I've been feeling like I need to take the next step in terms of language study, as well as just to enjoy traveling in general.
My work has a 1-year sabbatical program and I think it'd be nice to use it to go stay in Japan, earn a bit of money, see and live the country, etc.
I'm also not particularly committed to my job (hate it here, actually) so I wouldn't mind getting a real job, though with an N2 and poor conversation skills, I don't think many people would take me, plus I would be uncomfortable committing and moving someplace long term without really knowing what it's like.

What kind of jobs are available?

-ALT is definitely on the table. Sadly, I was rejected by Interac this weekend. I'll definitely apply for JET, are there any other good ALT companies to go work for? My cousin worked for Interac and heard reports from other ALTs that their company can be really shady.
-How is Eikaiwa work? Does anybody do that here? I've definitely heard bad stuff about them.
-If I wanted to find a real job, where do I begin? I graduated in Aerospace Engineering, though I currently work in automotive regulations. Online job sites? I heard BCF is for people who are actually native speakers so I'm not sure I want to chance that. Any international companies that people know about?
-How about formal study? I have been thinking about getting my graduate degree, but I have a weak GPA (2.6), no academic references, etc. It's not looking good, haha.

I can't believe you were rejected by Interac...wow. I guess if you have no prior experience in Japan though that might be an issue.

Finding work in Japan can be difficult. For something short term I would recommend Eikaiwa.

Having experience and skills puts you at a better position to enter Japan but I think you are still going to find its difficult to land a spot. I'd recommend watching GaijinPot and watching postings there. The issue you will probably run into though is that many spots won't be interested in you unless you are already in Japan. That way they can interview in person and don't have to deal with the visa issues.

Formal study is probably doable if you can find a study abroad program or a school that lets you go over on them. Even a masters (2 years) would be doable but your GPA is weak so you might have to pay your way privately. Grad school is cheaper in Japan compared to the US though. ~$5-6,000 a year in tuition, even at the top schools.

^ Its difficult to know how competitive Interac is now, especially from abroad. And all Interac teachers I know are pretty experienced.

Coming on a working holiday visa is good if it's possible and you can save some money to do it, then you have a better chance of finding a job while you're in Japan.

caivano Wrote:^ Its difficult to know how competitive Interac is now, especially from abroad. And all Interac teachers I know are pretty experienced.

Doubtful. Most Interac teachers I know are not all that experienced. There does seem to be commonality with people having experience in Japan though. It seems that most teachers have at least 6-12 months of time in Japan.

US citizens can't get Working Holiday visas.

Once upon a time, I interviewed and hired people in the US to work at a now defunct language school in Japan. You mention being uncomfortable committing and moving someplace before knowing what it's really like. Very normal, but if I sensed any hesitation of that kind in an applicant, they were a no. A certain percentage of people don't like Japan and leave, even good jobs, because of adjustment issues. So, many employers want people with either Japan experience or at least previous experience living abroad because starting over with a new employee is a real pain.

I was wondering if it was because of my lack of teaching experience. I have none. My cousin said he had zero response from English teaching companies until he got some teaching credential.

Sean2 Wrote:You mention being uncomfortable committing and moving someplace before knowing what it's really like.

For ALTs and other places with 1 year contracts I'm fine. But for a real job, I'm definitely apprehensive. I also wouldn't say it in an interview. (To be honest, except for the language barrier, I don't think there would be too hard of a transition. All of my hobbies are fairly normal and isolated and don't require that much, I'm not an outgoing person, etc.)

The only credentials you need for ALT or Eikaiwa work are (1) a university degree and (2) be able to form words with your mouth.


Seriously, they'll take anyone. If you got rejected it was probably because there was something in your application that made them think you may not be 100% committed to the whole come across the planet to live in Japan thing.

vix86 Wrote:

caivano Wrote:^ Its difficult to know how competitive Interac is now, especially from abroad. And all Interac teachers I know are pretty experienced.

Doubtful. Most Interac teachers I know are not all that experienced. There does seem to be commonality with people having experience in Japan though. It seems that most teachers have at least 6-12 months of time in Japan.

hmm I guess it'll probably depend on location and schools.

kainzero Wrote:I wouldn't mind getting a real job, though with an N2 and poor conversation skills, I don't think many people would take me, plus I would be uncomfortable committing and moving someplace long term without really knowing what it's like.

maybe get a baito that will make you talk to people for a few months, improve your conversation skills and improve your japanese, get used to the scene and try to apply to a better job when you're ready?

With a degree in Aerospace Engineering I would highly suggest getting something besides an english teaching gig. You are worth more than that. The biggest hurdle in regards to getting a job in Japan is simply not having a working visa to begin with. In the english teaching industry it is the norm to have to sponsor work visas but for many other industries they often look for people who already have it.

