jorgebucaran Wrote:

harhol Wrote:lol, I'm still on 512kbps...

Are you sure? Maybe what you have is 512 KB/s. There is no way I win this one, Internet in Venezuela is the slowest.

I live in a rural area which is a long way from the telephone exchange. The fastest I've ever had was 4mbps and that was in the middle of a city.


Re: the two posters above, it's difficult for me (I can't speak for Jorge or Taylor) to understand where you're coming from. You both give mixed messages, especially FutureBlues, who is a teacher who doesn't enjoy teaching and someone who has lived in Japan for three years despite apparently hating every minute of it (gross exaggeration, obviously, but the impression I get is still overwhelmingly negative). To be honest I don't understand why you're still there or why you even went there in the first place. You criticise us for having strange motivations but don't appear to have (or have ever had) any yourself. But this is just how I've interpeted what you've written.

I'm not obsessed with J-pop, animé, manga, ninjas etc, I just want to try living somewhere else because I don't enjoy living where I am now. That's my motivation. Japan seems like a cool place to live and a country where I'd have several different ways to go about making a living. However, I'm not in a financial position to be able to try out Japan and go live there for a couple weeks/months, or go to university there. If I move there, it would have to be for a job and it would have to be relatively permanent. This makes it more of a gamble because I don't know if I'll actually like it there, but unfortunately I have no choice. I'm not in a position to fly back and forth depending on my whims.

I want to live somewhere that isn't the UK, the USA or Australia. Other than Canada I don't have any option other than to learn another language. Of the available languages, Japanese was the most appealing to me. It's as simple as that. Looking into it further, I discovered the high demand for native English speakers, and it seemed like the most logical choice. I don't see what's so controversial or naive about wanting to emigrate... hundreds of thousands do it every year.

Tobberoth Wrote:...there's tons of annoying things as well, which is easy for someone who has never been to Japan to ignore until they actually live there.

...clearly. No one is saying that nothing bad ever happens in Japan. I take it as a given that there will be tons of annoying people, stupid people and racists, just like there are here, so that's why I don't see any reason to dwell upon it (I've had enough problems opening bank accounts here to last a lifetime). Life as an immigrant will be tough wherever you go, especially if you stand out. But I would rather face a tough & challenging life as an immigrant than a boring & unhappy life in my native country.

Is Japan a good place to be right now? The Brazilian-Japanese mother of my boy in Japan told me the government is paying Brazilians 300,000yen if they agree to leave Japan and never come back. This may be just because Brazilians usually work in factories that are closing due to an inability to compete with China. The Yen also remains very strong against the US dollar. I was planning on returning to Japan this summer but pushed it back to maybe January, if at all now. Is this a bad time for Gaijin to be in Japan?

@ harhol.. dude i wish my internet was that fast atm.. currently im rocking a 0.12mbs as opposed to 1.5mbs (line broken ) if i want to use iknow, i have to wait 15 minutes for it to load.

most people in this thread who live in japan / went to japan and came back. went straight from college / University. They didn't lead a live of shit jobs, piss poor pay and hatred by there superiors beforehand to have any kind of comparison.

you may hate teaching english in japan.. but did any of you pull an 11 hour shift in a burger king with one 15 min break, 6 days a week ? i did for the 6 months after i finished college. you think helping someone learn a valuable skill isn't fulfilling? you have no idea.
the job im in now (for the last 3 and a half years.. leaving in summer going to university) is so bottom rung, there is no potential for ever getting myself off it. I have to make this bold jump or risk waking up, being 40 and wondering why i bothered in the first place.

I have seen the bottom, unemployment or a shit job with no prospects, still living with parents, having money issues. and don't get me wrong , im not stupid. im fairly highly qualified (just missing the degree, have a diploma and loads of other pointless crap to match) but this is the trap you fall into if you take the wrong step outta college/ high school like i did. Not deciding quick enough what i wanted to do and this happened.

