I am an economics major (Austrian School), and I am just curious if any of you know about how the banks systems really operate and about how the federal reserve system is intrinsically corrupt. Have any of you seen "The Money Masters" ?, it is a very eye opening documentary, especially considering that most people don't know anything about money even though it and those who control it rule their and everyone's lives, including my own. Anyways, here's the link (there are many parts if you want to go through it all it's about 3 hours, it is a very interesting documentary so if you have the time I recommend watching it all, or splitting it up and watching it over the week, I find that people seem to universally be interested in its subject content):

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=...0256183936#

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXb-LrVkuwM
**Follow the links after you finished to view the other parts**

Also if you have any trouble at all with my links then just google "the money masters youtube", this documentary is posted on there many times, since a lot of people seem to be trying to get the word out lately, myself included, on these important subjects and the system's inherent corruption for everyone except those at the very top. Anyways this video explains the basics but there is also a much greater wealth of knowledge about this and other commonly accepted economic fallacies over at the Mises Institute; http://www.mises.org.

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Hey thanks for sharing. Yeah I saw similar presentations last year describing the history of the monetary system and how they pretty much started making money out of thin air. Part of it was to explain the financial crisis, but perhaps a little too far for some.. the ideas that basically the monetary system keeps people always in debt (ie. "enslaved" to the few).

I don't think there is really any specific groups with malevolent intentions (as in the internet conspirations theories), but rather general slumber allows this to happens at everyone's expenses. Ignorance is not bliss in this case :/

In the same subject: . The Corporation is today's dominant institution, creating great wealth but also great harm. This 26 award-winning documentary examines the nature, evolution, impacts and future of the modern business corporation and the increasing role it plays in society and our everyday lives.

Reading this, I had 3 thoughts. I didn't know how to organize these thoughts.

---It has nothing to do with learning Japanese

---It's Fabrice's website and he can do with it what he wants and post what he wants

---It's information of interest, thank you.

I disagree about what you say about the corporation being a negative institution. I don't have the time to find the particular article that I specifically really enjoyed about this very subject, but search around on mises.org and you can find out some great info.
1. Corporations are no different than other business.
2. In a truly free market corporations(business in general actually) will continually push prices lower.
3. Monopolies can't be formed without government intervention into the market.
4. Rising prices are (Inflation is) caused by monetary creation, which is chiefly operated by the Federal Reserve(which is a private institution, which regardless of how you look at it is pretty intrinsically(not to over use the word) corrupt.)
5. Government doesn't have anything to do with your and my hard earned money, they handed their power to the bankers in 1917, during congress' Christmas vacation, with only 3 senators present!)

Those are some basic points to look at. But if deeply interested I would suggest all to read "Human Action" by Mises himself, available for free in Pdf form on mises.org, this is the single most powerful book in economics in my opinion and even those who disagree should read it to see if they can withstand his academic challenges to the Keynesian system. But I'm really busy right now so I can't delve deeper.

@Faburice, but hey you say it is because of people's slumber, while I agree with that, isn't pretty ridiculous that this information would not be taught in the public education system? It seems almost certain that there has to be some corruption in the system if it is effectively censored from all major media, and public education. What are your thoughts?

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LaLoche Wrote:It has nothing to do with learning Japanese

That's why we have the "Community" forum. Though I admit the name isn't very suggestive of its uses. We discussed the addition of this forum category many months ago and I agreed that we could have political, religious and other random discussions here; and that moderation would be less strict so long as discussions remains civilized.

It would be a bit boring and kinda sad to only talk about japanese no?

LaLoche Wrote:It's Fabrice's website and he can do with it what he wants and post what he wants

As a community forum, no, it doesn't work like that (see above).

ファブリス Wrote:[
It would be a bit boring and kinda sad to only talk about japanese no?

Heresy! ;-)



Thanks for the info.

