First off, in Japan do they have a Japanese version of Windows that is different from simply changing locales and installing the Japanese MUI?

I did that, but my forward slashes still show up as junk characters =(

The Vapors Wrote:I really think so!

In all seriousness, I believe they have their own version: if the Polish get their own version of Windows, I think damn well the Japanese better get theirs.

I tried switching my non-Unicode language to Japanese, but it messes up all my networking as the Japanified computer uses the W (won symbol?) for slashes, throwing all the other computers off.

ruisu Wrote:First off, in Japan do they have a Japanese version of Windows that is different from simply changing locales and installing the Japanese MUI?

I did that, but my forward slashes still show up as junk characters =(

In Japan they have the Japanese language version of Windows, if you want that you would have to install it over your current English language version.

Unfortunately (thanks to Microsoft), there is no simple way to change the language entirely into Japanese (menu, programs, etc.). The best you can do while keeping your current OS, is to install the Japanese IME, once you do that, you'll be able to input and edit Japanese text.

This page has a guide for installing it -> Installing East Asian Language Support Under Windows XP

Also, you should be aware that key positions on a Japanese keyboard will be different, so if you're wondering why certain keys don't do what they should under the Japanese IME.. take a look at a Japanese keyboard -> Japanese keyboard.. of course not "all" Japanese keyboards have exactly that layout.. but it's roughly correct.

EDIT: changed keyboard pic.

You can actually do more than just install the IME. The parent post referred to the MUI which changes the gui to Japanese, but afaik it's pretty halfass. I've never tried to install it on any of my pcs. I'm on Macs now anyways where you can change the UI language in realtime

ah ok, sorry Ruisu, didn'T know about that.

I had a chance to play with the MUI for XP Pro some years ago. It is not as "native" as the localized versions of XP Pro. I think a lot of the command line utilities still produced English output. It is a pretty cost effective solution, however, if you are a multinational enterprise doing a roll-out. You can also set it up so that different users on the same computer (or network if you use roaming profiles) can interact with about 90% of XP in their native language. I thought that it was pretty cool. I remember there was a page somewhere on Microsoft's site that gave percentages for localization. There was also a separate MUI available to localize Office 2003.

All that aside, as far as I know, the only legal way to obtain a copy of the MUI packages for XP, was to get them included in an Enterprise Licensing Deal. That may have changed since I last looked. I also heard that the MUI's for Vista are available somehow or another, legally, for Vista Ultimate users.

EDIT: Found the page again here. They claim 97% for XP. In particular:

Bill Gates Wrote:There is no difference between the actual translations on a particular localized version of Windows XP, for example, and those on an MUI version. This is because the same resources are used to create both the localized version and the MUI version. As a result, the MUI version is almost fully localized, apart from INF files, UI strings that are stored in the registry, components such as HyperTerminal that are not Unicode-based, and 16-bit applications in code page-based format. In fact, the percentage of localization coverage with MUI in Windows 2000 varies between 90 and 95 percent depending on the language.

In Windows 2000 MultiLanguage Version, there are many UI strings that appear in English, which are particularly noticeable with the Start menu. This is because the Start menu is populated directly by using the file names of folders and link files created at setup time. These names appear in English even if you are running an MUI system with a Japanese UI, since English was the original installation language.

In Windows XP, however, the practice of using English UI strings has been changed, resulting in a much greater degree of localization for the system user (with a localization coverage of about 97 percent). Much of the additional localization coverage in Windows XP is achieved through "MUI-enabling" Windows XP system modules and applications. MUI-enabling essentially entails

I have the Japanese version of windows on my computer and it can be useful and a pain. the pains probably arising from my lack of reading skills. A huge amount of the toolbars are simply katakana versions of the English. Sometimes something comes up on the screen and I quickly need to know what it means and clic; yes or no, at times like thgis I wish i had the English windows. I don't personaly see getting Japanese windows as a huge step forward myself.

Don't know whether or not this is what you're looking for, but last year I was inspired by AJATT to get a Japanese OS on my PC; since I'm in IT and use a computer 12 hours/day, it seemed like a good addition to the immersion process. But I can't very well install Japanese Windows on the company laptop (if I even knew where to get it).

