pm215 Wrote:

lanval Wrote:Thanks. Now I don't understand the のが in sentences like this:
いろいろ さがした のが みつからないんです.

If you insert a comma after the が does that make it clearer to you?

Quote:And the wo in
りょうり を つくる のを 1いち じかん かかります.

Are you sure this one is right? I thought かかる was intransitive (doesn't take を)...

Quote:And thirdly: why does my solution say:
dareka no naite iru koe ga kikoemasu, and not wo kikoemasu?

It's が here because 聞こえる is intransitive -- it never takes を.

Quote:And what does "dareka no naite" mean anyway?

You've broken the sentence in the wrong place -- try looking at it as だれか の [ 泣いている 声 ] and see if it makes more sense.

(1) I think I kind of need an explanation of particles for these sentences.
(2)I' use the solutions at http://foreign.studyez.com/, they seem to be correct for what I know. Dont ask me xD
(3) So: "You could hear the voice of someone crying". ° Ok.

professor layton again, i did not understand what the puzzle is asking at all!

----------------------
１６人がタテ４人　X　ヨコ４人で並んでいる。
このなかから帽子を２回移動させて、タテもヨコも頭が黒い人と、そうでない人が交互になるようにしてほしい。
----------------------
(the puzzle contain a pictures of 16 people (standing in a 4 by 4 formation) with some of the people wearing white caps)

Thanks!!

EDIT: Oh... now i sort of understand what the puzzle is asking. But I am still very confused. Especially the "タテもヨコも頭が黒い人と、そうでない..." part

EDIT: An unrelated question, how do you say "3 ~ 6" (i.e 3 to 6 and e.g. 3 to 6 books) in Japanese?

rrrrrray Wrote:----------------------
１６人がタテ４人　X　ヨコ４人で並んでいる。
このなかから帽子を２回移動させて、タテもヨコも頭が黒い人と、そうでない人が交互になるようにしてほしい。
----------------------
But I am still very confused. Especially the "タテもヨコも頭が黒い人と、そうでない..." part

タテもヨコも == both vertically and horizontally (cf 縦書き and 横書き, a pair of words you might have come across.) Note that this bit doesn't bind directly to the noun phrase which follows it...

XとYが交互になる == X and Y become alternating (overliteral translation but you get the idea)

Another question for you fine folks:

「彼女は青い目をしています。」
He has blue eyes.

What word is 「しています」it looks like the て-form+いる (continuing state) of する, but "doing" or "having done" blue eyes obviously makes no sense in English. What's going on here?

lanval Wrote:And thirdly: why does my solution say:
dareka no naite iru koe ga kokoemasu, and not wo kikoemasu? And what does "dareka no naite" mean anyway?

As for the 'dareka no naite iru koe' thing...

In Japanese, noun phrases and nouns can generally work the same way (unless the sentence gets too big, confusing, and bulky). By noun phrase, I mean the noun and the words that modify it.

The same thing happens in English. Consider the form:

Yesterday, I ate X.

You can replace X with any noun, such as spaghetti:
Yesterday, I ate spaghetti.

Or you can replace it with a noun phrase--a noun and the words that modify it.
Yesterday I ate delicious spaghetti with clam sauce and mussels.

So, "delicious spaghetti with clam sauce and mussels" pretty much works like a noun. In the same way, in this Japanese sentence the noun is 'koe,' and the words that are modifying it are 'naite iru.' Together they are working like a single noun. So, just as you could say a single noun, as in 'dare ka no kutsu,' or 'someone's shoe(s),' you could use a noun phrase like 'neite iru koe.'

brandon7s Wrote:「彼女は青い目をしています。」
He has blue eyes.

What word is 「しています」it looks like the て-form+いる (continuing state) of する, but "doing" or "having done" blue eyes obviously makes no sense in English. What's going on here?

