do you tell your family and friends about SRS when they ask you how you can remember all the kanji and other amazing things?

I personally consider SRS a secret and I don't even tell my brother about it and he is in his senior high school.

I try to introduce SRS to everyone I know... But no one seems very interested in it. "You waste so much time doing that?!", "Isn't it really boring?", etc.

I spread it among my class for German learning, but our language-centered high school is full of people who are interested in improving themselves. Also got my brother to try it, he's a slacker and only stuck with it for two days.

I do have to agree though, it is a time sink (not a waste though). Now that it's a vacation, I've been reviewing from dawn to dusk, that's all I do - 10 minutes of reviewing, 10 minutes playing an untranslated VN, 10 minutes reviewing (failed cards are ready to review again), without end.

financialwar Wrote:do you tell your family and friends about SRS when they ask you how you can remember all the kanji and other amazing things?

I personally consider SRS a secret and I don't even tell my brother about it and he is in his senior high school.

Funnily enough, I kinda do.

While I was taking Japanese 101 & 102 (Beginning courses) I kept Anki a secret. If they were really serious about learning Japanese they would have found it on their own online like (I assume) most of us have.

Briefly mentioned it to my brothers once but didn't get around to actually showing them the program

I have briefly mentioned the concept to my brother, but that's it.

I don't intend to, I feel it truly is a secret weapon lol, this is the closest I've ever had to a "superpower"

also yeah, if someone actually wants to learn a language, then they will eventually learn of teh SRS

I've introduced it if someone asked me.. and did a deck for learning before an exam, posted it with anki and quick guide on our fb site, it doesnt seem that many were interested in it(ive got a really good result thanks to it). It's funny that on the forum of the site that first pops up when i write "learn japanese" in polish, nobody mentioned the SRS system or said something about RTK in the thread "what they use to learn japanese". Thanks to them ive wasted some money on polish books, that were unanimously called "awesome" by everyone there(they are terrible btw, at least in comparison to english ones). Gotta say that Im in awe of people who were able to learn kanji by writing them xx times down.. being able to search using uncle google is a really time saving skill today.

Although I use this website and Anki to some extent I don't really think about it. I just use this website to learn new kanji, use free review to learn them like crazy and as a bonus I get a little review every morning to test my retention. I forget sometimes the concept of SRS because with me constantly reviewing characters outside of the 'main' reviews I guess I'm not actually using the method.

[Zgarbas]

I've told many people of Anki and srs, but they usually never get around to doing it.
I did install it and downloaded a few decks for my sister, but that was for scoring brownie points with my mom .

Zgarbas Wrote:I've told many people of Anki and srs, but they usually never get around to doing it.

That's because most people are so incredibly lazy and pessimistic unless something is instantly available to them. Then they spend all their time complaining about not being able to learn. I'm so fed up with it at this point. Live a little! Right?

[s0apgun]

Tried to show numerous people, they go wow thats awesome. Then I ask if they've used it at all and that I could help them get started... usually ends up me with a confused look on my face as they half listen to what I'm saying.

SRS is straight ownage.

I don't keep it a secret at all, but anytime someone asks about that weird thing I'm doing, they only half listen, not being really interested on the answer.

Then, try to show someone really interested how to install Anki and create some decks for it: "That's a lot of work which I'll be better using in actually studying!"... I mean, that's the most positive feedback I get.

I wonder why the Japanese language had to cross my life to ever get to know a) the concept of SRS and b) a true systematization of mnemonic rules. Clearly, for something so untamed as Kanji, there's no other way -- except wasting 10 years or so (with my fish memory, that won't do the trick either) with full commitment, I guess...
But that's not the real question here. My point is: Why in the world isn't it mainstream yet? Why aren't we teaching how to use Anki in schools and encouraging kids to do their own, shared decks about language learning, history, etc (OMG, how much more can I suck at history)? Why isn't it a basic tool for law students? I imagine it could even be of some interest to science learning, although maybe in more limited way.

What would have happened to me if I had this superpower when my brain was still of some use?

faneca Wrote:My point is: Why in the world isn't it mainstream yet? Why aren't we teaching how to use Anki in schools and encouraging kids to do their own, shared decks about language learning, history, etc (OMG, how much more can I suck at history)? Why isn't it a basic tool for law students? I imagine it could even be of some interest to science learning, although maybe in more limited way.

Which leads to the wider question of why we make learning so damn boring in the first place. And yes, I also wish I had had Anki when I was taking AP American History. Or, for that matter, Internet access.

Having studied Japanese years ago and coming back to it only recently, I'm blown away by the amount of resources available to self-learners. The amount of time Damien's pumped into Anki alone is astounding. But yeah, my own experience in trying to pitch this to other people has only further convinced me that I'm an atrocious geek, and most people simply aren't this motivated to learn a language.

