You do 1 minute a story and go through 5 stories?

Each kanji usually has at least 5-10 stories for it...if you write down the kanji as you read the story for each one, do you think that would be just as good as reading one story and thinking about it extra hard?

You see, just sitting there thinking about one story for 5 minutes is just too boring for me. I dont have ADD, but I can be impatient. If Im at least moving on to a different story itll at least FEEL like Im making progress.

I have done this at times, and found that I often have to go back and redo specific Kanji later when my story is too weak. I am currently sitting at 1100 (still) and have a little over 110 failed Kanji I need to deal with. These failed Kanji are going to require a stronger story, and I may just sit with each one for five minutes. Some people will say spend the 5 minutes and get it right at the beginning. I say do what works for you.

If you can handle having a higher failure rate and think you can get a fair recall rate with thinking of the story for 1 minute, give it a shot and see if it works for you. The key is to keep motivated and get through it. By the time you have honestly moved a number of Kanji to box 4, you will know what is working for you.

Good Luck.

Rakushun Wrote:...just sitting there thinking about one story for 5 minutes is just too boring for me.

Closing my eyes and conjuring up vivid images after having come up with a silly story was the most fun part for me. It's tiring work, and it took me almost a year to get through volume 1, but the stories are what differentiate the Heisig method from robotic memorization.

If you rush yourself and tackle more stories than you can manage, they'll either start to swim into each other or you'll just plumb forget most of them. Try something to bring the fun back into the stories. Take your time and enjoy the ride instead of counting the days left till the end of the book. Remember that the tortoise won the race.

Quote:Closing my eyes and conjuring up vivid images after having come up with a silly story was the most fun part for me.

I cant do this. Whenever I close my eyes, all I see is black.

Every once in a while an image will hit me, for example when I got to intestines I instantly saw the image of someone reaching into their piggy bank to pull out money, and instead pulling out fleshy intestines. However, for pretty much everything else, all I can do is make up a story, close my eyes, and just think about. I cant visually imagine it, I dunno why.

Rakushun Wrote:for example when I got to intestines I instantly saw the image of someone reaching into their piggy bank to pull out money, and instead pulling out fleshy intestines.

Damn that is so much better than my story. That is amazing. I think its so good it can supersede my current story without my old story even once fighting to keep its place in my memory.

Don't forget the flashing red lighting, the zoom effect, and the sudden horror music as he pulls out the intestines

Heisig himself said that after a while the full stories aren't necessary and that there is a natural progression from stories to plots to primatives and eventually to form, and as you progress, you can always move back to plots and stories. If you are just starting, I recommend getting the stories down and using as much imagery as you can. Everyone learns differently so perhaps you can relate more to sound than to images. If so try and include sound in your stories. I have done everything from vivid imagery to attaching the Kanji to song lyrics, or emotional states, to brute forcing the occasional primative. Just find out what works for you, and keep progressing. Slow and steady wins the race, but that doesn't mean you need to go artificially slow. Nor does it mean that 5 minutes for a good story will be enough for every Kanji. Dive on in and make it your own, as you will be the only one who finds what works for you.

Cheers

When I went through RTK1 (and now as I've been doing RTK3) I just hated procrastinating over one kanji.. it sometimes felt like I was making VERY little progress.. so I just wrote the story out on paper.. typed it (or occasionally copy/pasted someone else's) into the story box, then moved on. I would worry about story to kanji strength when it came to the first review and found out how well I had solidified the story.

I don't worry about time per kanji. If I look at a kanji and a story just appears in my head, I like it and think it's memorable then I'll move on. Even if it only took 10 seconds.
Other kanji I've been known to take 10 minutes over. After the first minute or two though I get up and do something (get a drink, go to the toilet, tidy something up) all the while just repeating the word and primatives. Eventually something comes up and I can move on again.

Um...Ive already said that I cant really get images in my head. I mean, I can imagine something, but I cant actually see it. Ive had people tell me they can close their eyes and see a tree on a white background. Whenever I close my eyes I just see black.

Rakushun Wrote:Um...Ive already said that I cant really get images in my head. I mean, I can imagine something, but I cant actually see it. Ive had people tell me they can close their eyes and see a tree on a white background. Whenever I close my eyes I just see black.

Perhaps you're trying to be too precise when making mental images. If I asked you to think about someone close to you (family, friend etc) then most likely an image of their face will pop into your head. But, if you try and focus on the details of their face you'll find them annoyingly elusive. You just have to worry about the general things, and not try and focus on the details. You're not creating photos in your head, just 'images'.