I posted this before, but the Money Masters censored it (they beat me after a major gunfight at the Guggenheim), but I'll try again... You might like this: http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/rushkoff...index.html

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Yonosa: Oh there is some major manipulation and corruption going out there... You think the major media are being censored? How about News Corp.? I think they can censor themselves pretty good, so long as it serves their many interests

I was just trying to avoid getting into NWO, Bilderbergers and so on... although there is a lot of troubling material there. I've read all this stuff... the latest flu epidemic fiasco... and so on.

It's all very upsetting so I'm just looking at it more philosophically these days. I look at it as a general "slumber" (in my words), that is both ours (surrendering to the status quo, vegetating in front of television every night), and that of the controlling media (who also are in their own kind of fantasy world, where money has more value than life).

Here's other random links:

Getting Beyond Corporate Culture: An Interview with Douglas Rushkoff
http://www.realitysandwich.com/getting_b...s_rushkoff

The Iron Law of Fantasy Finance
http://www.realitysandwich.com/fantasy_finance

I really like RealitySandwich... but you'll probably raise an eyebrow at most of their articles. Some of it is complete bull***, but I find it healthy to just question everything. It opened my mind on a few topics.. anyway IceCream you'll find lots of articles related to your recent post, on RS, tagged under alternative economics. A very cool site, if you can suffer the deviations into "shamanic practices", "planetary alignments", "Burning Man festival", and the odd UFO article (fun stuff).

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LaLoche Wrote:Reading this, I had 3 thoughts

Please teach me O great Zen master. Reading this, I must have had about 10 thoughts. A few about the article, interspersed with thoughts about sex, existentialism, what time I get up tomorrow, and whether the damned FINNAIR airport will go back to normal operations by monday! (oh and "it's 2AM and my frikkin stomach still wants food").

IceCream Wrote:these are the kind of issues i wondered if anyone would comment on in the microfinance thread.

actually, i think capitalism is a horrible system, always have. but this kind of vague (or not so vague) gesturing is incredibly depressing i think. what can i, as a person can do? And what system should things be changed TO?

I'm no expert, but you could try paying off your debt and keeping your money in a credit union or in your mattress.

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IceCream Wrote:what can i, as a person can do? And what system should things be changed TO?

IceCream, check out the link to RealitySandwich above, you may find very uplifting material too. Everywhere in the world people are building new ways to work together.

To answer part of your question, you may find a local time/skills exchange community. There you can make friends, meet many different kinds of people, offer your skills and get other skills in exchange. This is close to the local currencies systems.

Where I live in Brussels they hold monthly information meetings, so it's face to face too, not just registering on a website.

I kept telling myself to do something like that since last year... my own kind of "slumber" got in the way (don't you guys suddenly feel very sleepy when you are stressed or fearful? ...).

Everything out there that is not nature's work started as a thought in one of us. The world out there is a reflection of us. So there is no need to change the world out there, only to change ourselves. "Be the change"

PPS: here's another uplifting website you may like: http://www.matadorchange.com

One book Rushkoff has recommended is Bernard Lietaer's The Future of Money. I never read it, but it's on my list... http://www.nexuspub.com/articles_2003/in...003_ja.php (Try to ignore the surrounding site ;p).

There's also Niall Ferguson.

Yonosa Wrote:I am an economics major (Austrian School)

Um, what college offers a major in Austrian economics? I'm an economics major too, but Austrian economics is something more likely to be taught in history than a modern economics classroom.

EDIT: I'm still watching the video, but if you're a proponent of the Austrian school, you should be completely opposed to the video. They are denouncing hard currency and supporting a government issued fiat currency. It's complete lunacy. The independance of the central bank is what keeps the money supply (relatively) stable. The following chart illustrates:



My god, if a Labour party got hold of the money supply...

lagwagon555 Wrote:

Yonosa Wrote:I am an economics major (Austrian School)

Um, what college offers a major in Austrian economics? I'm an economics major too, but Austrian economics is something more likely to be taught in history than a modern economics classroom.

I have a doctorate in physiocracy, myself.

