin. The more "creative" people tend to end up this way: artists, some musicians, writers, people who go abroad, etc. generally Japanese who openly express themselves and/or embrace Western cultures. Chances are in the more suburban, gaijin/foreigner dense areas, those Japanese who are pretty easy when it comes to approaching (as in they are open to the idea of being friendly to a stranger or even outgoing enough to approach you) are more likely to be part of those growing number of Japanese who have become jaded with the social system and decided to step out of it (as much as a Japanese really can).

The Japanese who stick to the unspoken of social rules "oldschool style", generally speaking, probably wont be the ones who will allow you an opening to become part of their circle.

weirdo wrote:

Japanese people don't want to hear negativity?

I think someone hasn't seen Japanese tabloids or Japanese net users (the worst).

I think it's not that Japanese people don't want to hear negativity, but it's what the culture enforces on people to be expected to comply or else, as someone else wrote, get out of "the circle".

I haven't read this anywhere, but after exploring the Japanese culture and society , even if through the Internet, I've noticed that, it's like hidden in plain sight.

In this video, they directly give the yearly number of suicides in Japan, so it seems it's not 100% they don't say negative things on TV.

Last edited by undead_saif (2012 November 07, 10:14 am)

Depends on the person. Some hate hearing you moan and complain while others couldn't care less.
I will however say there is a general dislike towards negativity when in conversation and this is due to the fact that Japanese people always try to put others first. Talking about how bad your day is or how you hate something/someone is rude because you're focusing on your own problems instead of taking into consideration the feelings of the other party. Hearing negative things doesn't bother them but when you don't avoid it they will assume you don't care about the way they feel and possibly label you as rude (unless you're good friends)--that is where the problem lies. So steer clear of it if you can. Until you know it's okay to complain to the person you're talking to you should probably stay positive just to be "polite".
As far as TV is concerned they probably couldn't care less (none of my friends anyway). They can always turn it off.

Last edited by Crispy (2012 November 07, 11:43 pm)