does anyone know how to get this to work? I know some incompatible plugins can be force installed through various methods but I can't get this one to work. It looks like an invaluable plugin for kanji study.
2011-09-13, 1:26 pm
I'm sorry I cannot help you with activating the plugin, but I cannot resist mentioning that it is generally not deemed an invaluable plugin, but a superfluous and maybe even harmful one, for Heisig (and certain people here with whom I agree) recommend studying keyword -> kanji/hanzi. You might want to reconsider using it. But best of luck in any way.
Edited: 2011-09-13, 1:27 pm
2011-09-13, 6:03 pm
Why would this kanji be harmful to my studies? it seems like free review sessions since you're getting to see them while casually reading English articles. and plus the site says that you can change the keywords, so we could make it match up with Heisig's.
you're probably right, but I would like to know the basis of your opinion.
you're probably right, but I would like to know the basis of your opinion.
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2011-09-13, 6:25 pm
If you drill kanji->keyword you firmly embed in your mind a word for the Kanji that that Kanji may or may not actually have. Many of the keywords are secondary or tertiary meanings of the kanji that are only used in a handful of compounds and far from its primary meaning, or only certain shades of the keyword apply to the kanji's real meaning, etc.
This is fine for creating a mental handle for the character as long you're drilling keyword->character. Having a rare meaning in mind or an overly-broad or overly-narrow one won't really hurt you when you turn around and start drilling kanji->japanese word.
On the other hand, if you drill kanji->keyword you're strongly reinforcing the notion that the kanji -means- this word and only this word. Your memory will still create bonds in that way even if you remind yourself from time to time that you know better. Then when you go to start drilling kanji->japanese word... every time you see the kanji the keyword pops up immediately, and when it's the wrong meaning for the word you're trying to learn it's going to take time to unlearn.
Of course, you hope to be able to recall the keyword with only a little effort, but you don't want it jumping out at you first thing before the actual Japanese that you're trying to learn.
In summary, while we use story mnemonics to learn keyword->kanji, those keywords themselves are mnemonics, not vocabulary. The whole RTK method is one big mnemonic to hold a couple thousand kanji clearly in your mind in correct stroke order for long enough to learn the real vocabulary.
This is fine for creating a mental handle for the character as long you're drilling keyword->character. Having a rare meaning in mind or an overly-broad or overly-narrow one won't really hurt you when you turn around and start drilling kanji->japanese word.
On the other hand, if you drill kanji->keyword you're strongly reinforcing the notion that the kanji -means- this word and only this word. Your memory will still create bonds in that way even if you remind yourself from time to time that you know better. Then when you go to start drilling kanji->japanese word... every time you see the kanji the keyword pops up immediately, and when it's the wrong meaning for the word you're trying to learn it's going to take time to unlearn.
Of course, you hope to be able to recall the keyword with only a little effort, but you don't want it jumping out at you first thing before the actual Japanese that you're trying to learn.
In summary, while we use story mnemonics to learn keyword->kanji, those keywords themselves are mnemonics, not vocabulary. The whole RTK method is one big mnemonic to hold a couple thousand kanji clearly in your mind in correct stroke order for long enough to learn the real vocabulary.
2011-09-13, 8:20 pm
SomeCallMeChris who has given the clearest explanation I have seen yet as to why it is unnecessary to drill from Kanji to Keyword.
I however, quite like learning the keywords fluently. I find it frustrating to see a kanji, I know I can write, yet not recall the keyword. More importantly, I also like the sort of surreal poetry that the tranliterated kanji generate. This, I freely admit, it is a very private pleasure, with NOTHING to do with language learning. I am however, amused by such phrases as お邪魔します (じゃま ~ wicked witch) and 元気 (げんき ~ beginning spirIt.
I don't think it has hurt my Japanese, beyond the extra time that kanj ->keyword takes. When I look at Japanese, I see Japanese. By making an effort however, I can switch to Hesigese; suddenly I am subvocalising a string of rather strangely ordered English words.
Fun things to do: Read translations of Burroughs or JG Ballard's more experimental work using Heisigese.