To each their own. Those who need it will find it.

except Damien ruined Anki with Anki 2, he even banned me from Google discussion because I was complaining too much.

In Anki 2, there is no delete or generate card function, everything is done through coding, good luck on make that mainstream.

I mainly link people to an article Lifehacker did on learning languages using Anki and immersion because it's shorter than asking them to read a lot of AJATT/Spanish-Only/Antimoon articles, and because I think I tend to be too enthusiastic when introducing things, which makes people think I've fallen for some scam, so letting other people's words do the talking works better...Still, I haven't introduced someone to SRS who stuck to it for more than a week. I think most people I know offline (college-age & middle-aged Americans pretty much) don't want to learn a language enough to stick with SRS or any serious immersion environment for long. Most people say things like "I don't have the time", and these are mainly people who are on Facebook whenever I glance at their computer...In other words, I do try to tell people about it, but nobody cares.
I guess I shouldn't expect much...I usually have forgotten most of what I "learned" in college courses two weeks after the semester ends, and from people I've talked to I know I'm not alone in this. I should probably try using Anki more in studying for classes, but a lot of my classes don't bother to show me why remembering things discussed in class will be useful after the end of the semester in the first place.

[Zgarbas]

I don't think it's a matter of not wanting to learn. Some of the people I talked about SRS with actually reached a fairly decent (by common standards, at least; n3 in 3 years) level in Japanese without it, involving hours of rote memorization and all that. It can be done like that too. That makes it even more confusing as to why they wouldn't just try to make it easy for themselves, though =/.

Zgarbas Wrote:I don't think it's a matter of not wanting to learn. Some of the people I talked about SRS with actually reached a fairly decent (by common standards, at least; n3 in 3 years) level in Japanese without it, involving hours of rote memorization and all that. It can be done like that too. That makes it even more confusing as to why they wouldn't just try to make it easy for themselves, though =/.

Well, one of the multiple incarnations of Murphy's laws say something like this: "trying to avoid an effort, people will do things in such a way that the results are bad, even if it is a harder way which requires more effort". Or, rephrased: "Usually, some hours of trial and error will save you from five minutes of reading docs". It's one part of the human behavior that really fascinates me... specially when I see it on myself ;-).

I do mention it to people I know well but what happens is pretty simple: most people want instant results and aren't willing to work to get it. I think the only way to spread the word is to show results. That's one thing I might consider doing in the future. Showing how to use it well for things like transcription/translation and production for language learning.

Then again, this isn't anything new but I still might try.

faneca Wrote:Well, one of the multiple incarnations of Murphy's laws say something like this: "trying to avoid an effort, people will do things in such a way that the results are bad, even if it is a harder way which requires more effort". Or, rephrased: "Usually, some hours of trial and error will save you from five minutes of reading docs". It's one part of the human behavior that really fascinates me... specially when I see it on myself ;-).

you need to improve your English and your logic.

financialwar Wrote:you need to improve your English and your logic.

It was a fast post, but I agree I need to improve my English. What about my logic, though? You'll have to explain that one a little better...

faneca Wrote:"Usually, some hours of trial and error will save you from five minutes of reading docs"

Friend: Wow, how can you remember those nonsense math formulas?!
Me: I'm just awesome. (read: Anki)

Friend: Wow, how did you learn those monster Chinese things?!
Me: Firstly, they're called kanji and they're Japanese; secondly, I'm just awesome. (read: Anki)

Friend: Wow, how did you memorize all those French verbs' conjugations with a perfect pronouncation?!
Me: I'm just awesome. (read: Cards with sound files on anki)

Friend: Wow, from where did you learn those weird English words like "annexed"?!
Me: I'm just awesome. (read: SAT and TOEFL vocabulary desks on anki)

Friend: Wow, how can you-
Me: I'm just awesome. (read: lol it's anki stupid)

If Anki became mainstream, good lord. I don't use the method that much but if more people were making more decks and more plugins it'd only get better and better.

I'm on a computing degree, we have tons of abbreviations and such. a lot of which we aren't even expected to learn, but just by learning what they stand for it makes it really easy to remember what they actually mean/do.

Last academic year I would simply write down any abbreviation that ever came up and put it into anki that night. I did almost no revision at all and aced the year with high marks and letter of commendation... I did show the other students anki and said that I don't have to do any revision because I have passively revised every day over the year, only about 2 minutes a day. They said that it is really cool, but didn't ever try it themselves, they just assume I am some kind of computer genius, I really am not and do a lot less work than them. Oh well.