I was driving on I-70 today thinking "How can they be so biased? 天孫民族？Many Japanese people don't even know what it means. Man, what kind of people did they meet?" Then it clicked.

It sounds like a couple of you are friends with members of Yakuza (mafia). Yes, you heard it right. Yakuza.

If "Right Wing" is the translation of 右翼, and it seems like it is, that is an incorrect translation. 右翼, especially the type that can be inferred from some of the posts here (people with black vans) are, in a nutshell, Yakuza in disguise. I can't find any English articles so here is Japanese one.

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/街宣右翼

They are basically Yakuza members, and their primary means of income is extortion. Many groups are classified as 暴力団（the formal name for Yakuza) and are completely off the political spectrum. 天孫民族 is one of the words that are used almost strictly by 右翼 members outside of highly academic contexts, and you rarely hear it from average Japanese people.

They are blatant racists like KKK that represent less than 1/10,000 of Japanese population (Their members are 10 thousands max.) If they are what they say they are, there is a high chance that your "friends" have a felony or two each under their belts, and I wouldn't be surprised if they included some murders as assaults with knives and guns by 右翼 members occur periodically. Jeez, if you were talking about those guys, yes they are not gray area. Pitch black racists for sure.

Where did you meet your "Friends"? What is the name of their group?

Eh? Dude. Right-wing is a term generally used for conservative people in a America. They aren't really much different from left-winger (slightly more liberal). Of course each general classification has its weirdos.

The KKK and such are extremists, though. Extremism is almost always bad.

[wall of text omitted]

BTW I don't think Yakuza would want to be friends with me. I'd be tempted to ask them a lot of questions.

I know Right-wing is a term for conservatives in English. But 右翼's literal meaning is Right-wing and it means completely different thing in Japanese. Where did you meet your "rightwingers" and why did you call them so? Do they have a name for their group or party? They are not 自民党党員, are they？

Did you see their van?


By the way, left-wing=左翼 does not usually mean liberals in Japanese. It means communists including terrorists.

masaman Wrote:I know Right-wing is a term for conservative. But 右翼's literal meaning is Right-wing. Where did you meet your "rightwingers" and why did you call them so? Do they have a name for their group or party? They are not 自民党党員, are they？

I'm not sure if that translates to the same thing in America. Some were Republican, some were Christian, some were both. The weird thing is in American when you associate with one party you generally labeled as liberal or conservative. I once went to a forum where a member automatically labeled me as an extreme liberal conspiracy theorist because I had the audacity to criticize George Bush. The reason being, in his mind, people who criticize the ex-President are liberals. Liberals are conspiracy theorists. Conspiracy theorists liberals will turn the country in to a cesspool of sin and anarchy.

Anyway, a person can be liberal or conservative on different issues.

This is why I say there's not much difference. People on the right (wing) tend to be a little more conservative than liberal, people on the left tend to be a little more liberal than conservative, but most people are just right in the middle (moderate).

To tell the truth I never really called them right wingers until you brought up the term a few posts ago. Right wing wasn't really in my active vocabulary until now.

No I didn't see the van. Then again, it was night time :O

ropsta Wrote:\
To tell the truth I never really called them right wingers until you brought up the term a few posts ago. Right wing wasn't really in my active vocabulary until now.

No I didn't see the van. Then again, it was night time :O

Oh, "right-wingers" in the states. I misunderstood, sorry about that. No, I didn't mean conservatives in the states and It's not me who brought up the term "right-wingers". It was TheTrueBlue and judging from his vocabulary, he didn't mean Republicans. I can only assume He meant 右翼 in Japan.

I agree that it is a dumb measure as it "appears" to be racism regardless what your intension is, but in all pragmatic senses, I think it is far better than what US immigration office is doing to Mexican people, or heck, ME!

TheTrueBlue Wrote:I already gave you my bottom line. I don't tolerate racist idiocy from anyone I personally associate with.

[snip]

You don't have to agree with what I'm writing. Just know that there's definite racism at work here. It's not every politician or every Japanese citizen, but it's there, and it is an influence.

Thanks for letting me know about the racism. Ah, I see your predicament. If this is how they target nisei, then just imagine what it would be like for a nisei who's half Chinese. I guess you'll be revising your plan to visit Japan, marry and permanently settle. At least you found out before making your first trip over there.

[edit: my apologies TheTrueBlue - I had assumed the sarcasm of this post was apparent.]

Thora Wrote:Thanks for letting me know about the racism. Ah, I see your predicament. If this is how they target nisei, then just imagine what it would be like for a nisei who's half Chinese. I guess you'll be revising your plan to visit Japan, marry and permanently settle. At least you found out before making your first trip over there.

No the stupidity of a few politicians won't keep me from my goals.

Thora Wrote:If this is how they target nisei, then just imagine what it would be like for a nisei who's half Chinese.