As a Unix guy, the answer was obvious: a Japanese version of Linux. I installed VMWare Player, built a configuration file at EasyVMX and installed Momonga Linux on a virtual machine under Windows--the installation process used English, but gave me the option to choose Japanese as the primary UI language. In an hour or so I had a Japanese OS with a total cost of $0.

My manager came over, saw me working in Momonga and said, "What did you do to your Windows???" I hit Ctrl-Alt, minimized the VM and said, "Nothing." He shook his head and walked away.

_Qbe_ Wrote:My manager came over, saw me working in Momonga and said, "What did you do to your Windows???" I hit Ctrl-Alt, minimized the VM and said, "Nothing." He shook his head and walked away.

I have a Windows Mobile 5 phone and some clever bastard made a package to install Japanese fonts and replace some of the OS functions to Japanese. So when you use my phone now it does such things like displaying the date in 2007年11月12日 format and such... when someone went to make a call on it, they saw this and gave me this look like: "Oh Jeez, here we go..." I guess he thought dialing a number had somehow changed dramatically as well.

But yeah, Fedora Core 6 was a breeze as well for me. Also, the supplied IME was solid.

Re MUIs: I didn't realise XP supported MUI's, while that is awesome it seems getting them legally is a pain...

For what it's worth, when I changed Vista's interface to Japanese, it seemed to be very thorough. Everything written by Microsoft (Windows Mail / Media Player) had switched over. It even displayed certain folders/directories using kana in Explorer which was kinda weird.

C:\ユーザー\dave\Documents <-- !

But yeah, these oceans of katakana-ised menus feel like a real drag, but I guess I'll have to get used to it. Everyone else has... (and I remember feeling the same way about kanji some years ago).

I'm using the Japanese MUI at the moment. I didn't want to do a full install of Japanese XP so it seemed like a good half-way house. Lot's of things do change but also lots of things don't.
What I have noticed though is that now I've used it for a month or so, a lot of programs have now changed as well. I think this is due to them updating. I guess when they go online to look for new versions they now get the Japanese one and install that.
It'll do till Christmas when I should have time to re-install from scratch...

I'm using Ubuntu Linux in Japanese. It's very easy to switch to any language you want with this.

There's one thing I was wondering: do original Japanese computers have the same input method as ours (non-Japanese), or is it more "built in"? Do they just use Japanese keyboards?

(It came to mind when I noticed that smileys in Japan use a lot of non-latin non-japanese characters, like stars and Russian letters. Is that possible with a western keyboard and installed IME?)

The Japanese keyboards are not very different from US except the keys can also dobule up to type Kana directly, which I've never seen anyone use; I've only seen Japanese type romanized script. Perhaps in the more olden days they used Kana keyboards.

Thanks for all of the replies! I'm afraid I actually like Windows, so Linux isn't an option for me. I will settle for just using the Japanese MUI with the IME. I have Vista Ultimate, so the MUIs just show up as available upgrades in Windows Update. It's about 800MB, and changes everything Windows to Japanese, lots and lots of katakana. Other MS programs, like Office, Visual Studio are still in English. Which I guess would be best for me at this stage.

I actually learned the kana before discovering Heisig, so it's not so bad. It slows me down a lot, but I'm sure this will at least improve my katakana reading. I bet I'll also be getting very familiar with the IME Pad, which is going to be tough. But it's still practice! Maybe I'll get so sick of looking up kanji by drawing them, that I'll just subconsciously remember them to save my self the trouble.

And yes, I'm following Khazumoto's advice here.

Well...back on the grind, my review screen just turned into an orange nightmare!

vosmiura -
Some typists still use the kana input (according to something I remember reading on 2ch), it's apparently faster because there's less typing. It's just harder to get used to using.

vosmiura Wrote:The Japanese keyboards are not very different from US except the keys can also dobule up to type Kana directly, which I've never seen anyone use; I've only seen Japanese type romanized script. Perhaps in the more olden days they used Kana keyboards.

If you look closely, much of the punctuation and non-letter keys are in different places. Also, there are additional keys for switching input mode (I wish I had those instead of having to use key combos).