It is indeed the て form of する. What's happening is that things don't always translate neatly across, and sometimes verbs have multiple senses in Japanese that they don't have in English, especially basic common verbs. "to do" is a good place to start thinking about する but it doesn't work all the time...
Daijirin does actually list this sense for する, although I guess you're not using monolingual dictionaries yet :-)

Quote:(4)人や物がある形・色・性質である。また、人がある服装・顔の形・表情である。

ie "people or things are some shape, colour or nature. Also, people are in clothing, or have a facial appearance or expression."

PS: "彼女" but "He" ? Check your source of example sentences...

Thanks, Jarvik! =)

A couple of more questions, if you guys don´t mind:

Both from Tokyo Dogs.
The first one one is from a conversation in front of a suit-store.
A is hating on B´s suit, and isn´t liking the store. B is wearing suits only, because it´s the best clothes to hide guns in.
A: ああー。 そういえばこっち来てからずっと同じスーツだもんな。
B: あのヤマをしくじってそのまま来てしまったからな。
A: うん。買うのは賛成だけど…。
B: そうするよ。
A: うん！？　ここにします？

Well, I really don´t get "あのヤマをしくじってそのまま来てしまったからな。"
What does "ヤマ" mean in this setting? And is it the same as 山?

This second problem is this (inside the store, A talking to B):
やっぱスーツにすんの？日本の刑事って私服率超高いからさ 別に私服でもいいんだよ。
I get the sentence, BUT what´s up with the 別に in there? Is it just a Japanese way of saying "like..." or something? I´ve heard 別に in several settings, but this one is new.
Or can it mean that it´s "particularly" ok with civilian/ordinary clothes?

Much love from Z-man! =)

PS: Tokyo Dogs is the hardest yet! Sheeez...

brandon7s Wrote:Another question for you fine folks:

「彼女は青い目をしています。」
He has blue eyes.

What word is 「しています」it looks like the て-form+いる (continuing state) of する, but "doing" or "having done" blue eyes obviously makes no sense in English. What's going on here?

Tsk tsk, this is in Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar! A valuable resource every young Padawan should have. (It's under the second 'する' entry.)

Zorlee Wrote:What does "ヤマ" mean in this setting? And is it the same as 山?

This second problem is this (inside the store, A talking to B):
やっぱスーツにすんの？日本の刑事って私服率超高いからさ 別に私服でもいいんだよ。
I get the sentence, BUT what´s up with the 別に in there? Is it just a Japanese way of saying "like..." or something? I´ve heard 別に in several settings, but this one is new.
Or can it mean that it´s "particularly" ok with civilian/ordinary clothes?

ヤマ means a case or a crime in this context. I don't know if a real police officer uses it, but it's police/journalism language. B investigated a crime and screwed up.

As for 別に, the speaker meant 別にスーツでなくてもいいんだよ。I think you already know this 別に + 〜ない thing, but the clause means "It's ok not to wear a suit." You can also use 別に without "ない" by using a positive clause meaning the same thing:

スーツでなくてもいい (it's ok not to wear a suit) = 私服でもいい (it's ok to wear plain clothes), and you can use 別に in either sentence without changing its meaning.

If you use 特に, the meaning of clauses can change:

特にスーツでなくてもいい can mean pretty much the same as 別に私服でもいい, i.e., "It's ok not to wear a suit (implying 私服 is not particularly strange)," but 特に私服でもいい always means "It's ok to wear plain clothes (implying 私服 is a particular example)."

pm215 Wrote:PS: "彼女" but "He" ? Check your source of example sentences...

Thanks for your help; you have confirmed my suspicions.

Oh, and because I copied+pasted the translation, and I missed the S when I was highlighting the sentence, so it showed up as "He" here; I just didn't notice until you pointed it out. The original translation uses "She", as it should.

Quote:Tsk tsk, this is in Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar! A valuable resource every young Padawan should have. (It's under the second 'する' entry.)

Is this a book?

