So, I'm in 東京 now and having moments of shopping spree in bookshops. What would you recommend for Japanese study at the intermediate level?

PS.
I already got a copy of ノルウェイの森 - is it worth getting a DVD with a movie based on this novel?

Today was a day of a small disappointment. I went to 秋葉原 with intention of buying Sony's Reader. I already bit the bullet that Sony, at this point of time, was the only viable option as far as Japanese e-book readers are concerned, but didn't expect that it is pointless for a person from outside of Japan to get one. That's because you can only purchase books from Sony's Japanese Reader Store if you are paying with Japanese credit card with Japanese billing address. What a shame. The device itself is actually quite ok as it comes with three built in dictionaries (大辞林, ジ－ニアス, New Oxford American Dictionary) and has everything you can expect from todays e-book reader.

On a side note, I couldn't help noticing the crowd gathered in front of AKB48 headquarters. It was mostly males in age varying from teen-something to forty-something exchanging photos of their idol girls. I can somehow understand all those teens and early twenties but seeing over-forty-years-olds with photo albums of teenage girls was somewhat sickening.

More sickening than the rape of prisoners in Iraq? More sickening than the half century long abuse of children in western catholic schools? More sickening than the oppression of women? I would recommend a good dictionary, a good grammar and lots of immersion. You are getting that in Japan!

HonyakuJoshua Wrote:More sickening than the rape of prisoners in Iraq? More sickening than the half century long abuse of children in western catholic schools? More sickening than the oppression of women?

They described it as "somewhat sickening". And having seen the same, i can't say i disagree. Where do they say it is the ultimate in human evil?

Inny Jan Wrote:I can somehow understand all those teens and early twenties but seeing over-forty-years-olds with photo albums of teenage girls was somewhat sickening.

Why?. They are beautiful and the fantasy of millions.

So was Lolita.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolita

So, you can't see anything wrong with 40+ old men being obsessed with 10+ girls?

zigmonty Wrote:

HonyakuJoshua Wrote:More sickening than the rape of prisoners in Iraq? More sickening than the half century long abuse of children in western catholic schools? More sickening than the oppression of women?

They described it as "somewhat sickening". And having seen the same, i can't say i disagree. Where do they say it is the ultimate in human evil?

I would take somewhat sickening to be quite sickening indeed as a trope.

@Inny Jan I can see a lot wrong with it.

Making young girls into sex objects is PART of the oppression of women. It's not separate from it.

HonyakuJoshua Wrote:

zigmonty Wrote:

HonyakuJoshua Wrote:More sickening than the rape of prisoners in Iraq? More sickening than the half century long abuse of children in western catholic schools? More sickening than the oppression of women?

They described it as "somewhat sickening". And having seen the same, i can't say i disagree. Where do they say it is the ultimate in human evil?

I would take somewhat sickening to be quite sickening indeed as a trope.

@Inny Jan I can see a lot wrong with it.

I thought HonyakuJoshua was maybe parodying those who reflexively defend Japan against any kind of criticism, but I guess not.

Also, it's amazing how serious a thread about study materials has gotten within the first page.

haven't we already had this conversation?

@IceCream Yup. It keeps popping up.

@Inny Jan In most scenarios it would definitely be damaging to the kid, boy or girl, if you were to engage in sexual activities with him/her however I don't see anything wrong with anyone engaging in imaginary sexual fantasies about these kids, assuming that's what they do. As long as they keep it inside their pants I'm not troubled.

Inny Jan Wrote:So was Lolita.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolita

So, you can't see anything wrong with 40+ old men being obsessed with 10+ girls?

The case of Lolita is actually a bit different. Humbert Humbert is obsessed with girls who have just started to go through puberty (girls aged 9-14), which means he's more of a legitimate pedophile than someone who is interested in 15-19 year-olds.

I think some 17 year old girls have features that many men would naturally find attractive. Lolita was 12, which is not an age where a girl has features that the average man finds attractive.

The 40 year old guys obsessed with AKB48 disgust me, but not in the same way a real life Humbert Humbert would. (As far as I know the youngest AKB girl is 15, and most are 16-20)

Humbert Humbert also destroys Lolita's life. If anyone is ruining the AKB girl's lives, it's the company that created and is exploiting the girls, not the fans.

