Erk, the banner on the site now says "No, really. One day it will come out."

I wonder if he's joking, and it's still coming out tomorrow, or whether it's just not finished yet and will be sprung on us sometime in the future?

Shame if it's not done, as in the original post he said it's basically ready to go, and that was about 6 weeks ago.

nicksan Wrote:Erk, the banner on the site now says "No, really. One day it will come out."

I wonder if he's joking, and it's still coming out tomorrow, or whether it's just not finished yet and will be sprung on us sometime in the future?

Shame if it's not done, as in the original post he said it's basically ready to go, and that was about 6 weeks ago.

I saw that too, a bit irritating if he means that it's not coming out on the 21st, he did say it was basically done. I'm just afraid it's going to be the size of a phone book with large verbose articles, because I think the system itself is relatively simple, he just needed to clarify some stuff imho anyway. I think most people figure out how to work with the methods he describes on their own anyway, still curious about it though.

ryuudou Wrote:Sorry if I missed it but why is this unstickied now?

So that people can open up new threads, maybe? (@_@)

I'm refraining from using words I shouldn't use... But I honestly feel like crying.

Khatzumoto has just "suddenly" fallen sick, and now it's pushed back to the 31st this month.

Figures.

I'd like to take this opportunity to speculate, but I believe anyone who thinks they really need it, doesn't really need it.

Get out there, research, and tear it up with some Japanese on your own.

I'm taking Khatz' fortuitous sickness as an opportunity to take the first-mover advantage and publish my own QRG. Here it is!

1. Remember the Kanji
2. Tae Kim
3. Kanji Odyssey 2001

It would take a fairly drastic illness to seriously delay the publication of that hefty manual

Seriously though, I'm vaguely intrigued by this QRG thing. Although I imagine its not much more than an accumulation of and refinement of the information that can already be found in his articles and (on this forum if you ask nicely or search).

I would speculate that noone on this forum would benefit from the QRG. This community basically fills the same void.

That said I'm glad he's doing it because there are people out there that are not here and would benefit from it.

What has become clear on these forums is there is no one real way. There are basics one should know: Kanji, vocabulary, grammar structures; but how you go about learning them is up to the person.

There's Japanese you should experience, but different ways you can go about doing it: Move to Japan, paste your walls with manga pages, have your DVD player looping a video, have you stereo playing Japanese, marry a native, etc.

The problem becomes because there's no one right way, people get in a fuss that they're not doing the "NUMBER ONE BEST MOST EFFICIENT GET ME JLPT 1 IN THREE MONTHS WITH NATIVE FLUENCY" method, and instead in the "MUST BE THE WORST WAY SINCE IT'S NOT THE BEST WAY" method.

Going to a college class is a way, just not for some people. Moving to Japan is a way, just not for some people. Learning Kanji via RTK is a way, just not for some people. Mining native media is a way, just not for some people. Using learning resources is a way, just not for some people. Marrying a Japanese is a way, just not for some people. Watching Anime a ton is a way, just not for some people.

And even with the above, not a single one of the them will give you everything you need.

Anyway, that's kind of the strength and weakness of Khatzumoto's blog. He's at least offering the path he took so people that follow his advice are not confused with options. Course, he's posting what worked for him based on the resources he had.

I know following his advice helped me. I also know as I learned more, I found which advice of his was not working for me. Soon I begin to offer contrary advice on some matters.

Back to these forums, yes. Ask a question here and you're likely to get 10 different answers and all them correct for the most part. Annoying to beginner, but useful to the intermediate and advanced learners.

Just a quick reminder, the QRG is meant to come out tomorrow

Nukemarine's avatar scares me, but fwiw I agree with what he said above, plus he has helped immensely in organizing and contributing to one sensible way forward.

Plus he writes sharper English prose than Khatzumoto.

Would be easier to take Khatz seriously if he didn't use nineteen or six hundred words where one or nineteen would do.

Nukemarine Wrote:I know following his advice helped me. I also know as I learned more, I found which advice of his was not working for me. Soon I begin to offer contrary advice on some matters.

I'm interested. Like what?

blannk Wrote:Would be easier to take Khatz seriously if he didn't use nineteen or six hundred words where one or nineteen would do.

Then perhaps you should stop searching for little things to criticize an excellent writer about and take him seriously based off his accomplishments, and how he's helped others.

nicksan Wrote:Just a quick reminder, the QRG is meant to come out tomorrow

Awesome!!

So whoever actually buys the QRG, post a review here and help us see if it's worth the read for someone who's already deep into a study method. Of particular interest is if he has anything to say about the merits of different approaches to SRSing sentences (kanji>reading, kana>kanji), or anything that would benefit an advanced learner. He says it probably doesn't but whatevs, someone's bound to buy and read it.

coverup Wrote:He says it probably doesn't but whatevs, someone's bound to buy and read it.

From the comments, it seems a lot of people are buying this. haha

coverup Wrote:So whoever actually buys the QRG, post a review here and help us see if it's worth the read for someone who's already deep into a study method. Of particular interest is if he has anything to say about the merits of different approaches to SRSing sentences (kanji>reading, kana>kanji), or anything that would benefit an advanced learner. He says it probably doesn't but whatevs, someone's bound to buy and read it.

Seriously? You have to buy it? This sounds fishy...