Yes, it's a book. I wouldn't have thought to look in it for this usage of suru (in fact, I didn't!), but it does seem to be the most recommended English-language grammar reference.
(I did wonder about a copy-n-paste error, but the capital 'H' left me unsure.)

pm215 Wrote:Yes, it's a book. I wouldn't have thought to look in it for this usage of suru (in fact, I didn't!), but it does seem to be the most recommended English-language grammar reference.

That book looks rather extensive; 500+ pages? If that's just "basic" grammar then I think I might quit learning Japanese.

Looks pretty good. I'll have to order that book when I get the funds, and the motivation. I haven't touched a physical book for personal uses in a long time...

pm215 Wrote:(I did wonder about a copy-n-paste error, but the capital 'H' left me unsure.)

I remember wondering why the sentence copied with a lower case h instead of a capital one, as would be grammatically correct, so I capitalized it myself. I forgot that it was supposed to be "She". I fooled myself.

Another question... man, I sure abuse you guys. Unfortunately though, I really don't have anyone else to ask about these things. I don't know anyone that knows Japanese.

「私にはたくさんのお金が必要だ。」
I need a lot of money.

たくさん is listed as an adjectival-noun, common noun, and adverb in the E-J dictionary I use (tangorin.com). Why is there a の after たくさん then? I would have thought that since it's modifying a noun (お金) it would be acting as an adjectival-noun, which (to my knowledge) use な instead of の.

Thanks guys, I really do appreciate all of the help I've been given so far; I don't know how I'd find this stuff without your help.

a small 漢字fication question... (i might be over-kanjifying though)

about the word 或る (ある). (most of) my dictionaries say it's supposed to have the okurigana る, but for some reason my IME (both microsoft and google) refuses to put it in (producing things like 或日、或年、或街 and 或島; instead of 或る日、或る年、或る街 and 或る島, as i would expect). is this a mistake in the IME dictionaries? are both options right? (both get results on google, but the ones with okurigana get more) or am i missing something here?

Quote:(i might be over-kanjifying though)
about the word 或る (ある)

A good rule of thumb is "never use kanji for ある or いる", which sidesteps the question completely. (They're basically never written in kanji in modern writing in my experience.)

The only time I've seen 或 in writing so far is here with no okurigana: http://www.aozora.gr.jp/cards/000121/fil...13341.html

或朝 ... = one morning...

brandon7s Wrote:

pm215 Wrote:Yes, it's a book. I

That book looks rather extensive; 500+ pages? If that's just "basic" grammar then I think I might quit learning Japanese.

It's 500 pages because it typically devotes two or three pages to each grammar point (lots of examples and discussion)...

Quote:I haven't touched a physical book for personal uses in a long time...

I actually prefer physical books for this kind of reference material -- I find it much easier to look things up and browse than with an electronic document.

Quote:たくさん is listed as an adjectival-noun, common noun, and adverb in the E-J dictionary I use (tangorin.com). Why is there a の after たくさん then? I would have thought that since it's modifying a noun (お金) it would be acting as an adjectival-noun, which (to my knowledge) use な instead of の.

I dunno, but の is definitely what you want there. I've never been too much on remembering labels for parts of speech anyway; mostly I just remember how words get used... Call it a special case if you like.

pm215 Wrote:

brandon7s Wrote:たくさん is listed as an adjectival-noun, common noun, and adverb in the E-J dictionary I use (tangorin.com). Why is there a の after たくさん then? I would have thought that since it's modifying a noun (お金) it would be acting as an adjectival-noun, which (to my knowledge) use な instead of の.

I dunno, but の is definitely what you want there. I've never been too much on remembering labels for parts of speech anyway; mostly I just remember how words get used... Call it a special case if you like.

I think たくさん is almost acting like a noun here... And since の is what allows one noun to modify another noun, you need の instead of な。(If you were writing a formal paper, you wouldn't use たくさん、you would use 多く（おおく）to mean the same thing, but even then you would still use の。)

Quote:(If you were writing a formal paper, you wouldn't use たくさん、you would use 多く（おおく）to mean the same thing, but even then you would still use の。)

I've been looking for some references (online) to further explain the use of [adverb] の [noun] , and have not had any luck so far. I'm not saying I don't believe that it's correct, but I'd just love to know why it's correct.