Fantasy: A Heisig IME so I type English and all keywords are automatically converted to Chinese Characters. (Output ~ 吾 type 英 and 皆 鍵語 are automatically converted to 漢 字).
To summarize, studying from kanji to keyword isn't useful, but can be fun for the sort of people who like oulipo. IMHO, it isn't harmful either, beyond the time drilling kanji -> keyword takes and SomeCallMeChris's caveats are taken into account.
Off Topic: Speaking of oulipo, does anyone know of a piece of Japanese literature that uses all the jouyo kanji in the shortest way possible; a kanji equivalent of "the quick brown fox..."
Edit: I am spending more and more time reading Japanese and, for me, knowing the keywords is of some use in this endeavor. They provide a sort of crude semantic hook which enables me to carry on reading even if I don't entirely understand the content. First I read the entire piece through without using a dictionary, then I read it again, looking up words I don't know, then if it still holds my interest, I study the new vocabulary and read it through once more. Knowing the kanji is useful during the first skim when knowing the keywords enables me to take a guess at the words. This is of course quickly replaced by Japanese... I did read an entire story once saying "heaven well" every time I saw 天井 until I got to the end and looked up the word for ceiling (てんじょう)
I however, quite like learning the keywords fluently. I find it frustrating to see a kanji, I know I can write, yet not recall the keyword. More importantly, I also like the sort of surreal poetry that the tranliterated kanji generate. This, I freely admit, it is a very private pleasure, with NOTHING to do with language learning. I am however, amused by such phrases as お邪魔します (じゃま ~ wicked witch) and 元気 (げんき ~ beginning spirIt.
I don't think it has hurt my Japanese, beyond the extra time that kanj ->keyword takes. When I look at Japanese, I see Japanese. By making an effort however, I can switch to Hesigese; suddenly I am subvocalising a string of rather strangely ordered English words.
Fun things to do: Read translations of Burroughs or JG Ballard's more experimental work using Heisigese.
Fantasy: A Heisig IME so I type English and all keywords are automatically converted to Chinese Characters. (Output ~ 吾 type 英 and 皆 鍵語 are automatically converted to 漢 字).
To summarize, studying from kanji to keyword isn't useful, but can be fun for the sort of people who like oulipo. IMHO, it isn't harmful either, beyond the time drilling kanji -> keyword takes and SomeCallMeChris's caveats are taken into account.
Off Topic: Speaking of oulipo, does anyone know of a piece of Japanese literature that uses all the jouyo kanji in the shortest way possible; a kanji equivalent of "the quick brown fox..."
Edit: I am spending more and more time reading Japanese and, for me, knowing the keywords is of some use in this endeavor. They provide a sort of crude semantic hook which enables me to carry on reading even if I don't entirely understand the content. First I read the entire piece through without using a dictionary, then I read it again, looking up words I don't know, then if it still holds my interest, I study the new vocabulary and read it through once more. Knowing the kanji is useful during the first skim when knowing the keywords enables me to take a guess at the words. This is of course quickly replaced by Japanese... I did read an entire story once saying "heaven well" every time I saw 天井 until I got to the end and looked up the word for ceiling (てんじょう)
Edited: 2011-09-13, 8:41 pm
2011-09-13, 9:31 pm
Harpagornes Wrote:Fantasy: A Heisig IME so I type English and all keywords are automatically converted to Chinese Characters. (Output ~ 吾 type 英 and 皆 鍵語 are automatically converted to 漢 字).Doesn't this sentence just show the problem with taking the keywords too seriously? If you look at that sentence with some knowledge of Japanese it looks ridiculous:
Although I know 吾 is an alternative way of writing 我, I've never actually seen it used. There's no real 100% equivalent of the English 'I' in Japanese, but the closest is 私, certainly not われ.
英 by itself makes me think of England, not the English language. 英気 also comes to mind.
鍵 refers to a real key, not the way the word 'key' is used in 'keyword.'
語 makes me think of language first and foremost, not word.
Edited: 2011-09-13, 9:34 pm