I personally would like to try teaching in Japan, ive always found working with kids to be a blast (my mum is a pre school teacher, so i occasionaly lended a hand.. nothing quite completes your day like 15 3yr old "pile on" with you stuck at the bottom) its not exactly a step down for me, and im at the point in my life where big change is needed or i may aswell give up.
once i have my degree, thats the plan atm. obviously subject to change. If i don't like it, ill come home, but i will have at least given it a shot. Which i feel i owe myself at least. Ofc after spending a year in Osaka in a 2 years time.. my tune may be completely differant. but its something il have to find out for myself rather than read on a forum.

everywhere is good, everywhere sucks. Find out what works for yourself. If you don't like it, suck it up and change it.

For myself moving to Japan comes down to a gut feeling. I always wanted to go visit there,
so I started to learn the language, out of an attitude that it would at least be polite to know some survival phrases. Then things evolved. Like many things I have discovered in life (and feel passionate about), I didn't go looking for it. It found me. It started with a single feeling, or thought, and grew. And there were many signs, syncronicities, personal events, pieces of information, that moved things. I had no idea a year ago this was going to happen, but the positive impact it has had for me has been life changing.

I look at Japan as a place to go explore. Why Japan? It's like anything you want. I have a friend who's Japanese, and is a flaminco guitaur player living in Spain. He has trained for years and years, and given his life to it (and to hear it from him he's still not very good, but he kills it!). Why? Because he wants to, because he is passionate about it. He has a presence about himself that communicates clearly what he is about. I've never thought to ask him why. I just know that he is called to do it, he loves living in Spain, and he is happy.

When it comes down to it, I really have no idea how long I will live there, how well I will like it, etc. I don't think any place can magically make a person become fulfilled. That's not how reality works. And speaking from experience, some of my happiest, most zen life experiences where living in a place I hated!

Living there will be a completely different thing than being a tourist, but that's what I want. I have enough information about the place, and know myself well enough to know it's an experience I want to have.

When it comes to a major life change, like relocating, I have always listened to a feeling I got. It's not one thing, or something I can easily explain. Or something done blindly or on a whim. If you knew me really well, you would understand perhaps. It's personal, it's karmic. There is something calling me there. A force of attraction. And there are some normal reasons there too (it's not all completely mystical LOL). But at the core, it truly is something that has no simple rational explanation, that I can explain easily in a post.

harhol Wrote:Jarvik, why did you return to Canada? Were you only a student in Japan?

I originally went over on a 1yr student visa, but have gone back several times since during time off from school, for a total of about two years in-country. I also worked for a bit as an English teacher while I was there at both 英会話 and 塾. I came back to Canada to finish my degree (just finished). Now I'm a freelance 和英 translator, but about to start looking for a position in a company in Japan (probably back in Osaka, but considering Tokyo and Nagoya too).

The only real negative experiences I've had were not being able to get a cellphone the last time I went for 5 months due to new anti-terrorism rules requiring you to have a non-short-term visa, and living with my (now) ex-girlfriend

Ginger, just because we went to college doesn't mean we lack other work experience. I worked 2 different jobs while I was in high school and college, and both of them were part-time, bottom rung, call you on Saturday morning at 8AM to see if you'll come in and work for Fred, who just got fired for hotboxing in the parking lot jobs. Don't beat yourself up, man.

And I'm not going to get into a miniature war over whether I hate Japan or not, but again, harhol, I implore you to read the post I made before this. I think that its great you want to do something with your life, but I'm just here saying, "Look... Why Japan? Why not Spain, Switzerland, Taiwan? Why must it specifically be Japan?" If you can't answer that question, or the answer is: "Well, because I feel in my heart that Japan is the right place for me," then you may want to just come here, spend 30 days on a tourist visa and stay with somebody-- see if its all that and a bag of chips like you think it is before you start taking steps to completely abandon everything and start living and breathing Japanese.

I've both taught in Japan, lived in Japan in high school for a year, am going back to Japan for two years later on for university, live with a japanese roomate now, intern full-time in Japanese for a Japanese company in the US here, and I gotta tell- there's good and bad things about the place. I second the above comment and can say Japan's had loads of s*** people and good people. Before I first went, I thought Japan was the best, things were amazing there, and people were so great. Wow- I was in for a wake-up call. But, the good news is I got it fairly early on (before I turned 20) and realize this. Now, I'm pretty sure Japan will always be a fairly large part of my life, but I've gone from "wishing I lived in Japan 24/7, things are so cool" to being able to appreciate both sides of the spectrum.

