Background: I'm new on here and I've had an interest in learning Japanese for 10 or so years and have collected a few books on the topic. At one point I had gotten through #100, however didn't stick with it and so forgot over time.

My 7 year old daughter recently saw my books and wanted to learn, so we have gone through the first 2 lessons, which went pretty easily. She can write them and recall their keywords fairly easily.

Is there any advice for having someone of this age using this method? Obviously some words she's not familiar with in English, which gives me a good chance to help her grow her English vocabulary.

We've had discussions before on how valuble RTK1 would be for younger learners... pre-teens and such. But in the end we didn't know of anyone of that age doing it...

The only thing I can suggest is for keywords/primitives that are new to her, or that introduce new concepts, make sure she understands them before trying to make up a story. Use google images or something to show what it is, having a visual of something can make it easier to remember what it is, then tie that to the keyword.

Anyway, let us know how it goes. I'm quite interested to see how effective RTK1 is for young learners.

If she's only 7 she may not even need it. RTK is for people who need that 2000 kanji(and are past the age of doing it like Japanese kids), for reading anything. At 7, she wouldn't be reading that kind of stuff in English even.

I was about to say, "Why not?", but then I remember the whole abstract part of the RTK method.

Ultimately, that question is for you to answer: do you think your daughter could visualize stories and whatnot? Her success with the first two lessons isn't exactly noteworthy: the first few kanji are pretty simple and children learn extremely well. But, yeah, if she can handle it, go for it.

If she can do it, it would be pretty interesting how this turns out. And just Japanese in general would be good for the kid.

What yukamina says makes sense, too: kids are pretty plastic. Whatever.

Oh, yeah, welcome to the forums.

At age 7, isn't it possible she's still in the "golden age" of language acquisition?

She could probably learn/pick up a lot more of the language by exposure (be it cartoons, comics, etc). Then again, who knows. If she wants to try why not let her give Heisig a twirl?

It would be interesting to see how a child does with RTK. I think that it's possible, just that some keywords would be abstract and might need to be changed.

But would the book be useful at all? To make RTK worth it your daughter would have to learn Japanese up to a good level. Given the amount of time that it takes when you're not learning the language through exposure, she'd have to spend all her free time studying for the next few years. That's probably unhealthy. I think just teaching her basic Japanese along with basic kanjis would be more useful. But if it's just for fun, then why not?

RTK might work well with Japanese schoolchildren though. Since they already know very advanced Japanese (by our standards) by the time they're ten, they could really profit from it. I'm sure there would be a way to adapt RTK with japanese keywords suited to schoolchildren.

The technique of using mnemonics and visual imagery could be used to teach her simple kanji, but I think it's pointless to go through the entire book if there are no ways to reinforce what she's learning. Is she going to use a flashcard program to review them everyday? Is she going to start reading Japanese newspapers? I can't imagine any normal 7 year old doing that. Maybe she could do Remembering the Kana instead and start reading children's books, since children's books are oftentimes written only in hiragana.

I guess at such a young age it's more about if the child wants to do it. If she really wants to keep plugging through the book then why say she can't. But, like others above, I'd also try introducing basic Japanese so that there is a reason for learning the kanji. You could try learning household objects and then using them in daily life:

Pass the おさら please.
Do you want to do some more of the Heisig ほん today?

With children, the key to learning languages is to provide a need for them to use that language. But, keep it fun!

We actually have been mixing in some phrases from another book I have, also from the Kids Web Japan site at http://web-japan.org/kidsweb/

She's been the one who keeps coming back to wanting to do more from RTK. We haven't been moving too quickly since I don't have much time to work with her, but probably before we move on too much, we'll learn the kana's and apply those to the phrases we're learning.

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I'd say why not? If she was my daughter I'd let her learn whatever she wants to learn, the most important is that she enjoys whatever she's learning.

I wonder, does she write down the characters outside of studying RtK with you?

She might get an interest in calligraphy and develop artistic skills, and in that context, I don't think the time spent on RtK would be lost. At my calligraphy course there are quite a few children, most are girls She would get a good head start because of her affinity with the characters.

I say let her go for it. Japanese kids learn the Japanese way not because it's best, but because it's the one in place. I bet she can create rich imaginative worlds, and if she doesn't want to go all the way to the end, or keep studying Japanese, at least she'll have a foundation so that if she comes back to it it will go much more quickly.

