Hey guys, I have a question for you. I recently signed up for a level-check by email (the check will be in person of course). The level-check is for an Immersion school (meaning they only teach Japanese in Japanese). The person asked me to bring past materials that I've used to study from. The question here is:

What do I exactly bring? My past materials were Japanese for Busy People (that's when I took a level one course like 3 and half years ago) and now my materials are native materials (books,mangs,games,animes,the internet,etc). I also wrote that I'm good at reading and listening but my speaking isn't good yet due to me not using it often or regularly. I also said I can write but not really well.

I basically toned it down, so I don't give the impression I'm better than I really am.

If it were me, I'd probably bring some of the more challenging native books (not manga, unless you haven't studied from that many books), and some of the music. I guess it'd probably to make sense to bring the highest level textbook you've worked with, just in case they're looking for that.

JimmySeal Wrote:If it were me, I'd probably bring some of the more challenging native books (not manga, unless you haven't studied from that many books), and some of the music. I guess it'd probably to make sense to bring the highest level textbook you've worked with, just in case they're looking for that.

Personally, I haven't actually studied from a lot of books (physically). I do have a few real JP novels but a lot of manga. Plus I study from anki and learn from native material. So that's why I'm not too sure what to bring.

It really boils down to: I've learned a lot via electronic resources and using applications like rikaisama, 三省堂,etc

[Zgarbas]

Bring a USB stick with a copy your study database(including anki decks, maybe?) and explain your study system?

A better question is, what do they need the resources for? Is it to test you out of specific resources or to implement new material in their teaching programme in case they see someone with exceptional results but unfamiliar resources?

I'd print off a few examples of articles from sites you like to read and excerpts from books you've read recently. I imagine these would be easier for the the interviewer to look over and discuss than a USB full of everything you've ever used, though I guess you might as well take one of those along as well.

Zgarbas Wrote:Bring a USB stick with a copy your study database(including anki decks, maybe?) and explain your study system?

A better question is, what do they need the resources for? Is it to test you out of specific resources or to implement new material in their teaching programme in case they see someone with exceptional results but unfamiliar resources?

They said it's to place me in the course most suited to my level. There are 9 levels they offer. I'm going there this upcoming Thursday (made an appointment). I guess they want to see what type of material I learn from. Maybe I should just be honest with them and see what they say. I don't want to lie and say I used textbooks and so forth.

Splatted Wrote:I'd print off a few examples of articles from sites you like to read and excerpts from books you've read recently. I imagine these would be easier for the the interviewer to look over and discuss than a USB full of everything you've ever used, though I guess you might as well take one of those along as well.

I guess I'll print off some news articles and things about manga/anime and games. Maybe some music lyrics from things I like to listen to. I might as well explain about Anki (who knows, they might know about it and promote it). I'll just be as honest as I can be.

Those instructions sound like they're aimed at beginners. Just bring your current study materials as well as any certificates you might have of your Japanese ability. Bring the latest stuff you're working from as well as an example of something you find difficult or struggle with. Most of their students probably only have a copy of Genki 1 or something so those instructions make sense.

As for describing your entire study system, I would just say that you review using flashcards most of the time and tend to learn vocabulary quickly. The rate at which you can learn new vocab using Anki will be far ahead of other people generally.

Japanese teachers also tend to be way too nice to students and not push them hard enough. Be careful they don't place you below your actual level. They're very likely to do that. As a rule I would fight to get into the class one level above the one they actually suggest.

Your computer-based study habits are going to make short work of any of the course material they're using, and you'll find yourself getting near-perfect scores on lots of things thanks to Anki. This is going to make you annoying to some of your teachers who are used to preparing course material at a slower pace.

Kanji lessons when I was on study abroad were hilarious. The teacher said we needed to learn something like 25 new kanji a week or something. The other students groaned, grumbled, moaned, complained, and tried to bargain with her. Meanwhile I was already past 1000 in Heisig with my average pace being more than 25 new kanji per week.

erlog Wrote:Those instructions sound like they're aimed at beginners. Just bring your current study materials as well as any certificates you might have of your Japanese ability. Bring the latest stuff you're working from as well as an example of something you find difficult or struggle with. Most of their students probably only have a copy of Genki 1 or something so those instructions make sense.

As for describing your entire study system, I would just say that you review using flashcards most of the time and tend to learn vocabulary quickly. The rate at which you can learn new vocab using Anki will be far ahead of other people generally.
Makes sense, so just stating I use a flashcard system to learn to read, understand and break down vocabulary/sentences in order to fully understand them.

Japanese teachers also tend to be way too nice to students and not push them hard enough. Be careful they don't place you below your actual level. They're very likely to do that. As a rule I would fight to get into the class one level above the one they actually suggest


Your computer-based study habits are going to make short work of any of the course material they're using, and you'll find yourself getting near-perfect scores on lots of things thanks to Anki. This is going to make you annoying to some of your teachers who are used to preparing course material at a slower pace.

