Hey guys, it's me again. I was just wondering what your views are on making money online I've been reading online about this person: http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2006/05...your-blog/

I like the way he writes, it grabs my attention pretty fast. Plus the info here is useful and motivating. I'm planning on making a completely new blog and hope to start a small business online as well (all this is still in the planning phase but I have a good idea of what my blog will be about). I was wondering if you guys can give me any ideas or your views on this. Thanks in advance, this forum is helping me a lot.

Steve Pavlina is an internet get-rich-quick huckster that made his bones in the blogging boom of the early 2000's. You'd be much better off not listening to him. That is...unless you think Don Lapre is a credible figure as well.

Note how many of his articles promise personal growth in X number of days. Note how he appeals to "karma," in order to spur donations to his site. Notice how many of his ideas are extraordinarily exclusionary to those around him. Pavlina doesn't give a damn about helping you make money. He wants you to donate to him.

Here's how to replicate his success: start a blog about how to blog and make money on the internet that requests donations, and then mix in a few articles about polyphasic sleep.

I've seen a bunch of your posts around here over the last few months, and they leave a bad taste in my mouth. You aren't the first person to learn Japanese. There aren't a lot of profound insights into what works when it comes to learning Japanese. Flashcards and conversation practice are it. The internet has made most of it pretty easy. Also, the "I'm gonna make boatloads of money off the interwebs!" ship sailed long ago. It just isn't that easy. It was that easy for a few guys 10 years ago, and has become much harder since.

Go ahead, though. Make some pillar articles. Update a few times a week on a regular schedule. Install Google Analytics and Google Ads, and make $0.25 a day. I guarantee you'll be the next Arianna Huffington. Maybe you'll be the next Khatzumoto. Though, you should know that I don't really consider that a compliment.

In my opinion, its difficult.
I don't think you can just expect to set up a blog and then start raking in tons of cash.

I operate an active website with a fairly large userbase (literally hundreds of forum posts per day), original video content, and user submitted content.
For years, I was earning about $20-30 per month in advertising revenue.
Several months ago, I began to look into it in more detail, and reworked how I was doing my ads, in order to try to maximize my revenue a bit more. Now I am making about $100 a month. That is still not a whole lot. My web hosting and software costs still have to come out of that. So its not like I've even really making any profit at the moment (I really need to upgrade some software soon, so the money that has been coming in will go right back out).
It also takes hours of work each month, if not each week.

Is my situation typical? I have no idea. I'm sure there are probably tons of sites with similar amounts of activity as mine that probably rake in a lot more money. I've never really been in it for the money though, I just enjoy running a site that other people seem to enjoy.

erlog Wrote:Steve Pavlina is an internet get-rich-quick huckster that made his bones in the blogging boom of the early 2000's. You'd be much better off not listening to him. That is...unless you think Don Lapre is a credible figure as well.

Note how many of his articles promise personal growth in X number of days. Note how he appeals to "karma," in order to spur donations to his site. Notice how many of his ideas are extraordinarily exclusionary to those around him. Pavlina doesn't give a damn about helping you make money. He wants you to donate to him.

Here's how to replicate his success: start a blog about how to blog and make money on the internet that requests donations, and then mix in a few articles about polyphasic sleep.

I've seen a bunch of your posts around here over the last few months, and they leave a bad taste in my mouth. You aren't the first person to learn Japanese. There aren't a lot of profound insights into what works when it comes to learning Japanese. Flashcards and conversation practice are it. The internet has made most of it pretty easy. Also, the "I'm gonna make boatloads of money off the interwebs!" ship sailed long ago. It just isn't that easy. It was that easy for a few guys 10 years ago, and has become much harder since.

Go ahead, though. Make some pillar articles. Update a few times a week on a regular schedule. Install Google Analytics and Google Ads, and make $0.25 a day. I guarantee you'll be the next Arianna Huffington. Maybe you'll be the next Khatzumoto. Though, you should know that I don't really consider that a compliment.

