why does Japan suck so much at Olympics?

Index » 喫茶店 (Koohii Lounge)

Reply #26 - 2012 August 02, 5:34 am
midonnay Member
From: australia Registered: 2011-12-20 Posts: 54

financialwar wrote:

wow, so many idiots on this forum, basically the reason that Japan suck so much at the Olympics is because everyone else is cheating with no evidence.

40 chinese swimmers got caught doping in the 90's

the former team doctor admitted that they were doping back then under state control...

I'm sorry but innuendo comes with the territory.

Last edited by midonnay (2012 August 02, 5:35 am)

Reply #27 - 2012 August 02, 5:55 am
financialwar Banned
From: Sydney Registered: 2012-07-25 Posts: 38

midonnay wrote:

financialwar wrote:

wow, so many idiots on this forum, basically the reason that Japan suck so much at the Olympics is because everyone else is cheating with no evidence.

40 chinese swimmers got caught doping in the 90's

the former team doctor admitted that they were doping back then under state control...

I'm sorry but innuendo comes with the territory.

yes in the 90s, last time I checked it's 2012

Reply #28 - 2012 August 02, 6:08 am
midonnay Member
From: australia Registered: 2011-12-20 Posts: 54

Li Zhesi

world champion relayer tested positive for EPO just before the London Olympics.

EPO apparently only stays in your body for like 20 hours so they were lucky to catch her. (most of the testing is done during the Olympics and other competitions so most cheaters do it in the off-season dodging WADA officials)

Its no different to the Americans and track and field....

once your country has gone through such a period of shame you lose the benefit of the doubt imo.

Last edited by midonnay (2012 August 02, 6:10 am)

Advertising (register and sign in to hide this)
JapanesePod101 Sponsor
 
Reply #29 - 2012 August 02, 6:29 am
financialwar Banned
From: Sydney Registered: 2012-07-25 Posts: 38

she was caught be the Chinese authority and was dropped out of the team. This shows that it was an individual act that has nothing to do with the Chinese Olympics as a whole.

so go read your fact probably.

Reply #30 - 2012 August 02, 6:36 am
Necrojesta Member
From: England Registered: 2012-06-12 Posts: 137

If China caught her, I guess we can drop the government backing angle.

Reply #31 - 2012 August 02, 7:09 am
dizmox Member
Registered: 2007-08-11 Posts: 1149

I wish athletes would just participate on behalf of planet Earth and stop making this into a stupid competition to see which country is "the best".

Reply #32 - 2012 August 02, 7:18 am
pen0id Member
Registered: 2011-04-18 Posts: 29

dizmox wrote:

I wish athletes would just participate on behalf of planet Earth and stop making this into a stupid competition to see which country is "the best".

*I would also be better for Japan to quit being a "top exporter of gold" despite having nearly zero resources (natural) of it.

Reply #33 - 2012 August 02, 7:35 am
qwertyytrewq Member
From: Gall Bladder Registered: 2011-10-18 Posts: 529

financialwar wrote:

why are you bring GB and Poland into discussion?

financialwar wrote:

you need to improve your English and your logic.

financialwar wrote:

wow, so many idiots on this forum,

If you continue posting on these forums in the same manner as you have been doing so till now, you are quickly becoming the same thing you accuse others of (an idiot).

financialwar wrote:

basically the reason that Japan suck so much at the Olympics is because everyone else is cheating with no evidence.

Basically, the forum has provided several reasons which you ignored in order to make the above statement.

financialwar wrote:

why are you bring GB and Poland into discussion? They are not Eastern Asian, they're not even Asian. Genetically we can't compare them with Japanese. Hence why I choose China, the Koreans.

Okay, how about India, they're Asians right? That's more interesting than Japan. With a population similar to China's how come they're not bringing in the medals?

Reply #34 - 2012 August 02, 7:37 am
qwertyytrewq Member
From: Gall Bladder Registered: 2011-10-18 Posts: 529

financialwar wrote:

as of today,

China      17 Gold,
S. Korea  6 Gold
N. Korea  4 Gold
Japan      2 Gold

GDP Per capita, Japan is highest in Asia, why does Japan suck at sport so much?

One flaw of this "analysis": you are comparing an absolute measure (total gold medals) with a relative measure (GDP per capita). If we're going to have a good analysis, we'll need to do a per capita measure of medals as well.

http://www.medalspercapita.com/

First we will compare two variables: the population of a country and the total amount of medals (gold, silver and bronze).
http://www.medalspercapita.com/#medals-per-capita:2012

Rank    Country    Medals    Population    Population per Medal
13    South Korea    12    48,580,000    4,048,333
15    North Korea    5    24,052,231    4,810,446
26    Japan    17    127,650,000    7,508,823
42    China    30    1,347,350,000    44,911,666

Here, Japan isn't doing so bad. China however, does suck. Under this measure, China needs about 180 medals to match Japan's performance (Japan is 6 times better than China). The gap between the Koreas and Japan is less, they are about twice as good as Japan (Japan needs about 26 medals to match the Koreas).

