zigmonty Wrote:In the interest of stamping out sexism:

Discuss.

Lol, that really made me laugh for some reason. There were some shots I could have done without though.

vix86 Wrote:This is brilliant. To make it legit they need to get a Johnnys band to do it though. I then need lots of feedback from girls to see how it makes them feel. I feel like the whole point of the video is to point out how homosexual the original PV can be interpreted as (never occurred to me till seeing this one honestly).

The girls kissing and taking baths together didn't clue you in? Maybe you were a little distracted...

nadiatims Wrote:Because the director is getting paid good money for it she will find a way to rationalize it to herself. I think sex is pretty blatantly intended to be part of the appeal of AKB48, why else would they be dancing around in underwear and bikinis? The concept is pretty brilliant really. It appeals to the teenage girl fantasy of being pretty/sexy and getting noticed, hence they deliberately choose the non threatening cute girl next door types. It also appeals to teenage boys because they resemble their schoolmates they're secretly crushing on. I don't really see any problem with it so long as they don't focus on the underage members too much.

again, why don't they do it for all their videos?

those costumes and hairstyles aren't sexually appealing at all.

i'm not arguing the sexuality as part of their appeal; i just don't think it applies to heavy rotation and i feel that the director's history and interview pretty much explained it.

Splatted Wrote:The girls kissing and taking baths together didn't clue you in? Maybe you were a little distracted... roll

there is a societal bias for females to act lesbian but not actually be lesbian, whereas it's a bit harrowing for guys to act in that manner unless they really are gay.

otherwise we wouldn't have terms like "crossing swords" and phrases like "it's not gay unless you look him in the eye."

kainzero Wrote:Without wanting to drive off-topic too far, if anyone has any questions about the group please ask, since I'm a somewhat moderate fan and there's a lot of misinformation that seems to spread.

Speaking of which, one of the things that kinda scared me is ヲタ芸、scripted dances/chants to these idol performances...

I think the closest thing to this in the US is Rocky Horror Picture Show...
It still makes me facepalm.

You obivously are a moderate fan or else you would not be scared of ヲタ芸. I am a huge fan of hello! project(i despise akb48 for what it is doing to the idol industry) and went to a joint c-ute and berryz kobo concert when I was in japan and first of all you can not do full ヲタ芸 at a concert because there is just not enough room(although there it will suprise you how much you will be able to do) and it is loads of fun.

And yes people do not look to kindly on wota in japan, when i told people i was an wota many women were not at all impressed. Also at the concert it is not filled with old people, most people are men ages 18-35 i would say, yes there are older men, but that is probably makes up a fourth of the whole crowd.

kainzero Wrote:

Splatted Wrote:The girls kissing and taking baths together didn't clue you in? Maybe you were a little distracted... roll

there is a societal bias for females to act lesbian but not actually be lesbian, whereas it's a bit harrowing for guys to act in that manner unless they really are gay.

otherwise we wouldn't have terms like "crossing swords" and phrases like "it's not gay unless you look him in the eye."

I get that, but I got the impression that Vix86 had failed to notice that they were acting gay. I guess maybe their point was just that girls acting gay doesn't create the impression that they are gay.

zigmonty Wrote:In the interest of stamping out sexism:

Discuss.

I haven't laughed so much for ages! The original version just seems like a very long lingerie advert.

Zon70 Wrote:And yes people do not look to kindly on wota in japan, when i told people i was an wota many women were not at all impressed.

This is an odd statement. Why would you tell people?

I can't imagine a situation in the West where'd I'd say to a girl "I'm a big nerd" and they *would* be impressed. Why would it be any different in Japan?

Zon70 Wrote:Also at the concert it is not filled with old people, most people are men ages 18-35 i would say, yes there are older men, but that is probably makes up a fourth of the whole crowd.

Hardly any girl fans? So the make-up of the crowd was very similar to the viewing stats on youtube..interesting.

aphasiac Wrote:I can't imagine a situation in the West where'd I'd say to a girl "I'm a big nerd" and they *would* be impressed. Why would it be any different in Japan?

I can imagine one. If she were to say that to you, you could reply "I'm a big nerd, too" and she'd be impressed. Maybe.

nerd, no. geek... maybe

How many guys have you said "I'm a big nerd." to? : DD

lololol... yeah, i try not to make a habit of it ；）

I go to places like Comic Con and Star Wars Celebration for work (though for full disclosure sake, I've been to such events prior to this job). Some variation of "I'm a big nerd" might work in that sort of context.

There is a big difference between liking nerdy things and having an unhealthy obsession with something to the point that you have no social life (which is what otaku means, at least to the typical Japanese person).

In other words, a typical Japanese girl will not be impressed when you tell her that you are an antisocial person with borderline OCD and possibly homicidal (otaku also has that image in Japan).

Although I've heard people use オタク in a self-deprecating, not-quite-serious fashion as well. But if you try to seriously label yourself as an otaku you won't find a lot of sympathy or support.

Zon70 Wrote:You obivously are a moderate fan or else you would not be scared of ヲタ芸. I am a huge fan of hello! project(i despise akb48 for what it is doing to the idol industry) and went to a joint c-ute and berryz kobo concert when I was in japan and first of all you can not do full ヲタ芸 at a concert because there is just not enough room(although there it will suprise you how much you will be able to do) and it is loads of fun.

