http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americ...75789.html

US president Barack Obama said bin Laden, the most-wanted fugitive on the US list, has been killed on Sunday in a US operation in the Pakistani city of Abbottabad, about 150km north of Islamabad.

I gotta say, while I am somewhat glad that this has happened, people celebrating in the streets is basically saying, "Please Bomb Us More!" to Al Qaeda.

I kind of imagine it similar to if someone swooped in and picked up Obama, shot him, then took his body off and celebrated in the streets. Americans wouldn't be so happy about it, so I can't imagine the Taliban will have a great reaction to this at all.

zachandhobbes Wrote:I gotta say, while I am somewhat glad that this has happened, people celebrating in the streets is basically saying, "Please Bomb Us More!" to Al Qaeda.

I kind of imagine it similar to if someone swooped in and picked up Obama, shot him, then took his body off and celebrated in the streets. Americans wouldn't be so happy about it, so I can't imagine the Taliban will have a great reaction to this at all.

Was thinking the same thing.

What I also find funny is that people seem to think this is the end of Al Qaeda and terrorism...

Why is his death significant?

prink Wrote:Why is his death significant?

Troll be trollin'

The war will continue, civilians will continue to be killed, and terrorism will continue as long as Americans occupy the Middle East. Hurrah.

Thing is, terrorism isn't going to end if we stop occupying it. They are kinda like the Japanese pre-WW2 - "[Extremist] Muslim Caliphate must dominate the rest of the world, destroy all western powers"

Al-qaeda activity in Afghanistan and Iraq was practically nil prior to invasion.

You know you want to sing it

zachandhobbes Wrote:Thing is, terrorism isn't going to end if we stop occupying it. They are kinda like the Japanese pre-WW2 - "[Extremist] Muslim Caliphate must dominate the rest of the world, destroy all western powers"

Sure, there's always going to be a small group of extremists. But it's when they are able to attract support from a larger and more moderate population at home and abroad that terrorism become a serious and ongoing problem. I don't suppose anything the US did or didn't do would ever have changed bin Laden's opinion; but there are a lot of people out there who can and have been influenced for better or worse by US actions in the middle east.

NoSleepTilFluent Wrote:

prink Wrote:Why is his death significant?

Troll be trollin'

Not really... I thought the same when I heard the news this morning. What does it change?

Bin Laden was a very unique and charismatic individual who's death will leave a big hole in international terrorism which will be very difficult to fill, if at all.

It's a huge morale shock to the terrorists and a big boost to the alliance who was hunting him down. I don't think anyone is implying that terrorism is going to stop tomorrow.

I asked, because I don't understand the responses I've seen.
http://www.google.com/search?q=osama+bin...CBkQ_AUoBQ

Now that Osama bin Laden is dead, the media has been constantly replaying the collapse of the Twin Towers while U.S. propaganda points to possible retaliation from terrorist groups. This is all too familiar. The only thing I've seen his death do so far is revive post-9/11 fears and ultranationalism in the U.S. Why? These are the same feelings that were exploited to justify the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq under the false pretenses of liberating them from oppressive regimes. For these feelings to reappear amidst the current budget crisis and massive nationwide budget cuts, what does it mean for the U.S.? An even worse economic recession? Further prolonged war?

Military expansion into another country? Say, Libya?
http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/libya...adens-fate

Why is his death significant?

prink Wrote:Why is his death significant?

Indeed.

Is there actually any proper evidence linking Osama to 9/11? Remember he denied involvement in every video he released, except those 2 very suspicious confession tapes.

Also assuming he's the leader of al-queda, wouldn't it have been better to capture him, gain information on terrorist activities and then try him in court and go death penalty? But that was never going to happen as there's not enough hard evidence to go to court - better just to shoot him in the head and then claim victory over terrorism.