Most people have sex for the first time when they are between 15~17 and usually with someone their own age as well, so if you found a 15 year old girl totally acceptable at one point how come you (not pointing at anyone) find it disgusting now?.

because they've grown up a bit since then?

hey, when i was 7, we would hold coats above our heads and kiss boys in the playground. Should i do that now too?

besides which, it's not the girl they're finding disgusting, it's the 40+ year old men fawning over them.

@IceCream Yes, but my point is that it's bullshit that you suddenly stop finding these people attractive.

huh? i can assure you, i'm not interested in 7 year old boys anymore.

... and there's less of an age gap between me & them than there is between AKB and some of their fans.

What do you think the AKB girls think of their 40+ year old fans, really?

Not everything is about you and your desires.

Also, reread Fillanzeas post.

My patience for this topic is running a little thin now, sorry...

Quote:Most people have sex for the first time when they are between 15~17 and usually with someone their own age as well, so if you found a 15 year old girl totally acceptable at one point how come you (not pointing at anyone) find it disgusting now?

um...because we are no longer teenagers ... Any other brilliant questions?

Fillanzea Wrote:Making young girls into sex objects is PART of the oppression of women. It's not separate from it.

IceCream Wrote:Haven't we already had this conversation?

My thoughts exactly. To avoid a rehash, maybe someone could link to that thread? (I don't recall what it was called.)

Sexualization of made-to-seem-like-young girls aside, this stuff is just really bad "art". Having such bad taste is totally offensive and should be illegal. Since this stuff lacks artistic merit and doesn't pass the community standards smell test, all fans should be incarcerated and forced to undergo cultural rehabilitation. (Except Kainzero, of course, who seems really cool.)

Thora Wrote:Having such bad taste is totally offensive and should be illegal.

I don't know if my question was brilliant or not, but your comment is unintelligent.

It's not meant to be taken seriously. Wasn't that obvious?

[Edit: Sorry for being rude, turvy, I think I've also lost patience with this topic/attitude and you just happened to be the one to offer it again.

Maybe there will be some more recommendations for InnyJan: ]

Quote:So, I'm in 東京 now and having moments of shopping spree in bookshops. What would you recommend for Japanese study at the intermediate level?

Fillanzea Wrote:Making young girls into sex objects is PART of the oppression of women. It's not separate from it.

If you want my personal stone mad, unorthodox opinion:

I feel sexual abuse is aimed at the weakest members of a social group. When females are absent or protected by more dominant males young boys are often picked upon for rape and molestation. I think it has very little to do with gender or sex for that matter. It is just basically a form of bullying and nonconsensual behaviour with sex added on - whether the victim is male or female is irrelevant IMHO.

I think the oppression of women is putting them in certain roles and denying them the right to do certain other roles - you know, such as women can't be engineers, judges, astronauts, chess champions etc and speaking to them and treating them in a condescending way.

I think the two issues are totally different.

Jesus, sorry guys. Someone want to kick off a new thread about AKB48? Or let it die?

@Inny Jan:

I pretty much just raided a BookOff and bought way more reading material than i needed. When books are that cheap, it's not worth agonising over which to buy. If they're crap, just stop reading them. DVDs are more expensive, but for that there's the internet lol.

@InnyJan, I'd go for some glossy lifestyle magazines. The vocabulary should be more or less managable with articles on more general, everyday topics. Or travel magazines, perhaps? I think this could work as well.

Go to bookoff and buy some cheap manga and novels.

re AKB48...

While I agree it's pretty weird if a 40 year old guy still wastes time fantasizing about teenage girls, I think as long as there are laws in place to protect individuals against violence, there's not really any harm in it. If you start trying to ban it or something then you're getting into thought police territory.

Thanks for the BookOff suggestions. I went back to Akiba and indeed you can buy any media there (and as they are second hand, they are on a cheaper side). I wasn't sure whether DVD that you get there would play on my laptop (they are Region 2, so Australia seemed a no-no) but it turns out that these days you get couple of tries to select your region for your DVD drive, so mine is Japanese now.

The other thing I did today was to visit 凡人社 where I got "Kanji in Context" and 完全マスター. I think that with all the other things I got, I'm set for at least 2 years.