I came from a background of working for the FBI for 7 years and sort of did what you are planning. I took a long "vacation" to see how I liked things and then decided to stay and get a job. I actually got my first job and work visa recently but I soon after and am looking for something else. That said I'll still suggest you looking into the job I found which is that of executive search consulting, aka recruiting. It was not up my alley for what I want to be doing long term but with someone of your background I can almost guarantee you can find a job in it fairly easily.

In Japan there are basically two levels of recruiting. One is where you are basically nothing more than a glorified telemarketer sitting around cold calling all day. Don't work there haha. The other level is that of executive recruiters where your job is basically focused on searching for viable candidates out of a pre-existing database, much of it gathered by the dudes working in the previously mentioned cold calling centers. Executive recruiting has barely any cold calling and the majority of the work is done via email, at least at the company I worked with.

Benefits? Pay is much higher than that of an English teacher and is actually negotiable. My starting pay at my company was 300,000yen AFTER all taxes and reductions had been taken out. That is about 80,000-100,000 more per month take home pay than the average starting english teacher salary. 300,000 take home per month is enough for a single person to live a truly excellent life even in the very heart of Tokyo. My company also paid out quarterly bonuses based on performance and all said and done the average consultant at my firm made around 10,000,000yen per year.

Disadvantages? Corporate slave to the max and you'll most likely be working in a company full of foreigners who spend most of their free time blowing all of their money in Roppongi. 12hr days MINIMUM every day of the week. Your work week will basically be get up, work, go home, sleep, repeat.

That said it does offer an alternative way to get into Japan and get that work visa while paying you a good bit more than you'll be able to get with most teaching gigs. Once you've got the work visa then your opportunities really open up.

activeaero Wrote:executive search consulting, aka recruiting.

My friend who just switched out of ALT work thought he had a job lined up with exactly that. He was basically contacted soon after putting a resume up on gaijinpot by East West Consulting K.K. He met with some of their people in Osaka and had set up for a mock/demo run of the job up in Tokyo. Fast forward to 1-2 months before time to quit and he emails and basically says he'll come up for the demo now or something, and after about a week of dicking around on their part they email him back saying "Nope, position filled." Apparently he had talked to some other people some months ago that knew the company and learned that they were slimy/dirty and were likely jerking him along (ie: There was never a position open they just wanted someone to fill a spot if they needed to).

If you are coming from overseas for this company you are likely more guranteed a position since they have to line up sponsorship for you, but if you are in Japan before hand already, BEWARE.

jettyke Wrote:

kainzero Wrote:I wouldn't mind getting a real job, though with an N2 and poor conversation skills, I don't think many people would take me, plus I would be uncomfortable committing and moving someplace long term without really knowing what it's like.

maybe get a baito that will make you talk to people for a few months, improve your conversation skills and improve your japanese, get used to the scene and try to apply to a better job when you're ready?

can't get a baito because i don't have a working holiday visa. i can only get in the country on a tourist visa.

that recruiting job looks terrible, i'd rather not work 12 hours a day and i value free time more than money, especially in what's supposed to be a more casual and relaxed trip in which i happen to make money on the side, plus i want the time to think about what to do in my future because the job i'm working at sucks. (great pay, great benefits, but absolutely no motivation.)

does anybody have opinions on other ALT companies besides interac/JET? how about experience working at eikaiwa? or a referral to someplace where they talk about it?

vix86 Wrote:

activeaero Wrote:executive search consulting, aka recruiting.

My friend who just switched out of ALT work thought he had a job lined up with exactly that. He was basically contacted soon after putting a resume up on gaijinpot by East West Consulting K.K. He met with some of their people in Osaka and had set up for a mock/demo run of the job up in Tokyo. Fast forward to 1-2 months before time to quit and he emails and basically says he'll come up for the demo now or something, and after about a week of dicking around on their part they email him back saying "Nope, position filled." Apparently he had talked to some other people some months ago that knew the company and learned that they were slimy/dirty and were likely jerking him along (ie: There was never a position open they just wanted someone to fill a spot if they needed to).

If you are coming from overseas for this company you are likely more guranteed a position since they have to line up sponsorship for you, but if you are in Japan before hand already, BEWARE.

East West is like the joke of the recruiting biz and is nothing more than a cold calling sweat shop. Everyone and their brother has been offered a job from them haha.

And to kainzero, yeah that is exactly why I quit, among other things. You basically have to sell your soul but for a short term gig it does do two things: 1. Gets you a visa and 2. Pays a lot better than English teaching gigs. I was simply suggesting it as another way to get your foot in the door because as I previously mentioned getting the work visa is the key to finding better work.

ahh, i see.

at the moment, i am thinking about going to japan for a year before coming back to my old job and also earning my masters or Ph.D in something (i'm thinking cognitive psychology or science). it's all a dream though, who knows if i'll actually find something interesting to do in my life.

i will say, testing video games for $10/hr was really fun and i felt much more alive than i do now with my boring salaried cubicle job.