Well.. anyone who's a AJATT fanatic (I buy into it quite a fair bit, but not to a ridiculous extent) would be perfectly fine with buying something from Khatzu if they had the cash. The QRG might help me out with methodologies of mining sentences after finishing RtK+Tae Kim+Smart.fm or whatever. Though, it probably doesn't take much effort to find the sentences, it just takes effort to put 'em in your SRS. @_@

KaitouJS Wrote:Well.. anyone who's a AJATT fanatic (I buy into it quite a fair bit, but not to a ridiculous extent) would be perfectly fine with buying something from Khatzu if they had the cash. The QRG might help me out with methodologies of mining sentences after finishing RtK+Tae Kim+Smart.fm or whatever. Though, it probably doesn't take much effort to find the sentences, it just takes effort to put 'em in your SRS. @_@

I think he's just exploiting his popularity for cash... Theres no reason it couldn't have been free, it's not like he's making a living from it... It'll be on torrent sites the day it comes out though...

bombpersons Wrote:

coverup Wrote:So whoever actually buys the QRG, post a review here and help us see if it's worth the read for someone who's already deep into a study method. Of particular interest is if he has anything to say about the merits of different approaches to SRSing sentences (kanji>reading, kana>kanji), or anything that would benefit an advanced learner. He says it probably doesn't but whatevs, someone's bound to buy and read it.

Seriously? You have to buy it? This sounds fishy...

Well, either that or wait until someone throws it up on a torrent or something (as likely as it is to be.) lol

bombpersons Wrote:

KaitouJS Wrote:Well.. anyone who's a AJATT fanatic (I buy into it quite a fair bit, but not to a ridiculous extent) would be perfectly fine with buying something from Khatzu if they had the cash. The QRG might help me out with methodologies of mining sentences after finishing RtK+Tae Kim+Smart.fm or whatever. Though, it probably doesn't take much effort to find the sentences, it just takes effort to put 'em in your SRS. @_@

I think he's just exploiting his popularity for cash... Theres no reason it couldn't have been free, it's not like he's making a living from it... It'll be on torrent sites the day it comes out though...

I honestly don't think it is a bad idea, though; it's primarily aimed for beginners who are too lazy to navigate the site. Most of the information can be found on the site anyways, so if one can justify a means to buy it, to each their own.

KREVA Wrote:I honestly don't think it is a bad idea, though; it's primarily aimed for beginners who are too lazy to navigate the site. Most of the information can be found on the site anyways, so if one can justify a means to buy it, to each their own.

*Ding*
The man offers a product people are willing to pay for, there's no wrong in selling it. If someone wanted to pay for 20 to 100 hours of my undivided attention and effort being laid upon them, and it seemed worth it to me, well kaching.

As for the QRG

I've read his site, pretty much every article he's posted, sometimes more than once. I doubt there's much now he can offer to a person like myself that I'd be willing to buy. And even though his advice has been very useful to me, I haven't even donated to him.

I can't quite justify why I give a monthly donation to Fabrice and Damien (Resolve), and not Khatzumoto despite the use the advice has provided. However, I think it came down to Damien and Fabrice offers a service that costs money. Khatzumoto is offering advice that many on this board also do. Had I used his SRS I may have felt more inclined.

It's just a condensed version of the site, from the description that is.

ropsta Wrote:It's just a condensed version of the site, from the description that is.

There's also some information that's not available on the site, such as time management information.

I'm still contemplating if I should purchase a copy though. He DOES deserve the donation, and the e-book is 50 pages after all which is a pretty hefty length.

Just reading the comedy on the QRG page makes me want to buy it.

I don't think hes selling out I think hes just trying to offer an alternative to people who have money and are too lazy to read through the whole site, which he has the right to do since a lot of money today is made through peoples laziness.

I love the "You don’t need the QRG" section very funny. At $9.95 its not exactly expensive and it looks like hes put a lot of effort into it. I think its a great idea and even though I'm one of the tightest people ever and torrent everything I'm tempted to buy this as more of a donation than because I actually want the book.

I think it's perfectly fine for him to sell it. I mean why not? It isn't any different from any other book or media... it's not like he's the only one who COULD offer it for free, everyone can offer everything for free if they WANT to.

I'm not going to buy it though. I appreciate Khazu's site even though I never read much of it, because it gave me some insights into how one can study languages differently. Since then, I've been trying various things and come to some conclusions as well, and now I think my personal way of doing things makes more sense than what he's talking about and I disagree with a lot of his ideas. It's a good introduction to how one can study Japanese effectively, but I think people who buy the QRG and follow it like a bible will only find failure in the end. Hopefully they will get it and be inspired by it instead.

Tobberoth Wrote:I think people who buy the QRG and follow it like a bible will only find failure in the end. Hopefully they will get it and be inspired by it instead.

Khatz, on the AJATT website, Wrote:It is short. Brief. Laconic. That’s the point. “Quick” Reference Guide, not “The Bible”.

So thats where you got "bible" from.

Also "only find failure"? Following AJATT to the letter leads only to failure?
You're trolling right?

Khatz, on the AJATT website, Wrote:if you’re already at the point where you’re doing monolingual sentences ... , then there will be virtually nothing in the QRG from which you can benefit.

I'm out then, but getting to the monolingual point isn't really a big deal though.
Also that sentence made me think, is this it? If I keep studying as I'm doing right now, it'll only be a matter of time before I hit fluency? That's weird, and cool if true.