Good point, well I definitely know it isn't a quick fix to get rich or anything like that. I do remember 10 years back, the Internet wasn't as big as it is now. There is definitely a lot of Japanese blogs out there about learning Japanese. Although personally I would like to start one, I'm thinking of different ways of not making it the same as everyone else. They say people usual succeed when they think differently then everything else.

erlog Wrote:Here's how to replicate his success: start a blog about how to blog and make money on the internet that requests donations, and then mix in a few articles about polyphasic sleep.

Steve Pavlina says he earns very little from donations — most of his revenue come from ads of products he recommends and from his workshop. And, interestingly, the topics that bring most attention to his blog are really money-related, such as "don't get a job", "be an entrepreneur", "law of attraction" and "how to discipline yourself" (which many people are interested in only to apply to money-generating activities) kind of thing.

Well, in a nutshell, the only way to make money legally is by selling, be it on the Internet or not. Selling your stuff, other people's stuff, your services, your time, selling yourself... It doesn't have to be revolutionary (actually, that rarely sells well), but it has to be something that you can find other people willing to pay you for, usually through some sort of advertising. This selling can be to only one client (e.g., the boss, in the "normal job" path) or to many clients (in the business / entrepreneurs' path.)

Just like in the "real world" (aka outside of the Internet), not everyone succeeds. But not everyone plays the game right, either.

Zarxrax Wrote:In my opinion, its difficult.
I don't think you can just expect to set up a blog and then start raking in tons of cash.

I operate an active website with a fairly large userbase (literally hundreds of forum posts per day), original video content, and user submitted content.
For years, I was earning about $20-30 per month in advertising revenue.
Several months ago, I began to look into it in more detail, and reworked how I was doing my ads, in order to try to maximize my revenue a bit more. Now I am making about $100 a month. That is still not a whole lot. My web hosting and software costs still have to come out of that. So its not like I've even really making any profit at the moment (I really need to upgrade some software soon, so the money that has been coming in will go right back out).
It also takes hours of work each month, if not each week.

Is my situation typical? I have no idea. I'm sure there are probably tons of sites with similar amounts of activity as mine that probably rake in a lot more money. I've never really been in it for the money though, I just enjoy running a site that other people seem to enjoy.

It's definitely difficult, no doubt about it. I don't expect to just start something randomly and expect myself to become rich or anything but if it makes even some money. There is ton of websites out there that are doing the same thing and making money(nothing crazy but a few hundreds a month). For a student, that's a lot of money(me). Although I don't mind putting in the time and working on it.

gdaxeman Wrote:

erlog Wrote:Here's how to replicate his success: start a blog about how to blog and make money on the internet that requests donations, and then mix in a few articles about polyphasic sleep.

Steve Pavlina says he earns very little from donations — most of his revenue come from ads of products he recommends and from his workshop. And, interestingly, the topics that bring most attention to his blog are really money-related, such as "don't get a job", "be an entrepreneur", "law of attraction" and "how to discipline yourself" (which many people are interested in only to apply to money-generating activities) kind of thing.

Well, in a nutshell, the only way to make money legally is by selling, be it on the Internet or not. Selling your stuff, other people's stuff, your services, your time, selling yourself... It doesn't have to be revolutionary (actually, that rarely sells well), but it has to be something that you can find other people willing to pay you for, usually through some sort of advertising. This selling can be to only one client (e.g., the boss, in the "normal job" path) or to many clients (in the business / entrepreneurs' path.)

Just like in the "real world" (aka outside of the Internet), not everyone succeeds. But not everyone plays the game right, either.

Good advice, yea most of his money is made by high-traffic and advertisements on his site. I believe the key to online success is high-traffic,advertisements,community-based(user-base) and providing a service to people. When I think about the srs,japanese learning,language learning,personal development. This isn't anything new and it's pretty much recycle, yet people are succeeding with it. They add there personality into the mix,what worked for them,what it took for them to succeed. I definitely know a lot of people don't succeed, heck same applies to Japanese learning. There will be a few who succeeds but I bet most of them where in it for the long-term.

Make something that people want and will pay for instead of starting with the mindset of making something monetizable. Otherwise any success you might achieve will only be short term. The Internet definetly doesn't need a blog full of begging for money.