---

been looking at other companies for ALTs and Eikaiwa and I get nothing but horror stories except for JET, with interac looking the best of the non JETs. people getting underpaid, working sales, illegal overtime, etc.

i could try traveling to another country instead... hm. but then it would feel like a waste to study japanese for so long. i think that's why i threw in the education angle, but i would probably have to do my masters first...

I don't know about you, but if I had a job to return to and just wanted to enjoy Japan for a year while minimizing my costs, I would be more willing to put up with crap from employers.

amirite?

Also take the horror stories with a grain of salt. Most are from guys who have no plans to adopt their work life to the "Japanese way" and just gaijin smash the place up.

kainzero Wrote:been looking at other companies for ALTs and Eikaiwa and I get nothing but horror stories except for JET, with interac looking the best of the non JETs. people getting underpaid, working sales, illegal overtime, etc.

Once you have the work visa you can quit the job and keep the visa if you don't like the job. The visa is not the employer's it's yours.

Things may have changed with Interac but the impression I had when I lived in Japan was that they were pretty sketchy. From what I heard it sounded like they hired people who already were teaching in Japan and wanted to stay there (like JETs at the end of their contract). Basically for a lot of their jobs you would do the same work as a JET ALT but for less money than JET.

I had a really good experience as a JET but conditions as a JET can vary widely from one school to another.

einahpets Wrote:Basically for a lot of their jobs you would do the same work as a JET ALT but for less money than JET.

I won't disagree that Interac feels sketch at points, but if their pay is the only thing that makes you say that then that is nuts. Interac is a dispatch company ie: middle man for the BoEs, a headhunter. JET/CLAIR works straight with the BOEs and the BOEs pay you, hence you have cut out a middle man because its govt. run (JET). Interac has to take their cut somewhere... Interac gives you better mobility in where you want to go though compared to JET where you are stuck where you are put.

The whole English teaching business in Japan as a whole is slimy, but your point against Interac is pretty ridiculous.

My old company is looking for people now for ALT positions. I worked for them all of 2011 and it's a good company. They e-mailed me asking if I know anyone interested. It's a simple job and an awesome way to learn Japanese and get to experience Japan (plenty of vacation days to go around the country. If you're interested, the company is "Heart Corporation" based out of Mito, Ibaraki, Japan. Although of course the pay isn't amazing, I had a good experience with them, so they have my recommendation. I didn't come for the paycheck anyway, I came to learn Japanese and see Japan and meet the people. It's worth it!
http://www.heart-school.jp
http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Heart-C...4431095662
Map:www.heart-school.jp/en/map2.html

eubankp Wrote:It's a simple job and an awesome way to learn Japanese and get to experience Japan (plenty of vacation days to go around the country.

I would caution people on this one. Having them and then taking them are two seperate things. A lot of companies (Interac is one), won't let you take your holidays when there is school. Basically the only time you can take them is when you already aren't doing anything but you're sitting around doing nothing. Trying to take those holidays say, before/after/during Golden Week or before/after winter break, can be like pulling teeth. They won't just let you take them pleasure, just saying. The law says you should be able to, but no one rarely ever pushes the issue so I've never actually heard what happens when you do; and it can be a quick way to maybe not get recontracted.

Keep that in mind.

Sure, I should clarify... Not vacation days anytime you want, I meant school holidays. Goldenweek is a full week off, there's Winter Vacation, Summer vacation, and tons of National Holidays. That's all I meant. There's no shortage of time off to travel.

[Zgarbas]

I hate to redirect the topic, but I read that foundation's FAQ and noticed that they're basically saying you have to cover about 12 months worth of rent in key money and deposits and what not before you even go there...

Seriously? You have to pay ~6000 bucks to have the "honor" of living in a 600$apartment? or am I misreading this?

Zgarbas Wrote:I hate to redirect the topic, but I read that foundation's FAQ and noticed that they're basically saying you have to cover about 12 months worth of rent in key money and deposits and what not before you even go there...

Seriously? You have to pay ~6000 bucks to have the "honor" of living in a 600$apartment? or am I misreading this?

$6k is a bit of an exaggeration. But it is steep.

Key money is usually 1-3 months of rent. Paid to the landlord, never seen again
Deposit varies but can be 1/2 to 1 month of rent. Can be returned.
Realty finder fees, 1-2 months of rent.
Potentially need 1-2 months of rent up front.

Usually you need about $2,500-3,000 on hand to be safe for starting up a small 1K or 1LDK or something like that.

EDIT: Let me clarify. This is STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURE in Japan, its not something any company is trying to pull over you. Key money is non-existant in some places, but still very prevalent in others.

[Zgarbas]

I noticed that they said this is standard operating procedure, it makes it all the more baffling.

They set up a Leopalace apartment for me, which was a refundable 1 month deposit and around $600 a month (all utilities and internet included!). No key money or any of that junk. Now I'm with a different company and living in Yokohama, this time I found my own apartment with my girlfriend. We had to put up 5 months rent in deposits, fees, etc. It is truly criminal, but for some reason the Japanese have just accepted it so there's not so much you can do if you want to live in a regular apartment.