You don't see it with your eyes, cause then you just see the back of your eyelids! You see it with your mind. Some people find it easier to do this with their eyes open. Play around with it to figure out what works for you.

[ファブリス]

Good suggestion radical_tyro!

Creating mental images, or "imaginative memory" as Heisig calls it, is not a gift, it's a skill that can be learned. You get better at it while going through RtK1.

Trying to actively create mental images, sitting there with your eyes closed, is tricky. It's a bit like inspiration for artists. You could sit there for hours and nothing comes up. Someone else mentionned getting up and moving about after checking the primitives. That's a good idea. If you feel stuck, pick random elements from around you or from a book, or try a google images... to kick start mental associations. Someone also mentionned once the idea of creating a "totem". Just pile up elements even if they make no sense, re-arrange them, play with them.

In any case, don't be discouraged... clearly there are some primitive mixes that are difficult to work with. Many times also I had to settle onto something my mind came up with that I _knew_ was unnecessarily complicated but I used that story to get started and adapted it later because I could think of nothing better.

> Closing my eyes and conjuring up vivid images

Heh, when I said that, I actually didn't mean that I closed my eyes every time. It's totally possible to do that with your eyes open too.

Hmm, I guess it's like a long bus ride. My eyes may be open the entire time, but I'm not always "seeing" the bus. After a minute or two, I just get lost in my thoughts---sometimes so lost, that I don't really notice much else around me, including my stop!

Either way I think that's the kind of "mind-seeing" mode I'm in when I create or review a story.

Some people are more "visual" when it comes to "seeing something with the mind's eye." Others may be more auditory, tactile, smell, or taste oriented. The trick is to find what makes an image come alive for you -- which can be through any one of your senses OR even through your emotions.

I like this exercise:

Imagine that you are holding a lemon. Imagine its color, its texture, what it feels like in your hand. Now imagine that you scratch the peel and sniff it. What does it smell like? ... Next imagine that you cut the lemon into quarters. Was there a little spray of lemon oil when you cut into it? How does the flesh of the lemon look to you? How does it smell? ... Finally, imagine that you bite into the lemon. ... How does it taste? How does your mouth react?

Most people have the same strong physical reactions to this imaginary lemon that they would for a real lemon. Partially this is due to the strong association of the word "lemon" and a certain watering of the mouth (that happens because they are so sour).

It is good to pay attention to which of your senses and/or emotions come alive most easily and try to create images and stories that make the most of them.

Another good option is to find images or stories that just "tickle you" you in some way -- give you a smile, a good laugh, etc, when you think of them -- so that no detailed imagining is necessary.

Wakela's story for "lie down" is a good example (for me, anyway):
"...She prefers to go to the privacy of her own house, lie down, and get worked on by her pet turtle. Why, you ask? Because the turtle is sloooow, and...um...he's always hard. Sorry, but he is."

I don't imagine the details of this particular story because there is something about those final lines "Because the turtle is sloooow, and...um...he's always hard. Sorry, but he is." that always gives me a laugh, and I've never forgotten the kanji since.

So try to find the types of images and stories that give you the strongest reactions.

One thing that might help is making the stories from a 1st person perspective. Instead of seeing someone reach into a piggy bank and pull out intestines, imagine sticking your own hand in a piggy bank and feeling something very slimy and disgusting in there, maybe taking a whiff of the intestines as well. If you're like most people, you do most of your thinking with your eyes open, so no need to close your eyes as you make the stories.

In any case, the stories are a means to an end. If you really can't come up with a good story, just type in the primitives and hit the "Learned" button. Just reading the primitives and the keyword sets up a link in your mind. The kanji may end up in your failed stack a couple of times, but eventually you will get it. This is why I can never understand why people let kanji languish in their failed stacks. As soon as I finish my review, I go straight to the failed kanji. I just think about the story for a couple of seconds and hit the "Learned" button. It's not as though you are going to get an electric shock if you fail the kanji again. It will come up in the review the next day, and it's hard to forget even a bad story that quickly. Failed-->Learned--> rinse and repeat until you know it. I never have any RTK1 kanji in my failed stack.

I always have the best luck mental visualizing with my eyes open. I usually just concentrate on the image and see it pretty vividly without being distracted by my eyes being open. Also closing my eyes actually distracts me more, I get stuck on the feeling of my eyelids being closed and it doesn't let me focus.