Best of all, it's a way for a child and a parent to have a shared experience. THAT is great!

ファブリス Wrote:I'd say why not? If she was my daughter I'd let her learn whatever she wants to learn, the most important is that she enjoys whatever she's learning.

I wonder, does she write down the characters outside of studying RtK with you?

She might get an interest in calligraphy and develop artistic skills, and in that context, I don't think the time spent on RtK would be lost. At my calligraphy course there are quite a few children, most are girls She would get a good head start because of her affinity with the characters.

She does write the characters without me, when she's coloring in her free time. We also use a white board to practice and for the flash card tests.

Her English handwriting is a bit sloppy, however with her Japanese, I am trying to instill proper writing (stroke order, spacing, etc.) in hopes it will help her English writing as well.

I was wondering about the viability of Heisig for children. Perhaps one day I will try it with my little boy when he's old enough.

My initial feelings are that it could be very hard to relay to young children how to use the visual story method fully. Well... a lot of adults don't even get Heisig at all; he says "right" and they go left, and then they almost invariably fail to get very far and end up thinking RTK is useless.

I don't want my child to have to do 100 kanji reviews daily for kanji he won't need in practice for years. But it may be nice to teach him a few kanji just for fun. Namely, the ones he's likely to encounter in books apropriate for his age.

My daughter likes quite a few anime cartoons (she watches Inuyasha with her mother). When I visited, I gave her a little Japanese book (point and speak book with alot of pictures) which she enjoyed quite a bit.Anyway, I did try the Heisig method with her a little bit, but it was not interesting to her so she didn't stick to it, but she enjoyed reading that little book.

So, if there's the enthusiasm, do not be afraid to teach them. Forcing it on them takes a bit more effort (and not the case here). Hell, get them those DS games for Kanji. You might find your child exceeding you.

Nukemarine Wrote:You might find your child exceeding you.

That's what I'm afraid of!

She probably will. Kids learn so fast! A guy told me that when he moved to Japan with his family, a couple of years later his kid spoke like a native while he was still struggling in a language school..

"Slime Forest" is a "retro-console style RPG which teaches katakana, hiragana, and kanji," available at http://lrnj.com/ My kids really enjoy it and they've picked up all the kana and a number of kanji while playing it. Kind of like some of the old typing trainer games, you have to enter readings of kana to do battle. If you miss it provides immediate feedback.

My older daughter took Japanese in her freshman year of high school and did well, but it was more of a chore so she didn't retain it (nor would she practice with me). Then she got into anime. Self-taught by listening to anime and reading manga, she now speaks Japanese quite well. She's started RtK and has progressed to lesson 8 in the last week. I'm going to have to scramble to stay ahead.

Basically, motivation is everything. If the kid has an interest, let them run as far as it will take them!

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If possible, get videogames for young kids in Japanese.

Never tried Pok?mon in Japanese, but you know the game is easy, no porn content hidden in there and the Japanese won't be utterly hard (especially if she has already played the game before in english).

I've become addicted to Princess Maker Legend of Another World and now I'll never forget the association of the kanji for color and spiritual energy for sex appeal. Hahaha (And no, I don't think this particular game should be appropiate for a kid that age. One of the possible endings of the game is to turn your daughter in the game into a prostitute!)

Kids that age suck languages like a sponge. If you have any dvd's of anything in Japanese that is suitable for a kid, they'll start sucking it in like vacuum cleaners.

I also endorse speaking to your daughter in Japanese if you can. Both will learn together and have a lot of fun. My mom tried to teach me spanish verbally as a kid but I never really got anywhere because my dad din't like it. I curse it to this day because my spanish has a .. strange accent. I also think it's cute you and your daughter have found something to do together even though you're probably busy with other things. So many parents let tv educate their kids and then wonder why their kids fully ignore them when they become teenagers.

I learned spanish in just 1 year by complete forced exposure. Believe me, your daughter will thank you in the future for giving her the gift of billingualism. Once you're billingual, learning more languages is far easier even as an adult.

IIRC the Japanese version of Pokemon uses only hiragana.

uberstuber Wrote:IIRC the Japanese version of Pokemon uses only hiragana.

Confirm'd. And spaces. You're never grateful for kanji until they're gone.

I discovered this problem with some older games I wanted to try playing. I was going to try Shining Force II, but haven't played it all the way through before, so was going to use the kanji to manage. Ah well, guess I'll try something else.