So now that the winter '10 JLPT test has come and gone what are some people's preparation after thoughts? I took the N2 test in December and am starting to prep for taking N1 this next December -- I know it seems a bit early but as daily Japanese study is now a way of life for me, why not?

Does anyone have any comments on the quality of their N1 prep material (specifically, which text(s) gave the "best" set of pertinent grammar points)? I'd much rather start doing a leisurely 1 grammar point per day _now_ rather than 10 grammar points per day right before the test.

Also, if anyone has some good N1 group projects (distributed mining) in mind, let's share them and see what we can get cookin'

k.

kodorakun Wrote:So now that the winter '10 JLPT test has come and gone what are some people's preparation after thoughts? I took the N2 test in December and am starting to prep for taking N1 this next December -- I know it seems a bit early but as daily Japanese study is now a way of life for me, why not?

Does anyone have any comments on the quality of their N1 prep material (specifically, which text(s) gave the "best" set of pertinent grammar points)? I'd much rather start doing a leisurely 1 grammar point per day _now_ rather than 10 grammar points per day right before the test.

Also, if anyone has some good N1 group projects (distributed mining) in mind, let's share them and see what we can get cookin'

k.

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E3%80%8C%E6%97%...863&sr=8-4

This series. Most of the stuff I reviewed in these books was on it.

Ryuujin27 Wrote:http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E3%80%8C%E6%97%...863&sr=8-4

This series. Most of the stuff I reviewed in these books was on it.

I was flipping through that series the other week. Did you just use the 語彙 book, or did you use the 漢字 and 文法 books as well? The 語彙 book looks pretty interesting in how it categorizes words. The grammar book was tempting but I shied away from buying it because the grammar explanations seemed a bit terse. There seems to be one or two example sentences and the syntax info, nothing more. I don't know, maybe it's worth the purchase just to have the index of grammar points, example sentences and quizzes... I guess I could always bolster the grammar point knowledge with the myriad of available online resources....

K.

I used the 語彙 and the 文法. After RtK I saw no real point in the 漢字 book to be honest.

I liked the 文法 book simply because it wasn't bogged down in explanation. It gave me two or three example sentences, with a quick translation into an easier grammar point as well as any notes if any were needed. It was quick and easy. As I hate studying grammar (particularly N1 grammar which appears exactly no where else besides on the cursed test), that was a godsend for me.

The 語彙 was great. A metric ton of the words I studied in there appeared on the test in various instances. Some of the phrases it introduces aren't used though, so watch out for that. (杯を重ねる comes to mind)

Interesting; first time I hear about the 総まとめ books. Any idea of how they compare to 完全マスター? Specifically interested in the grammar parts.

astendra Wrote:Interesting; first time I hear about the 総まとめ books. Any idea of how they compare to 完全マスター? Specifically interested in the grammar parts.

Sorry, no idea. The only experience I had with 完全マスター was to pick it up, open it, dislike the formatting, and put it back down.

astendra Wrote:Interesting; first time I hear about the 総まとめ books. Any idea of how they compare to 完全マスター? Specifically interested in the grammar parts.

From my experience (and I'm around a level 3 level in what grammar is concerned) they don't differ that much.

I'm using one 総まとめ for 2kyuu grammar and used kanzen master 3 to review grammar for level 4 (that I took last month). The one I'm using now has no grammar explanations most of the time, it has 2/3 example sentences for each grammar point (3/4 per day) and then it has around (8?) exercises, just like kanzen master.
Kanzen master has brief explanations, I believe kanzen master 2 kyuu has its explanations in japanese.

They don't differ that much, they are pretty much the same imo.

astendra Wrote:Interesting; first time I hear about the 総まとめ books. Any idea of how they compare to 完全マスター? Specifically interested in the grammar parts.

完全マスター is brief, too brief to fully understand the grammar, but 総まとめ takes it to a whole new level. The "explanations" consist of rephrased sentences which often completely omit the nuance of the grammar point. 完全マスター is great for structure and quizzing yourself, but it needs supplementing. What I've been doing is reading the entries and then looking them up in ADI/AJG, then I unsuspended the sentences from both decks. After doing that for all the points in the section and reviewing the sentences, I do the quizzes.

All right, thanks. I guess, then, that neither are too useful on their own, unless you've encountered the grammar before. ...I might like that, actually, seeing as I can read fairly well; I just completely lack formal grammar knowledge past Tae Kim. Although I'd probably have to see it for myself before I decide whether to buy it or not.

Also, what is ADI/AJG?

astendra Wrote:I just completely lack formal grammar knowledge past Tae Kim. Although I'd probably have to see it for myself before I decide whether to buy it or not.

Also, what is ADI/AJG?

A Dictionary of Intermediate Japanese Grammar and A Dictionary of Advanced Japanese Grammar. If you want formal grammar knowledge, then look no further. There's a shared Anki deck of all the sentences (including the Basic volume) as well.

Ah, I know of that deck. Figures. Cheers, I will definitely look into it.

astendra Wrote:Ah, I know of that deck. Figures. Cheers, I will definitely look into it.