Second: The population and gold medals.
http://www.medalspercapita.com/#golds-per-capita:2012
Rank    Country    Gold Medals    Population    Population per Gold Medal
6    North Korea    4    24,052,231    6,013,057
7    South Korea    6    48,580,000    8,096,666
19    Japan    2    127,650,000    63,825,000
21    China    17    1,347,350,000    79,255,882

Again, the Koreas lead the Asian countries. The distance between the Koreas and Japan is also similar. However, under the gold medal measure, China almost catches up to Japan. This measure and the above may indicates that there is more Olympic medal equality in Japan than China. Similarly, this is reflected in Japanese and Chinese society: income inequality is less in Japan (which is a good thing) compared to China, where there is more income inequality. This means that China shows more extremes of the wealth gap, with dirt-poor subsistence farmers (or Gold Medal winners) on one side and corrupt government bureaucrats (or those lacking medals) on the other. Basically, think of the bell curve.

Third: The GDP of a country and total medals
http://www.medalspercapita.com/#medals-by-gdp:2012
Rank    Country    Medals    GDP1    GDP per Medal
1    North Korea    5    22.00    4.40
16    South Korea    12    1116.25    93.02
27    China    30    7298.10    243.27
36    Japan    17    5867.15    345.13

Here's an interesting measure. Usually, we would assume that rich high GDP countries would spend money on sporting facilities and the training of athletes. So why is Japan placed so low? That's because that is a poor assumption. Sure, we can argue that there is a positive correlation between the GDP of a country and the amount of medals that country wins. However, we don't actually know where the money is being spent and how much. Maybe a rich country simply doesn't care about sports or doesn't have the sports culture that other countries have? Unlike the above measures, this one is of dubious value.

Now I'll comment on each country:

Japan: In terms of total medals per capita, they're doing the best out of the 100 million+ population countries like USA and China. This just goes to show the Japanese brand of equality: instead of letting a few win Gold, they prefer more to win Silver and Bronze. No one leaves empty-handed is their motto. Furthermore, unlike USA, Japan lacks their enthusiasm/craziness for sport. And unlike China, Japan lacks their ultra-nationalism. All these things considered, we can conclude that contrary to the OP's belief, Japan's Olympic performance isn't so bad. In fact, it's quite good indeed.

Rating: B+

China: A pretty lackluster performance. With their inferiority complex and their desire to impress the international community along with their ultra-nationalism that rivals the likes of even the most patriot Americans, I expected a better performance. Even the docile "I don't care about sports like the Americans and Chinese" Japanese managed to beat China Gold Medal per Capita. The difference is even more stark on the Total Medal per Capita measure. If China doesn't want to look like a fool, they need more Gold Medals, and not just gold, but silver and bronze as well. The divide between the Haves and Have-Nots in Chinese society is huge. Similarly, the divide between the Have-Medals and Have-No-Medals is just as huge.

Rating: C

South Korea: A surprise showing indeed. Japan and South Korea are similar in many ways but in the Olympics, South Korea proves that they have more than just crappily manufactured K-Pop to give to the world. South Korea convincingly beats both Japan and China in terms of Total Medals per Capita and Gold Medals per Capita. It's hard to find any fault in their performance... except for one thing. They have been overshadowed by North Korea.

Rating: A

North Korea: If South Korea was a surprise showing, then North Korea was a surprise nuclear explosion. It would appear that they were more successful than USA and China in converting their ultra-nationalism and their love for the Dear Leader into Gold Medals. What we ignorant Westerners thought was a poor destitute country was in fact a training ground for today's (and tomorrow's) Olympians. North Korea has proven that at the 2012 Olympics, they are in fact, the superior Korea.

Olympic Performance Rating: A+

Human Rights Performance Rating: F. I'm sorry but while North Korea's Gold Medal accumulation was certainly impressive, their country still sucks and I think it's a fact that shouldn't simply be forgotten or ignored. If only they put in as much effort into alleviating poverty...

Last edited by qwertyytrewq (2012 August 02, 7:39 am)

Reply #35 - 2012 August 02, 7:47 am
JimmySeal Member
From: Kyoto Registered: 2006-03-28 Posts: 2279

Don't feed the troll, folks.

Reply #36 - 2012 August 02, 7:48 am
financialwar Banned
From: Sydney Registered: 2012-07-25 Posts: 38

out of the four nations, Japan is the only one that's going backwards in terms of gold medal counts.

Reply #37 - 2012 August 02, 7:52 am
qwertyytrewq Member
From: Gall Bladder Registered: 2011-10-18 Posts: 529

financialwar wrote:

out of the four nations, Japan is the only one that's going backwards in terms of gold medal counts.

And how did you come up with that conclusion?

Also, how does Japan "going backwards in terms of gold medal counts" (assuming that statement is true and verifiable) have any relation to how they are performing right now?

Last edited by qwertyytrewq (2012 August 02, 7:54 am)

Reply #38 - 2012 August 02, 7:55 am
frony0 Member
From: London United Kingdom Registered: 2011-12-10 Posts: 257

financialwar wrote:

out of the four nations, Japan is the only one that's going backwards in terms of gold medal counts.