And yes people do not look to kindly on wota in japan, when i told people i was an wota many women were not at all impressed. Also at the concert it is not filled with old people, most people are men ages 18-35 i would say, yes there are older men, but that is probably makes up a fourth of the whole crowd.

i hate ヲタ芸 because i want to watch the people i pay for to perform. i don't want to hear or see fans perform, i can do that at home or in a karaoke box.

i don't even consider myself a moderate fan because i still carry american principles. every time i hear about a "scandal" i hate the wota. i really don't care if they have a boyfriend (or even HAD a boyfriend prior to becoming an idol), that's kind of creepy to have such control, and it's even creepier for "fans" to dig up purikura showing that. and these so-called scandals can be vicious too, you can get blacklisted from the industry for it.

i've always felt that the japanese punishment for crimes and such is a bit harsh... i remember in class, the teacher showed an article about a guy who was being arrested for murder. she was saying, "Yeah. His parents own a clinic and that place is gonna close up, his brother will probably lose his job... does that happen in America?" i think you would get sued if you got fired for your brother's crime...

kitakitsune Wrote:I would totally bang all the AKB 48 girls.....










the ones over 18 that is

Totally agreed dude!!

IceCream Wrote:nerd, no. geek... maybe

Good point...I've unabashedly called myself a geek in front of people (though I tend to hang around people who like learning stuff, and are usually a "geek" in something, like me ^^), but "nerd" still carries negative overtones which "geek" has mostly lost among younger people, and I'd guess that "オタク"/"ヲタク" might be worse than "nerd" in that regard...

Bokusenou Wrote:Good point...I've unabashedly called myself a geek in front of people (though I tend to hang around people who like learning stuff, and are usually a "geek" in something, like me ^^), but "nerd" still carries negative overtones which "geek" has mostly lost among younger people, and I'd guess that "オタク"/"ヲタク" might be worse than "nerd" in that regard...

Even just in the United States, the terms 'geek' 'nerd' and 'dork' vary a lot by region, btw. When I was in high school a lot of people called themselves 'dork' because it wasn't so harsh a word where I grew up, but I've heard people from other parts of America say that 'dork' has very negative overtones where they're from.

Probably in my school 'geek' was more negative than 'nerd', and both 'nerd' and 'geek' were more negative than 'dork.'

yudantaiteki Wrote:Although I've heard people use オタク in a self-deprecating, not-quite-serious fashion as well. But if you try to seriously label yourself as an otaku you won't find a lot of sympathy or support.

In Japan I feel the sentiment has been changing over the years. The Akihabara massacre and the child rape-murder case before that, have faded from the public's memory somewhat. So the term is regaining some of its positive factors and has sense of cool about it again. I read an article about a poll done within last few months that showed that the majority of people think there is nothing wrong with calling yourself an otaku now. Just don't be obsessive, is really what it comes down to.

Through all the video game websites, conventions, and scenes I've hung around, I've never known what an appropriate title is. I don't even bother applying titles to myself, I just say what I like. People who need a title to enjoy something are usually an embarrassment to everyone else who shares their interest (case in point, Bronies).

I do find it interesting how people embrace titles that have been, and sometimes still are, negative. Geek, nerd, and otaku are one thing, but then there's stuff like the hip hop community and the n-word and 4chan calling each other and themselves fags. Language certainly evolves fast.

Tzadeck Wrote:

Bokusenou Wrote:Good point...I've unabashedly called myself a geek in front of people (though I tend to hang around people who like learning stuff, and are usually a "geek" in something, like me ^^), but "nerd" still carries negative overtones which "geek" has mostly lost among younger people, and I'd guess that "オタク"/"ヲタク" might be worse than "nerd" in that regard...

Even just in the United States, the terms 'geek' 'nerd' and 'dork' vary a lot by region, btw. When I was in high school a lot of people called themselves 'dork' because it wasn't so harsh a word where I grew up, but I've heard people from other parts of America say that 'dork' has very negative overtones where they're from.

Probably in my school 'geek' was more negative than 'nerd', and both 'nerd' and 'geek' were more negative than 'dork.'

i think all of them used to be negative, but geeks are cool. nerds and dorks aren't.

Out of curiosity, if you had to define geek, nerd and dork based on how they are interpreted in your region, what would you say? I'm Australian, and in my mind:

Geek = Normal person(socially speaking) only with obscure interests.
Nerd = Awkward, typically unattractive person with obscure interests.
Dork = Awkward, typically unattractive person with normal interests.

Simplified and slightly stylised to emphasise both similarity and contrast, but you get the point.

I don't think there are any fixed definitions. I've seen all three of those words used positively and negatively, and I've never seen any difference between whether their interests are "obscure" or "normal", or whether they're "normal" or "awkward".

Onelove_yo Wrote:Out of curiosity, if you had to define geek, nerd and dork based on how they are interpreted in your region, what would you say? I'm Australian, and in my mind:

Geek = Normal person(socially speaking) only with obscure interests.
Nerd = Awkward, typically unattractive person with obscure interests.
Dork = Awkward, typically unattractive person with normal interests.

Simplified and slightly stylised to emphasise both similarity and contrast, but you get the point.

Yeah, that seems to be the normal usage here, but as yudantaiteki says, they're all very close synonyms to most people.

Man did this thread get derailed... What happened to the rants about sexism and questionable covers of AKB48 songs.

i dunno, i think a geek is someone with a deep interest in something (could be anything).

a nerd is someone who on the surface seems the same, but actually isn't that good at whatever it is / doesn't know that much about it and therefore has very few redeemable qualities.

a dork is someone who's just uncool, probably badly dressed, makes dumb jokes etc.

I thought nerd just meant someone brainy.