Jarvik7 Wrote:Make something that people want and will pay for instead of starting with the mindset of making something monetizable. Otherwise any success you might achieve will only be short term. The Internet definetly doesn't need a blog full of begging for money.

Basically comes down to providing a service that people would be willing to pay for.

Two words:

Perry Marshall

grillopelu73 Wrote:Two words:

Perry Marshall

Sweet

ta12121 Wrote:Basically comes down to providing a service that people would be willing to pay for.

That's the most important aspect. Also, ta12121, there are a number of things that people who are making money online nowadays do very similarly; I don't know if Steve Pavlina have already written about it all in his blog, and it's a little common sense (that thing which most people lack, eh) but, anyway, here it is:

• Have a public place on the Internet where people can find you (e.g., a blog or website), and add original, valuable and helpful things in there, things that really show them you know what you're talking about. Remember to write well and clearly;

• Advertise your website somehow. There are many ways to do that, including: guest posts, adding a link to your signature, using Google AdWords and SEO, and so on;

• Add to your website an opt-in form where you collect e-mails from people who are interested in what you are offering (what Seth Godin calls "permission marketing".) You need to give them a reason to do that — the most common one is offering them content that they won't find in your website. Then use a newsletter service to send them valuable content for free in a regular basis;

• After you have a following, create a good (better yet, a great) paid product or service and advertise it to your e-mail subscribers and in your blog, and make sure to have a clear and easy way for them to pay you. Keep in mind that money-back guarantees helps reducing people's fears about paying money for something, and that's why the absolute majority of those who sell information products offer it.

• Keep sending them valuable things even after you have offered them a paid product (that's crucial);

• Always show them your passion about what you're doing, and don't get lost in trivia and useless things, such as trolls, haters, negative and unhelpful people and so on — more likely than not you'll have your share of them, just like most people trying to sell things online do;

• And the most important ethical aspect: never spam and don't sell or share your e-mail list with others.

There's so much more to it, but those are the basics you can build upon.

Also, read these if you want some examples of 'normal' people making money online — it might inspire you or something:
• Case Study: How Two Moms Are Making $5,000+/m Online
• The First Ever ViperChill Income Report

ta12121 Wrote:They say people usual succeed when they think differently then everything else.

The main tip is to offer something people perceive as better than what is already being offered, and to make sure people know you are offering it. The "think differently" part (that so reminds me of Steve Jobs) is where your creativity comes in; you use it to create this something better and advertise it.

gdaxeman Wrote:

ta12121 Wrote:They say people usual succeed when they think differently then everything else.

The main tip is to offer something people perceive as better than what is already being offered, and to make sure people know you are offering it. The "think differently" part (that so reminds me of Steve Jobs) is where your creativity comes in; you use it to create this something better and advertise it.

Thanks for the advice, I copied it for later reference as well. What I've learned from researching online so far is: a person's blog is to introduce themselves and basically provide a way for someone to be in contact with that person. While the website, is a way of providing a service to people. A lot of times both are them are intertwined together. Plus using social networking is very helpful in introducing yourself and also good for business as well. Things like twitter,facebook and youtube (google plus is out too as well). All these can help a lot. I will most likely create a visual appealing blog. So it will have HD pictures and videos included in it as well(via youtube).

Yea I've had my share of negativity on the web and in real-life. I've learned you cannot please everyone and you shouldn't. The people who have similar interests or at least interested in what you provide.

heard about forex?
you trade currencies and can lose money or gain profit.

http://jp.forex.com/jp/

my net friend uses this and says its enough for living so that he doesnt have to do a job.

Actually i wanna earn money on the net too, after I get tired of doing baito and my corporate japanese is good enough.

jettyke Wrote:heard about forex?
you trade currencies and can lose money or gain profit.

http://jp.forex.com/jp/

my net friend uses this and says its enough for living so that he doesnt have to do a job.

Actually i wanna earn money on the net too, after I get tired of doing baito and my corporate japanese is good enough.

haven't heart of forex but I know about the trade currencies. I'm going to start pretty soon, probably by the end of this year or early next year. I want to get started but I know planning is required before I jump into this. I'm looking online for guides/helpful tips about this. Then I will plan,make a list,make a checklist and should start by the end of this year.

