Jarvik7 Wrote:What I did when I taught at JHS was get copies of the textbooks the students used and read through those. I also studied for kanji kentei and took it with the kids. Of course I also used Anki (on my phone, though they offered me a laptop).

That's quite ingenious, surely they wouldn't pick up the OP for reading the students' textbooks, not sure about Anki though.

The hard part is getting the books, since they aren't for sale and schools don't generally have spares sitting around. The head teachers/principals etc liked me (they always like people that they can speak to in Japanese) so they special ordered a full set for me after I asked about it, which I still have. Don't bother trying to go through a JTE though. They seem to often dislike ALTs, for many reasons.

Also, to the OP:
If your Japanese level isn't at an upper intermediate/advanced level yet, there is nothing wrong with using a textbook.

Thankfully the cult has mostly woken up, but AJATT isn't a god. 100% Japanese is no better than 70% or even 30%. The important thing is to consume media when you're ready, which many people seem to neglect. In short, you can use a textbook at work and read manga on the train/at home and it'll be of no detriment.

Jarvik7 Wrote:Reading a manga/magazine/novel etc during working hours looks unprofessional and you shouldn't do it except maybe during lunch. It makes everyone else feel uncomfortable and it's especially bad if the students see it. That doesn't mean you have to stare at Genki or whatever though.

What I did when I taught at JHS was get copies of the textbooks the students used and read through those. I also studied for kanji kentei and took it with the kids. Of course I also used Anki (on my phone, though they offered me a laptop).

The hard part is getting the books, since they aren't for sale and schools don't generally have spares sitting around. The people in head teachers/principals etc liked me (they always like people that they can speak to in Japanese) so they special ordered a full set for me after I asked about it, which I still have. Don't bother trying to go through a JTE though. They seem to often dislike ALTs, for many reasons.

Yeah, definitely get in a situation like this if you can. I spent a lot of time at my BOE before school was in session and the head of my BOE was right behind my desk. He gave me the kokugo textbook sets for JHS and elementary school from the two previous years. Now, he could have been using me as a way to make room on his bookshelf, but it worked out well for both of us either way and helps keep a good relationship going beyond just your JTEs, like Jarvis mentioned.

If you can show interest in something in which the teachers (non-JTEs) are involved and ask about it, I think that they will appreciate it and try to help you out (extra textbooks, old textbooks, etc).

Ask if it's okay if you go observe people's classes. I've been told that I'm welcome anywhere at anytime and I've asked if I could go to other teachers' classes (hello ichinensei kokugo) and been warmly welcomed. Also, it's good for the kids because they get more exposure to you and your western ways. Also, if you have any special education classes that might be studying a lower level of Japanese or at a slower pace than the other classes, check that out too, if you can. I certainly do. It's a really great part of my day when I go because it's such a small class so there is plenty of time for questions and interacting with some of the students closer. And it ups their social status because they get to spend more time with the ALT than the other students.

jacf29 Wrote:Just to add a little more info. It's a junior highschool. The library is not open all the time. Only for like 30 minutes a day because they are scared the children will steal books from the library.

Asriel what is the name of that book you mentioned? It blocked out the word when you entered it.

They ALT before me was a dude who learned Japanese to fluent level from textbooks at work, although his family was half Japanese. So they must think that is the only thing that counts as studying.

And the bathroom is all Japanese style. No way I am going to stand in the stall for any period of time longer than a few minutes. Plus they complained to my company before about me leaving the staff room for longer than 10 minutes and not telling anyone where I was.

LOL, ALT life is hilariously, deliciously humorous. (I'm so sorry, but I honestly feel you!!!) BTW, book off is a good place to start (Kanzen Master has a deck you can get here that would go well with the book. You could read that.)

jacf29, i guess you could try to convince the teacher that's giving you a hard time, that vocabulary acquisition is still a part of language learning as a whole. But i don't think you get to convince her to let you read 漫画 or 雑誌 in general. Although you know that you are trying to learn the language that way, it is still not so that the other person would consider this studying. And i guess this is where she is coming from.

