After looking over a few book choices (RTK, KO, KiC and a few other school grade books) I have decided RTK or KO will have to be one of the books I start with. My question is do the KO books (the physical books) show you stroke order? or does only the e-book show them?

The reason I ask is because I don't know if KO (just the books alone) will give me everything I need. I really like the break down of 555 then 1110 then 2001 and then finally 2301 but I would really like to know stroke order along with readings/meanings. I would rather stay away from buying the e-book so that I can disassociate myself with the computer for most of my study time (its such a distraction for everything else I could be doing to literally be right at my finger tips).

If KO does not give stroke order within the physical books do you think it would be a better idea to use RTK and then move on to KO or does anyone think it is an alright idea to look up stroke order in another fashion while I follow KO..

In "Nukemarine's Suggested Guide for Beginners" Nukemarine says "RTK using 2001KO 1-555 Kanji" but I was under the impression that they where not in the same order, If they are in the same order (even if they are not I guess) does anyone think it would be a good idea to use both books at the same time following the KO order and study frame while applying some of the methods of RTK...


I am a little bit tired and just throwing out some ideas before I go to sleep(I would like to buy one or both of these books this weekend and wanted to get a few questions out of the way before I chose) so links to other posts discussing this topic, or your own ideas on said topic would be appreciated immensity.

In my opinion, RTK and KO are two different beasts for different tasks. What's good about RTK is that you will learn the RTK system of primitives and how to put them together... Which will lead to a decent basis to remembering the kanji long term.

KO, on the other hand, doesn't really each you how to remember how to write the kanji -- it's more than stroke order. In it's place, it teaches you vocal including the kanji, which in turn teaches the readings to the kanji (which RTK left out)

It may be good to say that RTK teaches you how to remember the kanji (hence the name), and KO helps you read them.

I'm not sure what Nuke's post says, but if it includes going through RTK and KO simultaneously, learning the readings/vocab for the kanji you learn in RTK, then it's probably a good method in my mind.

vyronf3 Wrote:In "Nukemarine's Suggested Guide for Beginners" Nukemarine says "RTK using 2001KO 1-555 Kanji" but I was under the impression that they where not in the same order, If they are in the same order (even if they are not I guess) does anyone think it would be a good idea to use both books at the same time following the KO order and study frame while applying some of the methods of RTK...


I am a little bit tired and just throwing out some ideas before I go to sleep(I would like to buy one or both of these books this weekend and wanted to get a few questions out of the way before I chose) so links to other posts discussing this topic, or your own ideas on said topic would be appreciated immensity.

Replying per your e-mail.

Personally, if doing RTKlite (KO variant) works for you then go for it first. RTK is about studying writing and meaning only in an intuitive order. KO then is used to teach vocabulary in a more intuitive order. The missing step then is beginner and basic grammar so you understand the meanings of the sample sentences. As such, there are books that present grammar in an intuitive order (tae kim for instance).

Please understand my guide is based on my experiences in addition to what I've read here in reaction to new techniques. I don't know if learning an abbreviated RTK (RTK lite or ultralite) works, but some have said it does. I don't know if learning words in KO2k1 order works, but people like Hashiriya says it works for them so I take them at their posts. As such, I think it's best to learn kana, then beginner/basic kanji, beginner grammar then finally beginner vocabulary. By that point, it's good to try ones hand at native material in a limited capacity to demonstrate your ability to yourself.