so I am wrapping up KO, and thought I might give subs2srs a try. so advice please:


1-I am thinking to start with Tokei wo kakeru, since I have seen the movie. But maybe a shorter drama would be better? suggestions?

2-how are people studying with it? only as a source of sentences when mining? or go thru a movie/show from beginning to end? If so, I imagine people are deleting reoccurring and unnecessary cards as they go along?


3-and how are you handeling no hiragana? (at least on tokei)

cheers

Nothing wrong with starting out with a movie. If you do a series, I recommend just doing one episode then go to another series though, variety being the spice of life and all that. If an episode gets too boring or tedious, move on to a new one.

I've been going through mine beginning to end. I delete inconsequential stuff like um's and ahh's and VERY simple phrases. Everything else it's a matter of trying to figure out what the sentence means. Not an easy task at times, plus I find on a review that there's more to a sentence than what I first thought. The kenkyuusha J-E dictionary with EBwin has been invaluable in sorting those out. The find all feature is great for scoping the sample sentences to explain phrases from subs2srs.

So far, it's been about 50% of the sentences generated get kept. If any new word or kanji comes up, I activate those in my vocabulary or kanji deck.

There's been little to no problem concerning hiragana. Anki's generation tends to be ok. Just listen to the sentence once or twice to confirm correct readings are being used.

Nukemarine - what do you put on the Question and Answer cards?

I had
Question
Picture
Audio/Video
Expression (Japanese subtitle with Kanji)
Answer
Reading
English Translation (greyed out so I don't use it)

I would just grade the card on whether I understood the line, and to a certain extent if it sounded "natural" to me.

But I found it a bit too "easy".
i.e I blast through the reviews, and I'm not sure I'm getting too much benefit.
Recently I feel like my Japanese production has gone backwards, even though I'm still getting a fair amount of listening exposure, so I'm looking for ways to help.

On the weekend I changed to
Question
Picture
Expression (Japanese subtitle with Kanji)
Answer
Audio/Video
Reading
English Translation (greyed out so I don't use it)

When I see the card, I try to say it with the same "emotion" or "tone" as the original.
My hope is that it will help to strengthen the link between the expression and the context, since I have to try to recall the context.
It also tests my Kanji readings a little more.
It's still too early to tell if this is any help or not though.

FWIW: I've also found that having video doesn't really make much difference, audio + picture is fine.

avparker Wrote:Nukemarine - what do you put on the Question and Answer cards?
On the weekend I changed to
Question
Picture
Expression (Japanese subtitle with Kanji)
Answer
Audio/Video
Reading
English Translation (greyed out so I don't use it)

Personally, I take subs2srs decks mainly as listening exercises, so don't use the transcript on the question side. If I can't recognize a word or its meaning by ear, then it wouldn't be fair to pass it.

On the other hand, I like adding the sound both in the question and answer sides, so first I listen to the dialogue and then check it by listening again and reading at the same time. That reinforces both my listening and reading at the same time.

So, my cards look like this:

Question:
Image
Audio
Answer
Audio
Transcript
Image
Translation (if available, but I don't give it much importance)
Notes (monolingual definitions for new words)

Quote:When I see the card, I try to say it with the same "emotion" or "tone" as the original.
My hope is that it will help to strengthen the link between the expression and the context, since I have to try to recall the context.

Pretty good idea, since emotions play an important role in forming memories, and that applies to learning in general of course.

Another good idea is watching your favorite shows both in raw version and with Japanese subtitles. I just started doing this a couple of days ago, but it has been pretty motivating - I would say even exciting. =)

Nukemarine Wrote:There's been little to no problem concerning hiragana. Anki's generation tends to be ok. Just listen to the sentence once or twice to confirm correct readings are being used.

Does anyone know if automatic reading still down on anki with mac? I get no hiragana....

By this level, we're all going with what feels right with us. We're using Anki (I hope) with multiple fields so the format we choose now can be changed in the future.

Myself, I'm treating subs2srs cards like I'm watching the show with subtitles/furigana turned on. So my question side has image, audio, kanji and readings with the answer side listing any definitions or example sentences needed to explain the card if needed (so sometimes it's blank). I don't even have English translations cause, well, it made me not want to look up meanings which would hurt in case of a bad translation.

Yeah, I'm breezing through reviews but that's ok in that new words I get in this process are in my vocabulary deck which I test writing and reading.

Later, I can add option to type out the sentence (good way to practice typing), I can remove readings (furigana off), I can remove kanji expressions (subtitles off). It's all a matter of how I feel I need to advance. For now, I think my vocabulary and kanji decks test/reinforce my writing and reading skills good enough. I'm using subs2srs to supplement listening skills (and speaking skills in part) since I'll use the audio from the show in my iPod.

By the way, good call on emotion and tone for the sentence. When you're done with a show, try doing a little JDrama Karaoke where you play the show with subtitles but the sound turned down. Read along out loud.

Nukemarine - yes, one of the great things about Anki is the ability to change the cards to try new things.

zazen666 Wrote:Does anyone know if automatic reading still down on anki with mac? I get no hiragana....

It's working fine for me on Mac (OSX 10.5), and as far as I know it's hasn't been "down" at all.

What version of Anki are you using?
As of 0.9.9.8.5 you need the "JapaneseSupport" plugin.
http://ichi2.net/anki/wiki/JapaneseSupport
Note it will only generate readings from the "Expression" field into the "Reading" field.

its the powerpc it doesnt work on


http://ichi2.net/anki/wiki/FrequentlyAsk...eration.3F

I've spent the day playing with it and I think maybe the best way for me to study would be to go from Audio only clip to pic, kanji, reading, english.

It seems like if the goal is to watch the movie subtitle free and understand it, than go from audio only would be best. what do you all think?

If your goal is to be able to watch it, the most faithful-to-life way to train that would be video clip/audio+pic --> expression, reading, definition, notes, etc.

Personally I'm more interested in learning vocabulary and readings so I go from pic + expression --> audio + reading

Sebastian Wrote:

avparker Wrote:When I see the card, I try to say it with the same "emotion" or "tone" as the original.
My hope is that it will help to strengthen the link between the expression and the context, since I have to try to recall the context.

Pretty good idea, since emotions play an important role in forming memories, and that applies to learning in general of course.

For general cards (ie not training output specifically), I've been emulating the speakers in every way, without discriminating by gender. My focus, usually on the second and third time with a card, is on extracting that card's speech 'essence' and making sure I can say it in my own voice. I tend thus to temper it, to moderate all but the pitch changes, because I'm not an emotive person--although interestingly I've become more emotive a speaker in Japanese than I am in English! Part of this tempering, I've found, requires a lot more focus on subvocalization. At that point, while I do both on either side to an extent, I tend to test how fluidly (and accurately) I can subvocalize the audio more on the Question side and vocal articulation of the speech on the Answer side.

Maybe I should be matching my facial expressions, too, given the research into Ekman's facial action coding system.