Btw, Future Blues, I'm in DC too, at AU? How about you?

FutureBlues is right to ask:

FutureBlues Wrote:Why? Why Japan? Why do you feel so strongly about completely and utterly integrating yourself into a place you've never been before and then why, specifically, Japan?

Because of the adventure.

I have lived in Venezuela most of my life but I have been to several countries on this side of the Americas and I can tell you from experience, they are all pretty much the same. The same culture, the same crap, it's an embarrassment. I, like not so few other people living in South America was raised by parents of mixed ethnicity. In my case mostly European and the other side American. Does that give me better morals, values and ways? Absolutely. I was raised by parents that sacrificed themselves in everything they could to offer me a better life than the one they had. My grandparents basically arrived to this country looking for a better life, running away from a post-war and devastated Europe.

You, as American, enjoyed several more opportunities than anyone could have from this side of the globe. I have never been poor but when you compare the quality of life that is standard here with the typical American style I was maybe poor. Even poor people in America have more opportunities, like something as simple as access. Access to information, access to professionals, access to points of view. I lived in a bubble and when finally discovered there was more than this I realized "this", this place, was never the right place for someone like me. I know there are leprechaun everywhere but here there are mostly leprechaun only. And I ultimately don't care because I will hang out with other people like me, that's for sure, people that share common goals. (When I am in Japan I will most likely pay a visit to harhol and TaylorSan and celebrate our success. )

Going to Australia or Canada sounds great, Sweden and Norway were top in my list but before I go on you need to understand than different from you, that always had a place to fall back I don't have one. I rather panhandle than stay here for the rest of my life (maybe not that much but I think it shows my absolute deception from the country I live in).

So why Japan? Well, did I mention I was fascinated with Japan since I was kid? It has always been a dream of mine. However one big reason for me is the challenge and the adventure. Japan is not just another place is "the place", becoming Japanese is naturally hard and I like that. I know of people that emigrated to Australia or Europe and actually did fine, most didn't though. However, honestly, that is just too easy. Even if I never amount to anything in my life, I want to believe that I am special and instead of talking me out of it I encourage you to think like that of yourself. I call that healthy thinking. But it gets better. The challenge is not doing all of this like the last thing I will do. The challenge is to do it as quickly and efficiently as possible, and probably while juggling 4 balls (did I mention I can?)

I am sure many people find Khatzumoto's story more than motivating and some probably have him as the bull's eye in the darts set at the back of their door (just kidding). I want to do the same, I want to do it better and then, probably change my mind and switch to something more interesting. Why not? I claim that's what life is all about or would you rather see me living here for the rest of my life, with a regular job, regular girlfriend, regular everything like most people.

Based on what I have read, researched and seen, Japan is just as beautiful and in my opinion *way more beautiful* than any other country I have ever seen, one of the safest places on earth, highest life expectancy for a country of its size, technological paradise, nutrition heaven..., the people, the culture, their ways and values. Also, is not generally accepted that Japanese women are far more conservative, reserved and modest than any other women? well I think I will like that and I want to try that.

I won't miss anything from my Western and Latin culture. Let me get that straight, I will not miss anything from my Western and Latin culture *at all*. Because besides trying out my luck, the gamble in harhol words (which is exactly my case), I am as the matter of fact thriving to get away from here as soon as possible.

Other things I thrive for:
* 160 mbp/s Internet connection.
* Become an expert of Asian languages.
* Practice martial arts as a hobby.

Diana Wrote:I thought Japan was the best, things were amazing there, and people were so great. Wow- I was in for a wake-up call.

This is exactly the information, we, the ones that have never been and experienced Japan want to know. Would you elaborate on all of that bad stuff? Enlighten us.

harhol Wrote:

jorgebucaran Wrote:

harhol Wrote:lol, I'm still on 512kbps...