Ta, I don't intend to be trollish, but I think it would be safer and better in the long-term to focus your time and energy on finding a more traditional (part-time since you are a student) job instead of gambling on something like this. If you're having trouble finding a job, you might want to look up tips on where to search for them, how to prepare for interviews, etc. Trying to see if you can get some kind of job through your school/university might be a good idea too.

Really, the kind of work that you would be trying to do would probably be very narrow (ie you're not developing much in terms of competence) and the odds of succeeding don't seem very high. Like others have said, there are plenty of women/men all over the world trying to make money this way, many of them with more experience in both technology and marketing than you. A lot of them are better at spelling and writing coherent sentences too, and that is bound to be a real issue if you want to convey a clear message.

I'm not trying to tell you what to do, but please consider what to do with your precious time and if this really is a good choice for your future.

Jettyke: Suggesting to someone who probably has no experience in economy and is living the life of a poor student to try out the stock market isn't uh, very nice I think. Your friend might be doing well for himself, but there's a good deal of luck involved (how long can you be sure that he'll be able to continue?) and just like with any kind of gambling, it's easy to get caught up in it and lose way more than you were ready to risk at the start. Especially if you're clueless about it and just stumble into it because of some random tip on the 'net.

i also agree, it would be much better for you to get a part time job and concentrate on your studies. If you're serious about entrepreneuship, you can always do a masters in business after you finish, and then set off with the right skills and a great product ready to make it work.

As for making money from a blog, i very much doubt it will be worth the time you'll put into it. As you've seen with AJATT, Khatz obviously couldn't make money from having advertising on his blog, that's why he's selling other stuff now. I also put ads on my blog when i first started, because i had wondered why it wasn't possible for Fabrice to do that with this site in the past. Well, i found out... i made $3 from around 5000 views. And ALL of that $3 came from people clicking the ads when people mentioned them in the thread here, out of kindness
Japanese language learners just aren't the right market for that kind of thing. Perhaps if you made a blog about something entirely boring and business oriented, you could make a little money. Otherwise, it's not so likely.

Similarly, with Forex and stuff like that, i highly doubt that it's going to be worth the time you invest in it. Small time trading has been around for a few years now... and the more people that participate in it, and easier the knowledge of how to win at it is to come by, the smaller edge you will have. It is also very risky. Don't believe success stories easily, there's many reasons people would want to say they're doing great, even if they're not.

Please, take it from me. I got into poker when i was at university, and learned the hard way. At first, it looks glamourous, and when you get a few big scores in, it feels great! And you see your friends winning $1000's or $10,000's of dollars, and you want to learn more, of course, and get better.

The reality, however, is very different. Yes, it is entirely possible to make money at poker (and probably Forex too), once you learn enough. But once you look more closely at win rates, return on investment, and so forth, and calculate the hours you've played, you find that you're actually making around minimum wage. If you want to make more than minimum wage, you have to either do sick amounts of work, or you have to take massive swings playing with a lower edge in higher buyin games (which you consequently play less of). I expect Forex is either going to be the same, or will be in the nearish future (i.e. by the time you learn, it already won't be worth it).

There's no free lunch. Work hard at college, work hard at your part time job, and you'll do good in the future, i'm sure.

Surreal Wrote:Ta, I don't intend to be trollish, but I think it would be safer and better in the long-term to focus your time and energy on finding a more traditional (part-time since you are a student) job instead of gambling on something like this. If you're having trouble finding a job, you might want to look up tips on where to search for them, how to prepare for interviews, etc. Trying to see if you can get some kind of job through your school/university might be a good idea too.

Really, the kind of work that you would be trying to do would probably be very narrow (ie you're not developing much in terms of competence) and the odds of succeeding don't seem very high. Like others have said, there are plenty of women/men all over the world trying to make money this way, many of them with more experience in both technology and marketing than you. A lot of them are better at spelling and writing coherent sentences too, and that is bound to be a real issue if you want to convey a clear message.

I'm not trying to tell you what to do, but please consider what to do with your precious time and if this really is a good choice for your future.