Exactly, if this law is any indication, the right-wingers in the Diet probably dream of the day they can re-arm the SDF and pogrom/deport all of those "inferior creatures" that are "tainting" their 大和魂.

masaman Wrote:I think it is far better than what US immigration office is doing to Mexican people, or heck, ME!

Mexican workers here are for the most part not American, neither by "blood" or parentage. It's certainly racist and inhumane the way Americans treat Mexicans, but it's not terribly similar to this law targetting Brazilian Nisei.

All this discussion remembered a friend of mine complaining about his and his brother's nicknames. He was "japa" and his brother was "china".

Well, I have to say is that people from all over the world is very welcome here. The country even receives civil immigrants from war zones. If you are a student, you may even get a spot in your public, and by definition free, universities if you try hard.
If you have a degree and know passable Portuguese, you won't have much trouble to find a job.

Brazilians don't think they are superior than any other country in the world besides Argentina - which are still very welcome anyway. You can live a full life, even labeled as foreigner.

And if you have savings in Dollars, Euro, Pounds or from any other country where the currency is stronger than Real, you can retire like a rich person here.

@masaman
It seems the article you posted just closes this discussion. Japanese govern is well aware of the situation and something is being done. The 3 years may be a good beginning.

TheTrueBlue Wrote:Mexican workers here are for the most part not American, neither by "blood" or parentage. It's certainly racist and inhumane the way Americans treat Mexicans, but it's not terribly similar to this law targetting Brazilian Nisei.

If a couple from US goes to Brazil, and has a kid there and doesn't get the American birth certificate for him/her, the 2世 american would definitely be in a similar immigration nightmare to the one I am in. Plus, if Japan opts for not giving GTFO money, the alternative will be stopping work visa renewals and deporting them by force if they become illegals. That may not get heat like GTFO money, but I don't think that's a better end result for the 2世s.

I don't find US's immigration situation for Mexicans, and me, racist and inhumane for the most part. It's kind of brutal, and the officers can use some respect for sure, but the policy wise, it's just immigration. Any country has its right to keep its culture. When you think about it, it's the host country's social system that attracted the immigrants in the first place, so it only makes sense that host countries want to preserve their social systems, at least to a certain degree.

Anyway, this reminds me of a saying "When in Rome, do as Romans do." Japanese people love this phrase, in fact, I've only heard this from them even though it's a western proverb, and I've heard it many times. I guess the 郷に入れば郷に従え attitude is rooted in Japanese culture deeply, but Romans may still do as Romans when in Tokyo.

mentat_kgs Wrote:All this discussion remembered a friend of mine complaining about his and his brother's nicknames. He was "japa" and his brother was "china".

Well, I have to say is that people from all over the world is very welcome here. The country even receives civil immigrants from war zones. If you are a student, you may even get a spot in your public, and by definition free, universities if you try hard.
If you have a degree and know passable Portuguese, you won't have much trouble to find a job.

Brazilians don't think they are superior than any other country in the world besides Argentina - which are still very welcome anyway. You can live a full life, even labeled as foreigner.

And if you have savings in Dollars, Euro, Pounds or from any other country where the currency is stronger than Real, you can retire like a rich person here.

@masaman
It seems the article you posted just closes this discussion. Japanese govern is well aware of the situation and something is being done. The 3 years may be a good beginning.

I had a Japanese friend with a nickname ボリ in Junior high, because he lived in ボリビア(Bolivia) for several years. That's pretty bad when I think about it now.

Brazil sounds like more immigrant friendly country, and something tells me never to ask a Brazilian if they are from Argentina and vise versa...

masaman Wrote:I had a Japanese friend with a nickname ボリ in Junior high, because he lived in ボリビア(Bolivia) for several years. That's pretty bad when I think about it now.

I think that's just a result of the drive to nickname things in Japan One of my friends got nicknamed cabbage because he ate tons of cabbage at a yakiniku nomikai. The best nicknames are always a little bit insulting/teasing.

Hehe. One of my pals is called Nirvana-Boy. He used the same nirvana t-shirt for like 3 years straight. He doesn't wear black clothes for ~5 years already, but the nickname is still there. ^_^

Jarvik7 Wrote:

masaman Wrote:I had a Japanese friend with a nickname ボリ in Junior high, because he lived in ボリビア(Bolivia) for several years. That's pretty bad when I think about it now.

I think that's just a result of the drive to nickname things in Japan One of my friends got nicknamed cabbage because he ate tons of cabbage at a yakiniku nomikai. The best nicknames are always a little bit insulting/teasing.

キャベツ君.....

I'm sorry, but.... Muahahaha :lol:

We had 米君(rice 君) in college because his face looked like, well, a grain of rice. OK. Japanese ARE bad.

mentat_kgs Wrote:Hehe. One of my pals is called Nirvana-Boy. He used the same nirvana t-shirt for like 3 years straight. He doesn't wear black clothes for ~5 years already, but the nickname is still there. ^_^

Being such a big fan, he must be honored. I hope he washed it once in a while though.