Are you sure? Maybe what you have is 512 KB/s. There is no way I win this one, Internet in Venezuela is the slowest.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j239/harhol/buytg.jpg

I live in a rural area which is a long way from the telephone exchange. The fastest I've ever had was 4mbps and that was in the middle of a city.

Before moving to a relatively bigger city, I lived in a small town where there was just *not* any Internet.

Allright, no problem with that, but specifically, is there anything you would like to know?
It's really hard to pull out everything in my "big umbrella of topics" you know, so if you could specify, that would be ok. But, to throw in my two cents.... (highly colored by all MY personal experiences as a 20 year old young female)

Perusing the forums, one of the things I found really hard was the ability to form close friendships or just how strong tatemae/honmei really is! Though one of the posters said it's not so present amongst younger people, from my experience, I can say that it really is present and not just a "generational thing". I've experienced it in a variety of situations with young people- in high school, at university, even amongst the exchange students here at my university who really are here to obviously try to embrace the "American way of life" much like I believe exchange students anywhere should embrace X country way of life (and like I embraced Japan's way of life too when I was an exchange student)

Honmei and Tatemae and stuff is present and because of that, Japanese people can be really nice to others and then nasty behind their back! They did it in my high school, circle of japanese, friends, etc. I was often surprised by some of the cruelty, or just casual ignorance I witnessed. Sometimes, when a person was in trouble too, others would just ignore that and shrug it off as "Xsans" problem. That really bothered me, and I'm not sure it's a Japanese thing or a worldwide humanity problem, but not that many countries have as high a suicide rate as Japan (more on that later)

Getting Japanese people to open up to you was also something I found very hard. And I speak the language! It can get frustrating (maybe I'm a female that is why) but living in a foreign country without close girlfriends is kinda tough I think. No matter how hard I try and still do continuously try, out of all of the Japanese people I meet, I don't think I will ever find a close relationship with a Japanese person parallel to what I have with my Western friends, it's just really difficult on their end. It was the same with my boyfriend, too, who was also Japanese. Not willing to admit their feelings, very private person, etc. I know that there are plenty of people who in Western relationships and friendships get the " I'm not a mindreader, how am I supposed to know what Xsan is thinking" frustrations as well, but it just seems like in Japan, that is compounded more often and I experience that more often as well. I don't know if it is a good thing for Japan or not. Personally, I think it is what is responsible for the country's high suicide rate because it seems like people feel more and more that they have nobody to turn to. (There's another rosy reason to like Japan: the high suicide rate)

Another thing I found frustrating was the relative insularity of the culture, and the refusal to accept anything foreign. It was personally frustrating to me because I was in Japan on scholarship and one of the things I was expected to do (and write reports on!) was about how I was being a "cultural ambassador"

Load of crock, I know, but I got to Japan and lived with host family for free like that. I tried my darndest to do so, and eagerly embraced my role as doing this. Volunteered in the community, was only white person in Japanese high school, had only Japanese friends ( I wasn't allowed to hang out with foreigners, it was against my scholarship rules. Never mind that I was in Saga prefecture, and there WERE no other foreigners to hang out with neways, lol)

Anyway, at first I didn't mind the inane mcdonalds/america questions, but even after answering xsan's question, " No, I don't eat McDonalds everyday" back when I first came, answering in the middle of the year, and then at the end, it got a little frustrating that random people wouldn't accept me for who I am or try to learn anything about me. And I suppose that is what is difficult to deal with because for many Japanese, it seemed like I was who I was (gaijin) and they were who they were (japanese) and that is how it was going to be, forever and forever. No matter how hard I tried. I was just a gaijin American who eat choco cake and McD every day and OBVIOUSLY never ate fish or natto ( which I do and love!) But, the inabiity of the japanese to accept me was difficult. Some of the previous posters have obviously highlighted this and I think they did a good job. You are always going to be foreign in Japan, no matter how hard you try.