I actually have two part-time jobs going at the moment. The money isn't bad but nothing special. I'm trying to make an online business+blog to earn some money (I'm not trying to make myself millions but enough to pay off bills and keep a steady flow of income coming in)I intend to try it out for 1 year and see how it goes. If it succeeds (i.e. earning a decent amount) I intend to keep it up. The reason I'm interested in starting all this is because, at the moment jobs aren't as easier to get, then they used too. Even graduate students have trouble finding good jobs that pay good wages(they always find people to work for less money). I do have other fields I intend to go into but I don't see any reason why I can't start with something like this. I understand where your coming and helping me out by giving advice on the subject but I still want to go on with this. If I sound I'm giving a bad vibe from what I'm talking about, that wasn't my intention. Thanks for the advice though! Every bit of second opinions do help me out.

IceCream Wrote:i also agree, it would be much better for you to get a part time job and concentrate on your studies. If you're serious about entrepreneuship, you can always do a masters in business after you finish, and then set off with the right skills and a great product ready to make it work.

As for making money from a blog, i very much doubt it will be worth the time you'll put into it. As you've seen with AJATT, Khatz obviously couldn't make money from having advertising on his blog, that's why he's selling other stuff now. I also put ads on my blog when i first started, because i had wondered why it wasn't possible for Fabrice to do that with this site in the past. Well, i found out... i made $3 from around 5000 views. And ALL of that $3 came from people clicking the ads when people mentioned them in the thread here, out of kindness
Japanese language learners just aren't the right market for that kind of thing. Perhaps if you made a blog about something entirely boring and business oriented, you could make a little money. Otherwise, it's not so likely.

Similarly, with Forex and stuff like that, i highly doubt that it's going to be worth the time you invest in it. Small time trading has been around for a few years now... and the more people that participate in it, and easier the knowledge of how to win at it is to come by, the smaller edge you will have. It is also very risky. Don't believe success stories easily, there's many reasons people would want to say they're doing great, even if they're not.

Please, take it from me. I got into poker when i was at university, and learned the hard way. At first, it looks glamourous, and when you get a few big scores in, it feels great! And you see your friends winning $1000's or $10,000's of dollars, and you want to learn more, of course, and get better.

The reality, however, is very different. Yes, it is entirely possible to make money at poker (and probably Forex too), once you learn enough. But once you look more closely at win rates, return on investment, and so forth, and calculate the hours you've played, you find that you're actually making around minimum wage. If you want to make more than minimum wage, you have to either do sick amounts of work, or you have to take massive swings playing with a lower edge in higher buyin games (which you consequently play less of). I expect Forex is either going to be the same, or will be in the nearish future (i.e. by the time you learn, it already won't be worth it).

There's no free lunch. Work hard at college, work hard at your part time job, and you'll do good in the future, i'm sure.

Thanks for the comment Icecream and yes, I did read your whole post. I actually have two part-time jobs currently. One where I only work 1 day every other week+take shifts when they become available and the other one is 2-3 days on average(weekly). In terms of money, I'm fine at the moment. For school I will be taking a part-time load and finishing it off within the next 2 years, instead of paying for full tuition price load(it's deadly expensive plus add the textbooks that one buys but the teachers may never even use. It really becomes pointless and just becomes a money grab for the schools). I get where your coming from, there is no free lunch. I've known this for a very long time now. Whenever people see a way of achieving something in a fast manner, they usual jump the gun and say it won't work. In the case of an online business+blog, this isn't a get rich-quick scheme. I plan to be doing this for a few years. I don't want to make this personal but there was so many times throughout my life that people would say I couldn't do it and shouldn't but it wasn't that they were putting me down. They were just trying to look out for me. I've learned that there are risks worth taking and risks that are not worth taking. If I ask myself, this is one risk that I don't mind trying for a while. The key here is to invest a small amount of money(nothing substantial) to test the waters and see if it really is possible to make money online. Even though I'm learning Japanese, the blog may not even be about it. I'm trying to find key things that interest people. The market I'm trying to target is students and learners(this term is really general and can me anything).