Kanji lessons when I was on study abroad were hilarious. The teacher said we needed to learn something like 25 new kanji a week or something. The other students groaned, grumbled, moaned, complained, and tried to bargain with her. Meanwhile I was already past 1000 in Heisig with my average pace being more than 25 new kanji per ]week.

True, the school does cost a lot of money to take, so I'll just be checking the school out and decide if I really need it or not.

I have a strong feeling it will happen to me but we will just have to see. (Want to see what they mean by full immersion). I have a feeling they are referring to speaking/listening.

Well when I was doing their online questionnaire it said I should do a level check instead of a trail lesson (It basically said "If you have checked off all these boxes, then a level-check is the right for you"). I guess I'll bring some manga books, some JPN novels,some of my reading material I learn from and just show them some of my flashcards (I hope no random cards pop up, because I have put some random vocabulary in there).


I remember when I took a level one class. The students complained all the time about how hard it is to learn all these things. When I look back to that particular time, I can only say this "What was I thinking?"

Is this a japanese immersion school for learning other subjects, or a school for learning japanese?
If you can comfortably read novels and watch tv and things, I don't think you'll gain much from schooling. You could just spend the time you would be at the school watching TV/movies ad talking with japanese ppl. If you're after some kind of certification, take N1 or meet with a japanese person (professor or teacher) and convince them to write you a reference to the effect of "this guy is fully functional in japanese. signed japanese native."

Or you could spend the money on a trip to Japan, and immerse there.
Is there a specific purpose for needing to improve your speaking ability? Because once you have a sufficient base (and I suspect you do) you'll develop spoken fluency very quickly if you ever placed in a japanese environment and really needed to (were to move to japan for example).

I don't know what ta1212121's IRL personality is, but if he's not a naturally outgoing person, then an immersion school might be more productive for improving his speaking than going to Japan and talking to random strangers. Might cost quite a bit less too.

On the other hand, trying to improve one's speaking abilities by talking to other learners is somewhat questionable.

nadiatims Wrote:Is this a japanese immersion school for learning other subjects, or a school for learning japanese?
If you can comfortably read novels and watch tv and things, I don't think you'll gain much from schooling. You could just spend the time you would be at the school watching TV/movies ad talking with japanese ppl. If you're after some kind of certification, take N1 or meet with a japanese person (professor or teacher) and convince them to write you a reference to the effect of "this guy is fully functional in japanese. signed japanese native."

Or you could spend the money on a trip to Japan, and immerse there.
Is there a specific purpose for needing to improve your speaking ability? Because once you have a sufficient base (and I suspect you do) you'll develop spoken fluency very quickly if you ever placed in a japanese environment and really needed to (were to move to japan for example).

I might be able to actually get a reference but it will take time. I do volunteer at a Japanese place (foundation) and might just volunteer at another one (because it's really close to where I live and I can easily get more involved. Plus I know they have programs for getting into Japan too).

I am planning on taking N1 this December and I'm not sure if that school has certification but the only reason why I am thinking about taking it is: I don't get practice speaking and having immersion class+the programs they offer alongside with it could help me.

JimmySeal Wrote:I don't know what ta1212121's IRL personality is, but if he's not a naturally outgoing person, then an immersion school might be more productive for improving his speaking than going to Japan and talking to random strangers. Might cost quite a bit less too.

On the other hand, trying to improve one's speaking abilities by talking to other learners is somewhat questionable.

I don't have problems talking to people but like anyone else, speaking in a different language is obviously not the easiest thing for me but when I think about it, it's not too bad actually.

Well I'll see what they offer and what might be the best route for me. If you guys are wondering, I'll probably go to Japan within 1 year just to visit (1-2 month visit). I have to visit before I think about working and living there (teaching English is probably the easiest way in but I'll see what other options are out there)

There's not even any need to go to Japan. You can get fluent in speaking just over Skype if you really want to.

I've read your posts for a while, and I think given your level you'd be doing yourself a disservice by sticking to artificial learning methods rather than just talking to natives.

I guess I better provide some more info: http://www.aitas.ca/levels/index.html

@Dizmox

You know I might just go all out and see where it takes me, if I continue it for 6 months or so (talking about speaking).

One 80-minute class/week? That's not really what I'd call "full immersion." I thought you were talking about a place like this:
http://www.middlebury.edu/ls

JimmySeal Wrote:One 80-minute class/week? That's not really what I'd call "full immersion." I thought you were talking about a place like this:
http://www.middlebury.edu/ls

I read that one and that's what we call Full Immersion but I guess this one is local for me. I'm still researching, so I haven't decided on anything yet.

looking at the prices, it seems you're paying 25$ for an hour of conversation in a group, or about 45$ an hour for individual lessons. Not massively expensive but not super cheap either. Japanese people can talk with Filipinos for like 500 yen an hour these days using services like rarejob.

couple of things:
-the group lessons are likely to filled with beginners
-the teachers (having to deal with beginners) are likely to be dumbing down their speech a lot. Hardly a place to get used to 'natural' conversation if that is your goal.