Another thing that got relatively annoying was the insecurity I found amongst Japanese girls, both in high school and uni. To my Japanese friends, I am an "aggressive onna" simply because I am the type of person who doesn't take BS from anybody.

Case in point: some people were being loud outside our dorm windows the other night, and all the Japanese people were shivering in fear, because they found it annoying but didn't want to do anything about it. I sighed, got up, told the people to shut it (they did) and the Japanese girls all looked to me like I was a savior or something. Now, some Americans might also be non-confrontational, but it seemed to me like being that type of person in Japan is bad because they have to preserve the "wa" or whatever. In fact, when I asked said Japanese girls why they didn't, they replied they wanted everyone to get along well together, yada yada. Or another time when a Japanese girl and I were lost and wandering around trying to find an onsen. She was "too shy" to ask for directions.
Again, I being the "aggressive" type went up and asked in Japanese for directions.
Times like these make me wanna go *sigh* you know? It's just directions, for crying out loud!!


My jp. ex-bf also gave me flack about this ( Women should be quiet! Gaijin girls are so aggressive! Be respectful! nonsense). That bothered me a lot too, and I suppose these feelings were compounded by the fact that Japan is a place where women feel they have to be married before 25 or they are a "Christmas cake". (And no, that isn't old-fashioned thinking, that is straight out of the mouth of my 23 yr. old host sister!)

That really grates me, and I'm not some crazy feminist who burns her bra or anything. In fact, my American friends all call me feminine because I LOVE pink and LOVE hello kitty, and am outgoing in America, but never "aggressive." But, it's that aspect or something that bothers me, because Japan isn't the place where you can be a strong independent female. I suppose that's why so many Japanese women love SATC, but the idea of a Japanese Samantha existing...I just can't seem to picture it.

I know a lot of bright, beautiful Japanese girls too, but they have some of the craziest insecurities, probably compounded by their culture. Did you know anorexia rates are the highest in the world in Japan? It bothers me that these girls never seem to think they are worthy enough or good enough, when in reality, many of them are. And for the Japanese girls who do end up being "Samantha's", they don't do it in Japan. They go to LA or NY to do so. I find it sad that their own country doesn't support these girl's ambitions, particularly when Japan is facing such a HUGE birth rate/population problem.

Wonder why...hmmm....

I'll admit some of things I experienced might be a "city versus country" phenemenon, I dunno. I've only ever lived a month in Tokyo while I was teaching, and the rest of my time in Japan, I have spent in the countryside. But, I've read a lot of blogs and have lots of friends who are Japnese, associated with Japan, been all over in Japn, and their views are similar to mine. I've even had Japanese girls agree with me on all of this, which is why I have a few gf's right now who are eagerly wanting to go live in LA or NY, and are trying to do so.

To be fair and to balance things out on the male side, I think Japan seems a tough place for guys sometimes too. Having to hand over your money and getting an "allowance" from your wife seems stupid to me. I'd rather have an open and honest marriage with my future guy where we can both make responsible financial decisions together, not me having to treat him like a child, you know? And Japanese dads are never present in their kid's lives, which I think is also pretty bad. Makes me wonder why so many j-girls grow up insecure, not having a positive male influence maybe?

Having to work day in and day out out of loyalty for your company also seems stupid to me, and to get so stressed that you can't do anything but just get sloshed and forget about it the next day also bothers me. Why aren't all the salaryman fathers out on the train home with their kids? Instead they wile away their time drinking and pachinko'ing and generally being inefficient at work, which is why they come home at midnight. And their high suicide rate and heart disease present in their country prove it. I know because my mother was an accountant for Guidant Corporation, which makes pacemakers, heart stents, and other things of that nature. It used to be a large company (it's sold now, I digress) but guess who their BEST customers were? Out of all the countries in the world, Japanese people had the highest demand for such things. I mean, you can only keep up a drinking, smoking, salaryman life up for so long before your heart goes kaput...

Doesn't really seem like the best place now, right?