I do plan to keep learning Japanese as well, no problem there but I'm also looking ahead. There is a lot of people my age(22 or younger and even older that don't know what to do in terms of work or life). I'm trying to think ahead and plan ahead(if possible). I do have other options if this doesn't turn out right but I'm not putting all my hopes in it but rather, I'm trying to find different ways of helping myself and trying to improve certain things. For example, when I look at Anki and see what the author has done to help people(for students,learners,etc). I want to follow suit in that direction. Even if the money might not be enough to be earning extra income.

I always tell myself to better inform myself and improve myself. There's always room in for improvement in everything. This is one of those times. I've always known that no matter how many times I have failed, I always want to keep coming back up. It's sad but a lot of people don't have this. Most people are impressed by this but when I think about it, helping other people is a long-term fact. You can't really change the things around you until you've changed yourself.

ahhh, sorry I got off topic here.

I think it's a good idea if you set out to make something of good quality and to have a learning experience, with making money as a bonus.

If you try it then you will learn about setting up a website, design and get some good writing practice, so even if no-one reads it it can still be useful for you.

I would stay clear of a 'this is how I learned Japanese' blog as there are way too many already... this is just an idea but I think a detailed, well-written, well-designed anki user guide site would be useful. There is info on the anki site but I don't think it's particularly user friendly. Not sure if you could make money from it but I think it could be good.

Also check out this podcast: http://www.43folders.com/2009/03/25/blogs-turbocharged by Merlin Mann and John Gruber.

It's about having a successful blog without making it shit with crappy ads, link baiting etc.

Reading your last post, it does sound like you have your head screwed on the right way. You seem to have the right attitude. And having a decently written blog could be pretty useful as a self marketing tool whether you make money from it or not.

I made some decent money about 6 years ago online. Enough to fly to the other side of world and buy some crazy shit.

I've been broke for years now though and it's significantly harder to make money online. Back then you could literally rent a server, throw together a site and re-sell web hosting. I had over 100 customers paying me monthly subscriptions before I was 15 years old...supporting them all got way out of hand when I was spending almost the whole day at school.

That's unthinkable to do now as it's become so competitive and you simply can't compete with the big players. All I can say is to do something you enjoy, and have an edge that gives reason to use your site over other sites. It doesn't need to be a unique idea if you can do it better than everybody else.

caivano Wrote:I think it's a good idea if you set out to make something of good quality and to have a learning experience, with making money as a bonus.

If you try it then you will learn about setting up a website, design and get some good writing practice, so even if no-one reads it it can still be useful for you.

I would stay clear of a 'this is how I learned Japanese' blog as there are way too many already... this is just an idea but I think a detailed, well-written, well-designed anki user guide site would be useful. There is info on the anki site but I don't think it's particularly user friendly. Not sure if you could make money from it but I think it could be good.

Also check out this podcast: http://www.43folders.com/2009/03/25/blogs-turbocharged by Merlin Mann and John Gruber.

It's about having a successful blog without making it shit with crappy ads, link baiting etc.

Yea I'm trying to stay away from "How I learned Japanese" blog, as there is seriously way too many out there. I'm trying to think of ways of making an exciting, visual-appealing blog. People usual don't have long-attention spans (it's true, even I have this but if its interesting, it's a whole different story). Making mini-guide+visual aspects included, would be something that people could easily want but the key here is, what exactly would make people keep coming back? I have to come up with what works and what doesn't work in respects to what I would provide to people. Something tells me I should head for guides that have a visual aspect of explaining things. For example, there are many guides out there for language learning and learning in general but I haven't seen visual guides. Expect it should get right to the point.

I agree that Anki could become more user friendly(the guides on the site) but I think the author is working on 2.0 right now and will probably be released in December I think or early next year(that's what I hear from the Anki forums). Thanks for the link, I will take all the essential info from it and add it to my plans.

nadiatims Wrote:Reading your last post, it does sound like you have your head screwed on the right way. You seem to have the right attitude. And having a decently written blog could be pretty useful as a self marketing tool whether you make money from it or not.

I think I should use the "Learning Japanese" as a way of marketing myself(not the blog I have right now but a new and way better blog). It would help people get a better idea of what type of person I am. Thanks for the kind words, it's always good to hear those.