It's worth mentioning that there are quite a few points in the dictionaries that aren't contained in the JLPT at all, but are still commonly used. のなんのって、というものではない、～（だ）の～（だ）のと、でしょうに are a few I've learned so far. I've seen ～の～のと so many times since I learned it that I don't know how I ever survived without it. You'll find a lot of the notes and comparisons quite enlightening as well.

Javizy Wrote:

astendra Wrote:Interesting; first time I hear about the 総まとめ books. Any idea of how they compare to 完全マスター? Specifically interested in the grammar parts.

完全マスター is brief, too brief to fully understand the grammar, but 総まとめ takes it to a whole new level. The "explanations" consist of rephrased sentences which often completely omit the nuance of the grammar point.

Javizy, this was my fear (mentioned above) when reading through the book at the store -- it seemed very terse. But my thoughts were that in the least it could be used as a reference list for grammar points.

I'm slightly tempted to just go through every single point on jgram.org that is listed as 1Kyuu -- the only perk of the published books are the sentences.

As far as studying methods go, when I was studying grammar for 2Kyuu I found that SRSing sentences was not sufficient, even when the grammar point was in bold print or whatever. I ended up learning the sentence. What finally worked for me was making a deck that had the grammar point _only_ as the prompt, then the answer was the generic grammar meaning with notes, and an example sentence. This forced me to really see a generic grammar construct and think of its general connotations. After I was good at that (those reviews were very fast, actually) I did sentences and felt like I could start gaining the nuance and usage of the grammar point in context. I plan on doing the same thing for 1Kyuu grammar points.

k.

As an alternative, I read through this series briefly for N2. It has grammar points, curt explanations (comparable to KM, maybe a little less detailed but still an explanation of some sort for every point), one example sentence has native audio for the sentence, then a few additional sentences with no audio. Has reviews for each section of grammar points, N-style sample tests, etc.

Seems to have a pretty extensive grammar list too, 108 points in all.

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E8%80%B3%E3%81%...4757418787

K.

Does any of you know if the unicom series of books is any good? I have one from them (haven't used yet) and it is for 1-2kyuu, grammar and vocab, but it doesn't teach any vocab from what I've seen.

the grammar explanations seem good and I listened to the cd's and really liked them.

The book seemed good overall, but as I still haven't started using it...

kodorakun Wrote:As an alternative, I read through this series briefly for N2. It has grammar points, curt explanations (comparable to KM, maybe a little less detailed but still an explanation of some sort for every point), one example sentence has native audio for the sentence, then a few additional sentences with no audio. Has reviews for each section of grammar points, N-style sample tests, etc.

Seems to have a pretty extensive grammar list too, 108 points in all.

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E8%80%B3%E3%81%...4757418787

K.

I have the 1級 version. It just has the 意味 that KM has, but without any further explanation, e.g. ながら（も） ＝ けれども. It has 4-5 sentences per point, but only one of them appears on the CD. Since I've got it, I'm going to go through it after I finish KM, doing the quizzes, and shadow the audio until the test.

Since they all provide the same sort of structure and practice questions, and none have enough detail to fully understand the grammar, I don't think it really makes a difference which one you go for (as long as you're planning to supplement it of course).

CarolinaCG Wrote:Does any of you know if the unicom series of books is any good? I have one from them (haven't used yet) and it is for 1-2kyuu, grammar and vocab, but it doesn't teach any vocab from what I've seen.

Do you mean the 実力アップ series? I have the N1 reading and listening ones, and they seem well presented with a decent amount of content (over 300 questions in the listening one on 4 CDs), and they're small enough to carry around with you.

Javizy Wrote:Do you mean the 実力アップ series? I have the N1 reading and listening ones, and they seem well presented with a decent amount of content (over 300 questions in the listening one on 4 CDs), and they're small enough to carry around with you.

Yup, from that series alright.

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E5%AE%9F%E5%8A%...451&sr=8-9

これです。

kodorakun Wrote:As an alternative, I read through this series briefly for N2. It has grammar points, curt explanations (comparable to KM, maybe a little less detailed but still an explanation of some sort for every point), one example sentence has native audio for the sentence, then a few additional sentences with no audio. Has reviews for each section of grammar points, N-style sample tests, etc.

Yeah, i used that series for N3 and N2 last year (combined with KM). Was pretty happy with it all in all. Probably going to get the N1 version + KM for this year. The explanations in those books are pretty brief. They allowed me to generally be able to understand sentences in the reading section using the grammar but imho they're not enough for the new grammar section. Separating out similar patterns is tricky when all you've got is a 1 sentence explanation that you've long since forgotten.

So maybe i'll get them and smack through the grammar quickly, then try to go back and learn the points more deeply. Don't really know though.

December is pretty far away but lucky that gives me more than enough time to prepare for it. (JLPT 1_

Javizy Wrote:

CarolinaCG Wrote:Does any of you know if the unicom series of books is any good? I have one from them (haven't used yet) and it is for 1-2kyuu, grammar and vocab, but it doesn't teach any vocab from what I've seen.

Do you mean the 実力アップ series? I have the N1 reading and listening ones, and they seem well presented with a decent amount of content (over 300 questions in the listening one on 4 CDs), and they're small enough to carry around with you.

nice, a lot of context is golden.