So, to sum up, this are some of the things I think are really difficult about Japan and things that I think are messed up. Hopefully, in the future, these things will change, but as a representative of the young generation here, I can assure you, things are going to be status quo in Japan for what looks like a LONG time.
Japan does have lots of good things about it! ( I'm hopefully going to be going to Kyoto for two years for my undergraduate this year and can't wait!) but I tried to faithfully present my opinions and observations and try to give "both sides of the coin" like I said I would.

I sometimes don't know why I'm even learning Japanese. I only have a mild interest in anime and j-music, and I definitely don't have any desire to move to Japan (of course a visit would be nice). Well it's probably because of AJATT, and realizing that speaking another language fluently is always good for the CV. I know heaps of people here say that they want to move to Japan for the adventure, culture and stuff, but I really think most people just want to live in an anime.

I've never been to Japan, but I've been pretty well travelled, and haven't lived a majority of my life in any one country, so I feel kind of nationless. This also means I don't really get the same buzz out of going to different countries as some do.

FutureBlues Wrote:I think that its great you want to do something with your life, but I'm just here saying, "Look... Why Japan? Why not Spain, Switzerland, Taiwan? Why must it specifically be Japan?" If you can't answer that question, or the answer is: "Well, because I feel in my heart that Japan is the right place for me," then you may want to just come here, spend 30 days on a tourist visa and stay with somebody-- see if its all that and a bag of chips like you think it is before you start taking steps to completely abandon everything and start living and breathing Japanese.

As I stated above my motivation is that I want to live & work in a First World country which isn't the UK, the USA or Australia/NZ, and aside from Canada that means learning another language. Of all the available languages, Japanese & Chinese were the most appealing, with the former offering better career prospects. It might seem like I'm putting all my eggs in one random basket but there's no escaping the fact that learning a language is a huge commitment. I've decided to go with Japan so I must dedicate myself to achieving that goal, otherwise I risk half-assing everything (i.e. story of my life) and remaining stuck here forever.

May I ask you the same question: why Japan? Why not Spain, Switzerland, Taiwan? I'm curious.

@Diana thanks for jumping in to the discussion. Great insight about that aspect of the Japanese culture, however, how does it actually affect foreigners like me, harhol or TaylorSan that want to emigrate and live in Japan? I don't plan to have children now but when I do I will try to be a great dad, also I don't have any eating disorders and I couldn't give less a s*** about most of stuff... About submissive girls, well maybe I like submissive girls, after all, my experiences so far with *aggressive* girls have been disastrous.

I guess my question is, could you point out any actual "bad" stuff of Japan? Like the kind of stuff that makes you stay away from Japan. Honestly, if girls suicide in Japan because they lacked attention from their salaryman dads, I think that's too bad but I don't see how is that a reason to not like Japan, after all, people suicide everywhere.

No, I can't point any of the bad stuff about Japan that would affect you or Harhol because I am obviously not you or Harhol, so I can't say. I can only say what I HAVE experienced and because I'm not you or you aren't me, everybody's experience is always going to be different. And it is true that people suicide everywhere, but the fact that Japan has one of the world's highest doesn't raise red flags to you? That alone would make me wary, right? I mean, since it's obviously such a great place, how come people are killing themselves there left and right? I'm not trying to come across as being brusque or mean, but I guess what you requested seems a bit difficult since like I said, everybody is going to have a different time there. All of the things that I experienced there did affect me, as a young female looking to work and possibly live in Japan in the future. Even as a male, your experience there will be different, and if you want submissive girls, you've got the place
*rolls eyes, slightly vomits, coughcoughyellowfevercough*

Diana Wrote:One of the things I found really hard was the ability to form close friendships or just how strong tatemae/honmei really is! Though one of the posters said it's not so present amongst younger people, from my experience, I can say that it really is present and not just a "generational thing". I've experienced it in a variety of situations with young people- in high school, at university [...] Honmei and Tatemae and stuff is present and because of that, Japanese people can be really nice to others and then nasty behind their back! They did it in my high school, circle of japanese, friends, etc. I was often surprised by some of the cruelty, or just casual ignorance I witnessed. Sometimes, when a person was in trouble too, others would just ignore that and shrug it off as "Xsans" problem. That really bothered me, and I'm not sure it's a Japanese thing or a worldwide humanity problem...