Hey, all you people in the United States who actually care about the problem: there is something we can do:

Audit the Fed!

http://www.auditthefed.com/

hereticalrants Wrote:Hey, all you people in the United States who actually care about the problem: there is something we can do:

Audit the Fed!

http://www.auditthefed.com/

The Money Masters run that site, they use it to detect the enemy. Don't visit it or they'll trace and audit you!

Great stuff.

I just wanted to comment that I love how this cyber community has grown into a pretty damn conscious little convergence of many (imop) excellent educational resources.

ファブリス Wrote:The world out there is a reflection of us. So there is no need to change the world out there, only to change ourselves. "Be the change"

I feel this way exactly. As so much information has come into my sphere that changed the mostly happy world view I once had as a child, over the years I felt a philosophical outlook was of utmost importance to my own well being (especially after Bush won a second term). Trying to have a deeper relationship with the underlying forces at work in my own life has been very positive (though I still struggle very much to find my own harmony for sure), and I think that by creating the change we want, each of us as individuals has a resonating effect on the rest of reality.

IceCream Wrote:these are the kind of issues i wondered if anyone would comment on in the microfinance thread.

actually, i think capitalism is a horrible system, always have. but this kind of vague (or not so vague) gesturing is incredibly depressing i think. what can i, as a person can do? And what system should things be changed TO?

Icecream... Do you understand that we do not have a capitalist system? It is very much a socialist system. The government has many ties to business, they prevent competition and allow private banks to issue the state's currency causing massive inflation. Capitalism quite honestly does not exist. Although in the bank owned media(meaning all the major media companies in the USA for instance) constantly complain about capitalism and how it causes these problems, and with that they push to pass more socialist measures...Take the recent health care bill, try reading it! They guarantee monopoly rights to something like only 6 different large corporations! This is not capitalism, in order for capitalism to work the state can not intervene. If you are interested in some articles I will link to them, so let me know. But once again I highly recommend "Human Action", it is by far the best explanation of economics I have ever read, but don't expect to hear about it in the Keynesian dominated economic news.

lagwagon555 Wrote:

Yonosa Wrote:I am an economics major (Austrian School)

Um, what college offers a major in Austrian economics? I'm an economics major too, but Austrian economics is something more likely to be taught in history than a modern economics classroom.

EDIT: I'm still watching the video, but if you're a proponent of the Austrian school, you should be completely opposed to the video. They are denouncing hard currency and supporting a government issued fiat currency. It's complete lunacy. The independance of the central bank is what keeps the money supply (relatively) stable. The following chart illustrates:

http://home.comcast.net/~markthoma/Graph....19.05.jpg

My god, if a Labour party got hold of the money supply...

I never got into the issues of currency though, I simply think the documentary is the best explanation of the banking system and a much better history lesson than other similar documentaries, therefore although I would prefer different solutions this is the go-to documentary for it's explanation. Also to correct I plan to attend the mises institute, and graduate with a Masters then Phd in Austrian Economics, they are one of the few if not only of such available degrees. I am currently in contact with a few professors there through email and my prospects of entry into the school are rather high, but namely, regardless of school, my beliefs are of that of the Austrian school so therefore and I self study nearly daily (AND SRS!!!!) many of their material. Also, if you are a mainstream Keynesian, I challenge you to read "Human Action" and come out a Keynesian, honestly, give it a go. Austrian economist don't resort to arbitrary terms like aggregate demand to explain the "business cycle", we hold an actual theory, but hear it from Sir Ludwig Von Mises, he can explain it better than anyone, so read the book free at mises.org.

Maaan, economics is so boring. I mean, technology is eventually going to render the whole thing obsolete anyway, so as long as the current system provides a standard of living that keeps me alive, it's working well enough for me.

You might also like this book: Mark Fisher (k-punk: http://k-punk.abstractdynamics.org/) - Capitalist Realism - http://www.o-books.com/obookssite/book/detail/358/

TaylorSan Wrote:Great stuff.

