yeah, lunges. weight in that position would probably be something like front-squat lunges or whatever. i just made that up but it sounds about right.

gyms aren't useless. the progression offered by weights is very efficient and easy to track. let's just not go overboard, just align your goals with what you have.

anyway, are there any parks around you that have inverted row bars?

nadiatims Wrote:Unless you're a body builder or something gyms are pretty much a waste of time and money.

Partner is right, there is no real body-weight replacement for deadlifts (and various other compound movements). Gyms allow for a much greater variety of weights/movements.

It's kinda silly to say there's no point going to the gym unless you're a bodybuilder... Some people (ie. me...) actually enjoy weightlifting and do it as a hobby/sport. The goal IS the weightlifting, not getting huge..

Would you tell a soccer player that a real soccer ball and studded shoes/shin pads and making a trip to a field are a "waste of time and money"? After all, you could just run around and a have fun in regular shoes with a scrunched up ball of paper in your living room... :p

Join a dojo. Membership is generally more reasonable than a gym. You can get fit, learn how to defend yourself, make friends, and practice your Japanese.

^
that would make sense if the dojo lets the OP do pullups...

SammyB Wrote:It's kinda silly to say there's no point going to the gym unless you're a bodybuilder... Some people (ie. me...) actually enjoy weightlifting and do it as a hobby/sport. The goal IS the weightlifting, not getting huge...

I guess I should have said "unless you're a body builder or your hobby is lifting weights." If your goal is just to stay fit/strong though you really don't need a gym.

as for deadweight lifts, there may be no bodyweight substitute, but why does anyone need to do dead weight lifts if not to get huge..?

As I said before though, you could just put a bunch of water bottles in a backpack or something and lift that over your head.

nadiatims Wrote:as for deadweight lifts, there may be no bodyweight substitute, but why does anyone need to do dead weight lifts if not to get huge..?

It hits a large number of muscle groups all at once in one lift technique. Its basically efficiency over doing a ton of reps pinpointing certain muscle groups. And again, its not for getting huge. Arguably a deadlift (aka fireman carry) is one of the most important movements to be able to do. Should you ever need to carry someone that can't walk or has collapsed; the best way to do it will be over your shoulder. The action of getting a person up and then walking with them is fundamentally a dead lift. Need to carry sand bags? Same deal.

how often do you need to carry bodies though...? Are you a fireman? serial killer?

If you want to be able to lift sandbags, just buy a big bag of rice.

vix86, a deadlift is normally in reference to lifting a weight off the ground to a standing position (hands being near the waist). If you brought the weight up to the shoulders, it would be called a clean while over the head in one motion would be a snatch. The fireman's carry is very specific type of carry and a useful training tool, but it's not normally considered the most important lift. The Squat traditionally carries that distinction.

nadiatims, some people approach physical fitness like they'd approach learning a language. They'd like to be prepared for any eventuality (vocab, grammar, literacy, fluency for language; strength, speed, agility, power, etc for fitness). It's better to have more available in reserve than what's only required at that moment. In addition, strength transfers benefits over into the other aspects of physical fitness (well, except maybe agility) which just gives you overall better health (which is itself physical fitness over a longer period of time).

As said, don't confuse this with body building. That's a regimen designed to get muscles bigger, not necessarily stronger. On top of that, they sacrifice many other fitness aspects for their beauty pageant looks.

Edit: oh yeah, a deadlift is primarily a back exercise. It'll give you strong abs and forearm strength for both stabilizing and holding the grip. It's an outstanding exercise and essential after the squat.

nadiatims Wrote:how often do you need to carry bodies though...? Are you a fireman? serial killer?

If you want to be able to lift sandbags, just buy a big bag of rice.

how often do you need to do one handed pushups?
pullups?
run?

honestly the difference between bodyweight and the gym is like regular flash cards and SRS.

kainzero Wrote:how often do you need to do one handed pushups?
pullups?
run?

honestly the difference between bodyweight and the gym is like regular flash cards and SRS.

Let me start off by saying that this not backed by science, but my own personal experience. Take it with a grain of salt.