This sounds like my day-to-day existence growing up as a teenager. Unless I'm missing something obvious I don't see how this is exclusive to Japan. I think the old cliché is at work here - the Japanese have a word for it.

Diana Wrote:Getting Japanese people to open up to you was also something I found very hard. [...] Not willing to admit their feelings, very private person, etc.

Getting people to open up and admit their true feelings is easy in other countries?

Diana Wrote:Another thing I found frustrating was the relative insularity of the culture, and the refusal to accept anything foreign.

One person's cultural insularity is another's pride in tradition. I don't know where I stand on this to be honest. A culture which absorbs too much can lose its identity whereas one unwilling to adapt can become irrelevant. But all established cultures are "insular" to an extent.

Diana Wrote:You are always going to be foreign in Japan, no matter how hard you try.

True of anywhere, surely?

Diana Wrote:Another thing that got relatively annoying was the insecurity I found amongst Japanese girls, both in high school and uni. To my Japanese friends, I am an "aggressive onna" simply because I am the type of person who doesn't take BS from anybody. Case in point: some people were being loud outside our dorm windows the other night, and all the Japanese people were shivering in fear, because they found it annoying but didn't want to do anything about it. I sighed, got up, told the people to shut it...

This would be considered "aggressive" in the UK also.

Diana Wrote:In fact, when I asked said Japanese girls why they didn't, they replied they wanted everyone to get along well together, yada yada.

How is this a bad thing??

Diana Wrote:Or another time when a Japanese girl and I were lost and wandering around trying to find an onsen. She was "too shy" to ask for directions. Again, I being the "aggressive" type went up and asked in Japanese for directions. Times like these make me wanna go *sigh* you know? It's just directions, for crying out loud!!

People from all over the world have difficulty approaching strangers.
____________________________________________________________

Sorry to dissect your (highly interesting) post in such a condescending way but it seems to me as though all these supposed quirks of Japan are more to do with your personality and upbringing rather than the country itself. None of these incidents or traits are in any way unusual to me. In fact, all of them are characteristic of what I'd call "typical" British behaviour. Perhaps it is a case of North America being unlike the rest of the world as opposed to Japan being the odd one out?

Diana Wrote:No, I can't point any of the bad stuff about Japan that would affect you or Harhol because I am obviously not you or Harhol, so I can't say. I can only say what I HAVE experienced and because I'm not you or you aren't me, everybody's experience is always going to be different.

Evidently. And it should be obvious, seems you are so smart, that I didn't ask you to read my future. I am asking you to point out bad stuff about Japan that would affect foreigners in general, people that want to emigrate and live there. Is like if you ask me to point out bad stuff about Venezuela, I would probably tell you about the high crime rate and corruption (just to name two things) which is the stuff that are most likely to affect you if you came here.

@harhol I think Diana is indeed aggressive for most countries standards.

@Diana no pun intended, but you would do just great here in Venezuela, it would be little to just say girls are very aggressive here. They actually rule, geez, is scary.

EDIT: By the way, high suicide rates does not make me wary, it disappoints me to a certain extent though, because they don't appreciate all they have. It's kind of funny to bring up the discussion on eating disorders and suicide rates, because in Venezuela, being the shitty country it is, well, here there is just none of that. Here, the reality of most people is that they don't have time to waste in all that emo crap and ridiculous personality issues (their worries are more like: "will I return alive home?" or "what will we eat tomorrow?" and you've got my word, I am not making this up), it annoys me how people that have access to everything and so many opportunities can be this stupid (Japanese that suicide), geez and people here say I am a sensitive guy.