I just wanted to comment that I love how this cyber community has grown into a pretty damn conscious little convergence of many (imop) excellent educational resources.

ファブリス Wrote:The world out there is a reflection of us. So there is no need to change the world out there, only to change ourselves. "Be the change"

I feel this way exactly. As so much information has come into my sphere that changed the mostly happy world view I once had as a child, over the years I felt a philosophical outlook was of utmost importance to my own well being (especially after Bush won a second term). Trying to have a deeper relationship with the underlying forces at work in my own life has been very positive (though I still struggle very much to find my own harmony for sure), and I think that by creating the change we want, each of us as individuals has a resonating effect on the rest of reality.

However you rationalize it, the fact is we can all almost certainly see the fallacies in such a system. No matter what the Keynesian economists spout about aggregate demand, it is obvious to see the business cycle is a sham, otherwise why else would there be a depression everytime the interest rates are raised! It's a bloody joke, they have hijacked all major universities with Keynesian economists, needless to say before the popularization of Keynesian Economics almost every economists despised banks and knew that monetary manipulation and manipulation of the interest rate causes mal-investment. But suddenly in the 30s it was declared that Austrian Economics was a dying breed and when they challenged the Keynesians such men were simply silenced from the media, oh did I mention this is around the time when Bankers acquired nearly total control of the American media? I mean we can say what we want and that "it doesn't necessarily mean that", or whatever else I always hear, but if all these things are true and we all inherently know that people like to look out for their self-interest and the interest of those in their group, yet the fact that this can be happening is simply dismissed largely because it is ignored completely in the media which is owned by the very people who would have interests to censor such content. I mean come on people, wake the hell up, I understand why you are hesitant to agree and why it seems unbelievable, that is because it almost certainly is unbelievable when hearing that after never once hearing about it before. But then again I live in China and when I tell people that more than 10 million people died because of "Chairman Mao", they largely ignore the information and simply deny that it could be true, we have to admit, if we have never before been introduced to information that is never mentioned in our daily lives in the main society in which we live that it would be difficult to think about. These issues are difficult to think about because they go against the common sense and "trust your government", "you are free, and society is fair" bs that they push in the mainstream. If the information we are saying here about the banks and the system in general is true, which it is 100%, read about the system in government newspaper, read the Federal Reserve act, it is all true. So knowing that the information shared is true, you already realize that the mainstream has lied to you, at least deceived and not been honest with you, so why bind yourself to its way of thinking in spite of this? I encourage everyone to at least think about this information by themselves without sticking to the media's guidelines.

Thank god for the internet!, But then again what about internet 2.0, are they really going to try to kill all dissent? Needless to say that would be the final straw for me and I would do all in my power to stop the Fascism and Statism that would result after they killed the internet. But if others want to talk about internet 2.0, then start a new thread and post a link here! Haha, we are pretty educated gentleman and ladies here, I am a bit surprised and very happy to see this!

Mcjon01 Wrote:Maaan, economics is so boring. I mean, technology is eventually going to render the whole thing obsolete anyway, so as long as the current system provides a standard of living that keeps me alive, it's working well enough for me.

When you have children, or get a bit older, then reconsider what you have said, think about the issues once more, and reply again. See you a few years later at the least.

Huh?

IceCream Wrote:

lagwagon555 Wrote:My god, if a Labour party got hold of the money supply...

its about as good as when a conservative party get hold of the debt.

***** this skill sharing thing is awesome!!! people are doing it and everything. ok. so, 1st is photovoltaic power, then we can all live by this communist system for community stuff, which can include recyclying & everything, then we just need to learn how to turn seawater into drinking water and we will live in utopia.

Yes communist utopia where noone is allowed the freedom to produce? Dude communism, capitalism, democracy, theocracy, socialism whatever you call it, look at what really happened in these systems, they might start a bit differently, but they all have literally always ended up as socialism, without any freedom of the individual. Well I must go to the visa office, I'll come back later and see some of the replies.