Thinking about it though, by definition adverbs are used to modify words that are not nouns, so maybe they have to be treated as a noun in order modify one. The entry of たくさん, as well as 近く (and I'm sure many other) being adverbs and adjectival-nouns is throwing me off though. I'll just ignore that for now, as it doesn't look to make a practical difference in how they are used, if it's even true.

@brandon7s
たくさんのお金が必要だ。 is "I need a lot of money." たくさんの describes how much money you need, i.e., it's modifying the noun "money." You can say たくさんお金が必要だ too, but in this sentence たくさん is describing how much you need it, i.e., it's talking about the degree of your need. Since you can't put a modifying word after its corresponding modified word in Japanese, you can't say お金がたくさんの必要だ, but it's totally ok to say お金がたくさん必要だ because たくさん is still before 必要だ.

magamo Wrote:@brandon7s
たくさんのお金が必要だ。 is "I need a lot of money." たくさんの describes how much money you need, i.e., it's modifying the noun "money." You can say たくさんお金が必要だ too, but in this sentence たくさん is describing how much you need it, i.e., it's talking about the degree of your need. Since you can't put a modifying word after its corresponding modified word in Japanese, you can't say お金がたくさんの必要だ, but it's totally ok to say お金がたくさん必要だ because たくさん is still before 必要だ.

　Thanks magamo, you're awesome. I think that clears it up pretty well for me.

Unfortunately though, I have another question

「この車はよく持っているね。」
This car has lasted a long time.

Core2000 defines 持つ as "last long, maintain", but I can find no trace of a meaning that is even remotely similar in a dictionary. Granted, I'm not using a J-J dictionary yet, as that's a bit above my current level. What's the deal with that word?

brandon7s Wrote:Core2000 defines 持つ as "last long, maintain", but I can find no trace of a meaning that is even remotely similar in a dictionary. Granted, I'm not using a J-J dictionary yet, as that's a bit above my current level. What's the deal with that word?

Here's Yahoo's J-E dictionary entry, which contains the meaning you are after: http://dic.yahoo.co.jp/dsearch?stype=0&e...1%E3%81%A4

It has generally proven out to be one of the most extensive free J-E dictionaries I've run into. Plus they have example sentences that are not from the Tanaka Corpus (AFAIK).

shang Wrote:Here's Yahoo's J-E dictionary entry, which contains the meaning you are after: http://dic.yahoo.co.jp/dsearch?stype=0&e...1%E3%81%A4

It has generally proven out to be one of the most extensive free J-E dictionaries I've run into. Plus they have example sentences that are not from the Tanaka Corpus (AFAIK).

Thanks. I'll definitely try that dictionary - looks good.

IceCream Wrote:

Zorlee Wrote:PS: Tokyo Dogs is the hardest yet! Sheeez...

no kiddin. i havent even attempted trying that. JIN is pretty insane though.

Hehe, I bet you´re learning your medical terminology, if you´re going through Jin! =)

And once again, Magamo - Thank you so much! =)

A quick one here:
いつの間に発信機付けたんだよ？

I know the expression 「いつの間にか」(before someone knows / unnoticed).
Now, I'm a bit confused about 「いつの間に」
I really don't understand how to break it down.

Thank you guys! =)
Z..

いつの間に is sort of like いつの間にか in that it implies a short, unnoticed period of time. Often the feeling in English can be expressed by "When the heck..." (or whatever profanity you want there

So いつの間に終わしたのか？ would be "When the heck did you finish?" (with the implication that either the speaker didn't notice, or that it was a surprisingly short time, etc.) いつに would just be "When did" with no implications.

「昨年は地震が多い年でした。」
Last year there were a lot of earthquakes.

What's the purpose of 年 after the word 多い here? If 年 was left out, the sentence would make perfect sense, but I'm not sure what to make of it with it included.