Get yourself some books from a field of interest to you, 歴史, use your 電子辞書 to translate stuff, and get on with it. You would have the best of both worlds, a topic of interest to study, and the acquisition of words, vocab, grammar and what not.

Eastwood Wrote:“At first reading, I only write out words that I manage to understand, that is, words whose meaning I have been able to figure out from context. Naturally, I do not write them out in isolation, but in the context they appeared. It is only after a second or third reading that I look up words unknown to me. Even then, I do not look up each and every one. With those that I record in my notebook, I include the vortex of meaning supplied by the book or by any contemporary dictionary worthy of the name.”

I have been doing this too. Reading a page of a book, copy out the words, then doing the dictionary lookup and read the whole page again. Nobody taught me that, i just started doing it, and it makes reading a whole lot faster.

Eastwood Wrote:Get one of Kató's whole book here in pdf format: http://tesl-ej.org/ej45/fr1abs.html

Thanks for the book, just what i need right now.

thecite Wrote:That's news to me (obviously I wasn't serious). But yes, I would love to tell an ignorant person such as that to f**k off; I've had many exasperating experiences with stubborn people who try and tell me how to study.

You could try not to argue and ignore them. And i perfectly well understand your thought about telling them to get lost sometimes. Because it sometimes is tedious to have an argument with people who think they know it all. But if you neglect anything somebody tells you, only following your method, you might miss some valuable piece of advice. Or some other method you could try to use that might help you in your studies. In the end it's up to you to say, go away, i know what i am doing or taking advice, at least sometimes.

I agree that reading high-level materials before you're ready is unproductive, and reading manga/novels at work looks unprofessional in any case. I certainly don't think she's a 'f**king sexless idiot'.

It's okay talking about fun, but there are times when you have to be realistic. Is there anything more tedious than reviewing Heisig? Why does this sort of "effort" suddenly become unacceptable when it comes to using a non-SRS resource that will help you measurably progress your studies at a set pace?

This is the perfect opportunity to use the likes of 完全マスター + AB*JG and Unicom's 読解/聴解 workbooks. It's taken me forever to do 完全マスター, so I'd be happy to be "forced" to do it while getting paid. You could get your grammar up to N1 level in no time. Maybe you could explain how Anki fits in with memorising KM.

The book I mentioned is "Eigo ha Zettai, Benkyou suru na!"
I don't think it'll win over the hearts of those trying to get you to stop reading comics at work though.

I agree, though...reading magazines/manga wouldn't look very professional at all -- especially if you're not looking up words/SRSing them, or what have you. Especially if you're still at a level where textbooks would be more appropriate anyway. No newspapers kind of surprised me, though.

Getting ahold of some kokugo textbooks sounded like a great idea! You're studying Japanese -in Japanese- and it gives the impression that you are studying, and not just being lazy.

Asriel Wrote:No newspapers kind of surprised me, though.

I thought that at first, but if you try to imagine one of the Japanese staff sitting there reading yesterday's football/baseball scores, it doesn't seem any more professional than reading a novel.

I mentioned some workbooks, but really there are plenty of books to occupy the OP, like [i]Making Sense of Japanese, Onomatopoeia, Basic Connections etc. The situation is only a problem if the OP truly believes simply reading manga and watching anime is going to lead to fluency. Perhaps it's a better idea to explore some of the resources out there instead of being obsessed by a stupid acronym.

It's worth pointing out, before forum-crucifying the OP's evil overlords, that you might not be getting a comprehensive picture of the situation based on the picture they're painting. Just a thought...

I think you'd be better off linking to one of Stephen Krashen's textbooks. As I recall, he mentions something about enjoyment being critical to language learning success.

http://www.sdkrashen.com/Principles_and_...index.html

vgambit Wrote:I think you'd be better off linking to one of Stephen Krashen's textbooks. As I recall, he mentions something about enjoyment being critical to language learning success.

http://www.sdkrashen.com/Principles_and_...index.html

true

Maybe you could find some Japanese nonfiction you like?
That 英語は絶対、勉強するな (Absolutely Don't Study English) book mentioned in this thread sounds interesting.