I'm also suspicious about the timing of this, as it coincides with America's (rumoured) plans to pull out of Afghanistan / Iran. Lucky coincidence..right? With this event both wars have a happy conclusion, rather than just abruptly ending and seeming like they've been for nothing..

zachandhobbes Wrote:Thing is, terrorism isn't going to end if we stop occupying it. They are kinda like the Japanese pre-WW2 - "[Extremist] Muslim Caliphate must dominate the rest of the world, destroy all western powers"

I see what you're getting at, but this comparison doesn't really work on a couple of levels. All you're doing is simply linking two groups to a common enemy. Most countries that go to war with the U.S. are anti-American. Also, Imperial Japan wasn't anti-American until the 1940 embargo. Although Imperial Japan had its run-ins with the U.S. in regards to U.S. immigration exclusion laws, Imperial Japan tried very hard to avoid war with the U.S. up until that point. Similarly, the "terrorists" the U.S. is fighting in Afghanistan were not anti-American until after the U.S.'s involvement in the Soviet-Afghan War left them stranded. I'm not as familiar with that enough to paraphrase, so I'll just link the Wikipedia article. The point is that neither group was anti-American until the U.S. gave them reason to be.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen#...nd_support

Rather, resistance in the Middle East in today's wars is more comparable to China's War of Resistance against Imperial Japan. Like the Chinese nationalists (the ideology, not the political party) had done, Afghan and Iraqi nationalists are simply fighting for their country. Their nationalism is fueled by hatred toward the invading army. The Chinese resistance was also not capable of matching Imperial Japan militarily, so they were forced to wage a war of attrition and heavily made use of guerrilla warfare tactics. This is comparable to the Afghan and Iraqi resistance against the U.S. military. Alternatively, similar to Imperial Japan's war in China, America's war on terror is fueled by fear and propaganda-manufactured nationalism.

Similar to how the U.S. has portrayed its actions in the Middle East, Imperial Japan portrayed itself as "liberating" the countries which it invaded and occupied while proceeding to install puppet governments and exploit their resources.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Eas...ity_Sphere

Since the Iraq War began in 2003, Historians have been constantly drawn parallels between Imperial Japan and modern America. Here is one of many examples (but the only free one I can think of offhand): http://www.japanfocus.org/-Prasenjit-Duara/1715

aphasiac Wrote:

prink Wrote:Why is his death significant?

Indeed.

Is there actually any proper evidence linking Osama to 9/11? Remember he denied involvement in every video he released, except those 2 very suspicious confession tapes.

Also assuming he's the leader of al-queda, wouldn't it have been better to capture him, gain information on terrorist activities and then try him in court and go death penalty? But that was never going to happen as there's not enough hard evidence to go to court - better just to shoot him in the head and then claim victory over terrorism.

I'm also suspicious about the timing of this, as it coincides with America's (rumoured) plans to pull out of Afghanistan / Iran. Lucky coincidence..right? With this event both wars have a happy conclusion, rather than just abruptly ending and seeming like they've been for nothing..

I was actually looking into that today and found this somewhat unrelated but interesting article. The author is a university professor from what I remember.
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/03/13...bin-elvis/

Those coincidences do strike me as odd as well, but there's no way we could ever know though. I don't even know what the government is trying to tell us that the wars are about anymore. WMDs? "Operation Iraqi Freedom?" Terrorism? It's just been a circle of lies, so what makes this any different? Even if it went down exactly as Obama said, we have no reason to believe that this is anything more than another propaganda ploy considering what's happened in the past ten years.

The best thing they could have done: killing him and afterwards burning his corpse lol No evidence - no truth? I see that critical.. they should have taken him as a hostile.
Btw, I passed the driver's test

aphasiac Wrote:I'm also suspicious about the timing of this, as it coincides with America's (rumoured) plans to pull out of Afghanistan / Iran. Lucky coincidence..right? With this event both wars have a happy conclusion, rather than just abruptly ending and seeming like they've been for nothing..

Pull out of Iran... you mean Iraq right?

dizmox Wrote:Pull out of Iran... you mean Iraq right?

weird, I'm sure I wrote Iraq...it's a conspiracy I tell you..!

Did they actually have a body? Also, are they 100% sure it's him (DNA)?

I'd need to see a corpse before I say he's dead. Should be interesting to see how this develops.

Yes they had a body, then they dumped it in the sea after a Muslim Navy Chaplin said a prayer or something.

And they got DNA. They will probably release a photo eventually to calm people down.

This has been the most consistent, rational response I've seen yet.
http://www.japanprobe.com/2011/05/02/jap...bin-laden/

Personally, I'm quite happy he's dead, although I wouldn't party in the streets yet. It's a significant victory against al-Qaeda. A few more of the bosses would be good, though.

They shouldn't have dumped the body in the sea.
Somebody might find it.

They should've cremated the body and spread
the ashes across the sea.

chamcham Wrote:They shouldn't have dumped the body in the sea.
Somebody might find it.

They should've cremated the body and spread
the ashes across the sea.

cremating the body is against muslim tradition

that will just make everyone mad