To use your own words against you: you need to improve your English and your logic.

In the English language, sentences begin with capital letters. You are not exempt. As for logic, your arguments have already been proven to be null, mostly on grounds of data misrepresentation and misinterpretation.

Reply #39 - 2012 August 02, 8:06 am
financialwar Banned
From: Sydney Registered: 2012-07-25 Posts: 38

qwertyytrewq wrote:

And how did you come up with that conclusion?

Data from the last 3 Summer and Winter Olympics games.

summer Gold medal count

China: 28 32 51
S Kor: 8 9 13
N Kor: 0 0 2 4
Japan:5 16 9

winter Gold medal count

China: 2 2 5
S Kor: 2 6 6
N Kor: 0 0 0
Japan:0 1 0

As you can see from the data, Japan is the only nation from the four East Asia Nations compared that declined in the last Olympics.

Last edited by financialwar (2012 August 02, 8:13 am)

Reply #40 - 2012 August 02, 8:12 am
nadiatims Member
Registered: 2008-01-10 Posts: 1676

dizmox wrote:

I wish athletes would just participate on behalf of planet Earth and stop making this into a stupid competition to see which country is "the best".

couldn't agree more. It's just one big international pissing contest basically. I also hate that athletes in many (most?) nations are supported at least partially by the tax payer.

Reply #41 - 2012 August 02, 8:29 am
dizmox Member
Registered: 2007-08-11 Posts: 1149

And we have to waste billions in some stupid arms race to see which country can get a guy to run around a track a few milliseconds faster than everyone else or something equally meaningless...

Reply #42 - 2012 August 02, 8:36 am
blackbrich Member
From: America Registered: 2010-06-06 Posts: 300

PSA

JimmySeal wrote:

Don't feed the troll, folks.

My sentiments after I posted.

Reply #43 - 2012 August 02, 8:37 am
Necrojesta Member
From: England Registered: 2012-06-12 Posts: 137

It gives a lot of people something to talk about and be patriotic about so why not? I'm not patriotic myself, I don't care either way, but some do appreciate the olympics even though they were sceptical before.

Reply #44 - 2012 August 02, 8:47 am
nadiatims Member
Registered: 2008-01-10 Posts: 1676

I'd have zero objection to it if it were funded without using any tax-payer dollars. I'd still think it's stupid but I would have zero business objecting to it.

Reply #45 - 2012 August 02, 9:23 am
JimmySeal Member
From: Kyoto Registered: 2006-03-28 Posts: 2279

The games also have a bad habit of bankrupting their host cities.  After reading this article, I can barely think of any reason why a city would want that "honor."
http://www.cracked.com/article_19733_5- … mpics.html

Reply #46 - 2012 August 02, 9:51 am
IceCream Closed Account
Registered: 2009-05-08 Posts: 3124

well, not everything in the world has to be about business and profit making. I'm really glad that stuff like this happens, in the same way as i believe that supporting arts is a really good thing, even if it is expensive. It makes our lives richer in a lot of ways.

Saying that, i'm really not bothered about the country aspect either, it would be fine by me to not have it at all. I also wish the commentators were better.

Japan seems to get a medal in everything i've watched, i don't think they're doing badly.

Last edited by IceCream (2012 August 02, 9:52 am)

Reply #47 - 2012 August 02, 10:37 am
nadiatims Member
Registered: 2008-01-10 Posts: 1676

where do you think the wealth comes from to pay for luxuries like sports/art/entertainment? Anyway people are free to and do pay for these things on a voluntary basis.

Nobody sponsors my hobbies.

Last edited by nadiatims (2012 August 02, 10:38 am)

Reply #48 - 2012 August 02, 10:50 am
IceCream Closed Account
Registered: 2009-05-08 Posts: 3124

The "wealth" comes from business under the capitalist system. That's because the capitalist system assumes that the only things that have value are things that can be given monetary value.

Just because it assigns certain things value and others not doesn't make it correct, imo. There are plenty of things that humans assign value that aren't valued in capitalist terms. So i don't see any good reason to only support things that can be valued in capitalist terms particularly.

Because of this, things like the olympics and various arts, cultural heritage, etc. would be impossible to pay for on a voluntary basis.

Nobody sponsors your hobbies because they only bring any great benefit to yourself. However, if you were among the best in the world at your hobby, it's likely you would be sponsored in some way (e.g. university position) so you would have the time to devote to it to bring benefit to others too.

Last edited by IceCream (2012 August 02, 10:51 am)

Reply #49 - 2012 August 02, 2:14 pm
KanjiMood Member
Registered: 2009-04-06 Posts: 132

I saw on my facebook a Konami employee won gold, I was like wtf, I'm guessing he's not a programmer but motion capture or something? http://www.konamisportsandlife.co.jp/en … 012/08/02/

Reply #50 - 2012 August 02, 2:29 pm
Necrojesta Member
From: England Registered: 2012-06-12 Posts: 137

Is he just sponsored by the company?