Nagareboshi Wrote:You could try not to argue and ignore them. And i perfectly well understand your thought about telling them to get lost sometimes. Because it sometimes is tedious to have an argument with people who think they know it all. But if you neglect anything somebody tells you, only following your method, you might miss some valuable piece of advice. Or some other method you could try to use that might help you in your studies. In the end it's up to you to say, go away, i know what i am doing or taking advice, at least sometimes.

They just wanted me to study the regular way, textbooks etc, which I did for 5 years or so, so I was well accustomed with how useless their advice was.

Textbooks aren't all bad, but it's how you utilize it as a tool that really makes the difference. If you've done 5 years and got little out of them you just haven't turned up the difficulty a notch or paid enough due to memorization.

Obviously, at a low level you can plunge into manga, but I know the exact type of situation you are in as some of my friends are too. Your in a strict school and your doing 2-5 hours or less with 3 hours down time. You want to use the down time to level up your Japanese, but the school is not on board with what you want to do. In this situation your stuck doing things outside of work, but you don't want to reduce your social time, right? All I can say is good luck.

Work is work in this country and ALT work is pretty much strict as you can get. The reality is you won't be able to change your supervisor or whatever's mind if she's made it up already. What you might want to try is concertrating on what you can fix. A) Why not work on your writing (lesson plans, etc.)? You can do it by hand and get your co-workers help with it, if they have time. B) You can work on your speaking and listening. Why not, just absorb more words for later right. C) You can work on your reading by doing readings books or going through books for Japanese who are learning to read English - just turn it around. Half the time it's about making it look legit - just find a way to make it work (how do you think I get away with sleeping at work, lol.)

P.s., AJATT is just the basics. You've gotta go well beyond that to find the real technique, you know. There is a world beyond AJATT that includes and excludes AJATT methodology, but don't take my word for it: Mine these forums for ideas and try them. You'll find a way, beyond just the AJATT concept (there are more than enough people who have integrated and gone beyond AJATT or textbook learning. 4 or 5 that I have ruthlessly stolen from have posted on this very post.)

No, I'm out of school now, and did AJATT the last 2 years I was at school which helped me get a very high grade for Japanese.

Well I'd disagree that AJATT is 'just the basics', consuming a heck load of media is what has got me to where I am now. On the contrary I'd say that workbooks, textbooks etc are just the basics.

Edit: And I do use a wide range of tools and techniques, but I lump these all together under the umbrella of AJATT.

What seriously, THERE IS NO INFORMATION ABOUT THIS IN JAPANESE?


There has to be!
Well, like, at least Someone has to have written something about AJATT in a blog or something! Or am I wrong?


Anyway, if no one knows anything online, then I'm gonna search for it myself.


Where are all the milestone achievers and fluent people on this forum, when they are needed? Can seriously no one write something good & summarizing in Japanese?



Because it's just TOO PAINFUL to watch how my Japanese friends are going to english classes, are talking about studying English, they need English for talking to other exchange students and for their future job, not to mention the shitload of information.

But their progress is just horrible ! They avoid English and don't even have 10 % of the motivation I have...


And then there are some random people on skype, who magically hope that just talking on skype with foreigners will solve everything (when during calls they don't even try using English enough!)


Well, heck, I can even write about it myself with my current lacking skills, if it's the only good-enough-way!


There are thousands of people who I think would really need this information about our learning methods!

I've definitely seen pretty much the same idea written up in Japanese somewhere. So yeah knock yourself out and search for it

Actually maybe this is what I was thinking of but it's in English not Japanese >< It's about leaning English tho

http://www.antimoon.com/
http://www.antimoon.com/how/howtolearn.htm