Aside from squats and deadlifts, I feel like bodyweight exercises are superior to exercises with weights, precisely because we do have to do things like pullups, running, pushups, etc. very frequently. Sitting up from lying down? Kind of like a pushup. Standing up from a chair? Kind of like a bodyweight squat. Going for a hike and climbing on some rocks? Kind of like a pullup. Late for school? Running. These are things that everyone does at least once in a while.

Because bodyweight exercises use our own bodyweight, they really help you get comfortable with moving your body. It helps you become one with your body much better than lifting weights at the gym. These types of things are immediately applicable in everyday life, especially if you enjoy being active in general (playing sports, going for hikes, etc).

On the other hand, when was the last time you had to put 100kgs (~200lbs?) on your back and stand up? When was the last time you had to lift 100kgs from the floor? When was the last time you laid flat on your back and pressed 60kgs above your head? Sometimes these things are also important (especially depending on your job), but I would bet most people spend more time moving their own bodyweight.

edit: After reading some other posts in this thread, I've rethought the point I'm trying to make. It's not really fair to say that bodyweight exercises are more important than weightlifting.

[ファブリス]

We could go on with a philosophical debate about "natural" vs "unnatural"...

Back to original question: You can do pullups at a playground pretty easily. If there really isn't one around you, you can install a bar in your house. get a stud finder (cheep little beeping electronic device) and find some studs in your ceiling. Drill 2 holes and screw in 2 big sturdy eye-screws. With chain or rope suspend a section of steel piping a short distance below. There's your bar. When you move out though you'd have to unscrew, fill with spackling and cover with some paint. But that's not so tough. I did this in the garage of my last house.

ファブリス Wrote:We could go on with a philosophical debate about "natural" vs "unnatural"...

haha, i'd rather not. i was trying to poke fun at it.

for me, i find weights (a barbell/dumbbells) to be superior not because of "natural" vs "unnatural" but because you have the ability to fine tune and control everything. not everyone uses SRS/flashcards to learn japanese and they turn out well, same thing with weights. effort is way more important than the means.

for me the disadvantage of bodyweight is controlling progression. it's also a serious problem if you can't do the exercise to begin with. (pullups are an obvious culprit. a friend of mine has been doing negatives to no avail...)

I see your point kainzero, but I think you should say 'weights are better for me '. Maybe that was what you're implying, but 'superior' is not the word to use then probably. The analogy of weight exercises with a SRS is definitely not justified (well in general at least).
In addition to the point partner made above, bodyweight exercises have the upside of training 'stabilizing' muscles, because you use not only the main muscles. The whole is bigger than its parts. But I know this is true for some weight exercises as well.
And to solve some of your problems: In the book I mentioned before there are a number of suggestions for lighter bodyweight exercises if you cannot immediately do a pull-up. And controlling progession is not that much of a problem with bodyweight exercises: this week I do 9 pull-ups, next week I do 10
For me, bodyweight exercises were a lot more convenient since you don't need bulky and expensive equipment and/or go to a gym. And we can all agree that between doing nothing at all or doing some exercises at home, the latter is preferable. And for doing exercises at home, bodyweight exercises can make for very hard exercises without needing to buy a lot of weights. But I can perfectly understand people who are willing to go to a gym.
So really, and I know this is kind of a discussion killer, I think it depends on your personal preferences. No way is absolutely superior, in contrast to the difference between SRS-ing and not SRS-ing

Would an advantage of bodyweight exercises be rectal integrity? Or is this an issue with both approaches?

kame3 Wrote:I see your point kainzero, but I think you should say 'weights are better for me '.

So like how I prefaced all my points with "For me..."? =)

Quote:The analogy of weight exercises with a SRS is definitely not justified (well in general at least).

SRS is just a flashcard with more control and options.
You can do the same thing with SRS with a pile of flashcards. You just don't have a plug and play formula that calculates the spaced repetition for you, but certainly you can do it manually.

All the junior high schools (at least where I live) have pull-up bars. I guess this only works if you are working at the school and thus have a reason to be there, but still.