You could just find a variety of people to talk on sharedtalk.com or similar. Advantages:
- don't like the partner. find a new one.
- much cheaper
- don't have to travel to the school
- you can choose your own schedule

The advantage of the school would be no bs. The teachers are paid to talk with you in japanese and are good at what they do, in theory at least. In reality they may just be underpaid exchange students and the like who really don't give a crap about the job.

I would go the free route if I were you. If your japanese is decent enough, you really don't need to pay people to speak with you in japanese. I'm bet there's some japanese ex-pat communities/clubs you could infiltrate if you set your mind to it.

nadiatims Wrote:looking at the prices, it seems you're paying 25$ for an hour of conversation in a group, or about 45$ an hour for individual lessons. Not massively expensive but not super cheap either. Japanese people can talk with Filipinos for like 500 yen an hour these days using services like rarejob.

couple of things:
-the group lessons are likely to filled with beginners
-the teachers (having to deal with beginners) are likely to be dumbing down their speech a lot. Hardly a place to get used to 'natural' conversation if that is your goal.

You could just find a variety of people to talk on sharedtalk.com or similar. Advantages:
- don't like the partner. find a new one.
- much cheaper
- don't have to travel to the school
- you can choose your own schedule

The advantage of the school would be no bs. The teachers are paid to talk with you in japanese and are good at what they do, in theory at least. In reality they may just be underpaid exchange students and the like who really don't give a crap about the job.

I would go the free route if I were you. If your japanese is decent enough, you really don't need to pay people to speak with you in japanese. I'm bet there's some japanese ex-pat communities/clubs you could infiltrate if you set your mind to it.

I know for conversation clubs and all those things are actually available for free of charge at a university not too far away from me. I think my problem is to why I'm not gaining any good traction with my speaking is because I don't get enough time to practice with native speakers. There is sites that just focus on speaking Japanese. So maybe I should just focus on that skill and see where it takes me.

Thanks for the advice, it's appreciated.

to improve speaking here is my formula (didn't invent it just found it online somewhere and modified for my needs)

task: give a speech about a given topic in Japanese

instructions: take note card/flash card and write some reminders and basic info
about your chosen topic using key words or short reminders
e.g.
MY FLASH CARD NOTES
topic: 私のいぬ
points to talk about
彼はたのし
はやい
友達会いました
彼は私の紙食べました


after I have this made up I stand up on my bed or whatever other stage I can find and try to give a fluent speech in japanese I would say something like

私の犬はとてもたのしです。いつも私はいぬとあそびました。
彼がはやいです。
etc. etc.

at first you'll stutter through it. when you make a mistake finish the sentence you were on and then go back the beggining. continue till you've given a speech on your dog 10 times without any major mistakes.

choose a different topic every day and you'll soon be able to talk about anything
without problems.

the scientific hypothosis behind the idea is that the human mind learns by association. just knowing the parts that make up a sentence isn't enough to speak fluently, but by practicing speaking about a topic your mind will become better at putting sentences together in your mouth because when you start talking about dogs all the sentences about dogs you know will then be at your disposal. good luck.

if you use this method please get back to me and tell me if it worked well for you.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a proffesional nor am I claiming by any means to be fully fluent, I have not used these methods out to their fullest end and the result is more speculation then empirical.

semperanimus Wrote:to improve speaking here is my formula (didn't invent it just found it online somewhere and modified for my needs)

task: give a speech about a given topic in Japanese

instructions: take note card/flash card and write some reminders and basic info
about your chosen topic using key words or short reminders
e.g.
MY FLASH CARD NOTES
topic: 私のいぬ
points to talk about
彼はたのし
はやい
友達会いました
彼は私の紙食べました


after I have this made up I stand up on my bed or whatever other stage I can find and try to give a fluent speech in japanese I would say something like

私の犬はとてもたのしです。いつも私はいぬとあそびました。
彼がはやいです。
etc. etc.

at first you'll stutter through it. when you make a mistake finish the sentence you were on and then go back the beggining. continue till you've given a speech on your dog 10 times without any major mistakes.

choose a different topic every day and you'll soon be able to talk about anything
without problems.

the scientific hypothosis behind the idea is that the human mind learns by association. just knowing the parts that make up a sentence isn't enough to speak fluently, but by practicing speaking about a topic your mind will become better at putting sentences together in your mouth because when you start talking about dogs all the sentences about dogs you know will then be at your disposal. good luck.

if you use this method please get back to me and tell me if it worked well for you.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a proffesional nor am I claiming by any means to be fully fluent, I have not used these methods out to their fullest end and the result is more speculation then empirical.

Thanks for the comment, I really appreciate it. The post you posted makes complete sense to me. When I think about all the knowledge I know, it really comes down to breaking it all down into smaller parts. (You gave the example of your dog). I can easily extend that to other things like the weather,time,news,etc,etc.

I'm experimenting with a few things but I'll get back to you on this.

@semperanimus: That sounds useful, thanks for the idea. Also, it's たのしい/楽しい not たのし。