What is a good rule of thumb for when to pronounce は as wa instead of ha? Is it always wa when it follows a possible subject? For example, in the sentence: 学校は９時に始まります。would it be wa or ha? My initial assumption was wa but I just wanted to make sure.

It's 'wa' there. Anytime は is used as a particle it's pronounced 'wa.'

Also for では and には it's 'wa.'

And for the greetings: こんにちは and こんばんは are both 'wa.'

thanks

I remember when I first started learning Japanese and wondering how on earth the Japanese people knew when it was ha or wa. But, it very quickly just starts to make sense.
If you're studying from a text book then the same vocabulary will keep cropping up again and again, so you'll know if you see a は between two words you know then it must be wa.
Like the Heisig method for the kanji, you just need a little faith. A little familiarity with the language will sort it all out for you.

PrettyKitty Wrote:It's 'wa' there. Anytime は is used as a particle it's pronounced 'wa.'
Also for では and には it's 'wa.'
And for the greetings: こんにちは and こんばんは are both 'wa.'

furthermore, to make that a little less confusing, では、には、こんにちは、and こんばんは are not exceptions to the は as WA particle rule. they are just more complicated instances of the WA particle usage. the first two are simply a combination of two particles DE + WA, NI + WA. and the second two, the greetings, are just shortened conventions of what was long long ago a full phrase. those phrases have been shortened to say something basically like "about today..." (konnichi wa...) and "about tonight..." (konban wa...).

so actually, the rule is pretty consistent.

by the way, similar things happen with へ as the particle E...

If you are reading japanese with kanji, and there is a は as a furigana above the kanji, it will be pronounced "ha," otherwise, you could do well just to guess "wa."

There is always the exception of Fujiwara.

Yay for classical Japanese leftovers.

Yeah I just started with a great book I got that is basically just a list of increasingly complex sentences grouped by what grammatical piece is being introduced. It's a great book but it makes absolutely no mention of the particle being pronounced wa. Luckily I read about it on http://www.guidetojapanese.org/ before starting though. I appreciate all the responses

Are there any other similar pronunciation situations that might be somewhat confusing to a beginner? Decamer0n mentioned that へ is sometimes pronounced e?

decamer0n Wrote:furthermore, to make that a little less confusing, では、には、こんにちは、and こんばんは are not exceptions to the は as WA particle rule.

I listed those because I noticed most of the other students in my class understood the topic marking particle "wa" to be は, but then would write things like 「ではない」 as 「でわない」 because they thought this was somehow different. I hope I wasn't making it more confusing by listing those separate.

へ is "e" when it's the particle meaning "to" as in "go to the store."

I think that's it, except を is usually pronounced "o"...

No you didn't make things less clear. I want to have an idea of things like that so I don't develop bad habits as I'm learning.

so を and お are generally pronounced the same?

I think sometimes を　is pronounced more like "wo" (just like you type it).

Kind of like the Chinese word for I/me, 我

fingerscrossed Wrote:Yeah I just started with a great book I got that is basically just a list of increasingly complex sentences grouped by what grammatical piece is being introduced. It's a great book but it makes absolutely no mention of the particle being pronounced wa. ...

What book are you working with?

fingerscrossed Wrote:so を and お are generally pronounced the same?

no. they are close, but not the same.

を is pronounced "wo". it's just that the "w" in "wo" is so soft, that it usually escapes the foreign ear. and the foreign tongue tends to either leave it out too, or else overemphasize it. if you pay close attention to the way your mouth produces "w", "o", and then "wo" you will see why the "w" gets easily lost. but japanese are really quick to pick up on it if you drop that sound out completely.

お is just plain old "o".

I've heard を pronounced as "wo" as well, mainly in songs, although I've sometimes heard it in regular speech as well. Are there any rules of thumb when to use wo vs. o pronunciation, or is it kind of like tones where you have to listen to a native speaker to figure it out?

Also, for "ではありません" "is not", the は here is also pronounced "wa", correct? When I say it with a "wa" it seems a bit more natural than with "ha" but I'm not sure.


edit: a minute too late to post I see! Thanks for clearing that up.

thinking about the way i think about these kana exceptions...

i think it is easier not to think of these as exceptions to the pronunciation of kana, but as a completely separate use. so the kana, and the kana-as-particle register in your mind as two distinct things. does that make sense?

even though they look the same as a kana that is simply part of a word, the kana-as-particles tend to show up at specific places in the sentence structure, so thinking about them as seperate entities actually not only helps me avoid confusion, but also helps me visually recognize the sentence structure.

Jjanicen the book I am using is Understanding Basic Japanese Grammar. Here is the link on amazon.co.jp:

http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/47574...475740168X

I have heard を as both "wo" and a soft "(w)o." Textbooks that use ローマ字 tend to transliterate it as "o" because, to us, it would sound closer to "o" (except in songs).

@jannahj: In ではありません the は is "wa."

fingerscrossed, thanks.

sutebun Wrote:I think sometimes を　is pronounced more like "wo" (just like you type it).

Kind of like the Chinese word for I/me, 我

Nooooooo, nothing like 我, because 我 is third tone and を isn't... I guess once you've internalised the Chinese tones, it becomes impossible to neglect them...