Diana Wrote:Even as a male, your experience there will be different, and if you want submissive girls, you've got the place smile
*rolls eyes, slightly vomits, coughcoughyellowfevercough*

Haha. Not really, I am open to all the other colors too

Perhaps, and again, I prefaced my message saying that these were all MY personal views, so perhaps they wouldn't necessarily apply to everyone else. But, I can say that my day-to-day existence in the US wasn't colored by tatamae/honmei and that I really think it's something you can only experience when you get there. Perhaps it was something that was part of your teenage existence, now imagine it in a country where nobody ever grows out of it. I also want to add that I have found it easier for people to open up from other cultures and being an IR major in a INTERNATIONAL city and being well acqauinted with 3 cultures, Japan is a particularly tough nut to crack. I think what I'm saying has some worth, but hey, the best thing to do is just experience it, right?
You seem to have already made up your mind about this, so why don't you just go there and see for yourself?

And as for foreigness, I can say as an immigrant to the US that you are not always going to be foreign here, or at least, always feel it. So, no, I don't think it's true of anywhere. And even legally and on the domestic front, Japan has the strictest laws in the world regarding citizenhip and even officially not being foreign. Sorry, but America isn't that strict and several other countries aren't as well. So, even on a legal level, you can't say that is true of anywhere. I mean, what other country is paying its immigrants to leave instead of integrating them into society? Its because Japanese people are so insular that they can't accept the country is a sinking ship and accept the future. I've spoken with Japanese diplomats who echo my view and feel this too, but when I've asked about solution and just suck in their breath, " It will happen, but Japan will have to crash first, then realize it." Even the govt. realizes it is powerless to really do something, until something really bad happens.

And last, as for the aggressive thing, I dunno, but I've spoken to AU, NZ, Brit girls who all agree with me on this, all living in Japan and all echo my sentiments. Not to be condencending, but I guess it seems we all have unusual upbringings and unique personalities according to your worldview, with 'atypical' behavior. It also may seem like a question of personal character or personality, but I think it is a bad thing when somebody or something is personally bothering you and you don't do anything about it. There is a difference between being mean, and also being a doormat. I think it is a bad thing to be a doormat, and to allow other people's decisions to influence your actions. So, I ask, how is that NOT a bad thing? lol I'm sorry, but having to go through life gaman-ing it up isn't my cup of tea.

But, like I said, instead of my dissecting my posts, since you made up your mind, why don't you just go there? I get the distinct impression you guys have really made a decision and are just looking for yes-men to support you. Experience is the best teacher, right? I mean, what do I KNOW obviously?

Haha, thanks for the Venezuela comment! I was actually thinking about Latin America for study abroad (spec. Argentina) but decided to go with Japan again.

Maybe someday, I will conquer Spanish!!

You nailed it! I want yes-men. lol

Seriously, I think you are right, we are just looking for re-affirmation, we have made our minds.

Diana Wrote:Haha, thanks for the Venezuela comment! I was actually thinking about Latin America for study abroad (spec. Argentina) but decided to go with Japan again.

Maybe someday, I will conquer Spanish!!

Well you are welcome to visit. I won't be here next year though, does anybody know where I will be?

I'm not sure when I will come, someday though. I've decided after Japan, it should be Korea, Germany, and Argentina, and the rest I'm not so sure about Sounds great, and since I'm so aggresive and would do great there, maybe I can pick myself up a hot guy.
Except now I'm totally advocating latinofever, which isn't good either, lol. People should love each other for who they are, not where they are from!

I'm not Japanese, but I find Diana to be an aggressive female, as well.

Diana Wrote:I'm not sure when I will come, someday though. I've decided after Japan, it should be Korea, Germany, and Argentina, and the rest I'm not so sure about Sounds great, and since I'm so aggressive and would do great there, maybe I can pick myself up a hot guy.

Oh well from experience you will be getting down the plane yourself and getting in the Taxi with your latino hot guy already.

OK we are moving away from the discussion. I encourage everyone to get back on the tracks. I will post the following questions considering my intention, as well as many others to move to Japan, it appears that obtaining a work Visa is the most (only) logical way to live in there indefinitely.

1) What about: going to Japan as a tourist, apply for a Job and find help to get a Work Visa. Is that possible?
2) How does it work getting a work Visa in Japan? Do you need to be endorsed by a company?
3) If you need the endorsement, which is the most logical, how does it work getting a job at Japan? Should I just send my CV to random companies?
4) What suggestions and advice can you give?