I can recognize any hiragana/katakana character, but when I try to read a sentence in kana, I pronounce it one by one as a child started learning to read!

e.g. na-tsu wa a-tsu-i NOT natsu wa atsui

I started learning Japanese using Romaji. I know it's not good for the learning process, but it was easier and faster.

My reading speed in English is 400-600 words per minute. Can I reach half of this speed in Japanese, so I can scan pages and find particular words in seconds?

I don't know what to say, other than that reading more leads to reading faster.

You answered your own question when you said "like a child". If you did the same thing in your native language when your first started to read then I'm sure reading Kana will fix itself in the exact same way. Once you read enough your brain will start recognizing patterns and will just consume a combination of Kana as one whole chunk instead of assembling each syllable piece by piece. I'm willing to bet you already do this with familiar endings such as desu, arimasu, etc.

Quote:I'm willing to bet you already do this with familiar endings such as desu, arimasu, etc.

That's right. I'll try read more.

The other problems are:

1. I don't know when a word begins and when it ends in Japanese, because words aren't separated by spaces.

2. How can I distinguish between 'ha' and 'wa' (the particle)?

All I can say is that this all comes with practice and getting used to.

Just keep on reading, practicing, etc. They say you don't even read the whole words in your native language, but you recognize the words (because you see them all the time, you just know what they mean by their shape, etc...). Once you start reading enough, it'll all come together.

As for は being 'ha' or 'wa'...That's a bit trickier, but it also comes. It also helps if there's a lot of kanji in the sentences to help separate the words from each other. Sentences, for the most part, all work the same, and so you get used to where the "は" particle is supposed to be used.

Basically, read more and you'll get it.

Listening helps, even if you don't understand everything, because you get used to the flow & nuances of the language. For example, most people know that です is usually pronounced "dess" and not "desu" before they even know what it means, simply from watching subtitled animé. And like activeaero said, you start picking things up piece-by piece as you encounter them more regularly. You'll start seeing この and ありません as complete words rather than ko-no and a-ri-ma-se-n (sorry for these terrible examples, I'm still on Heisig). But I wouldn't worry about it anyway. Bottom line: the more you do it, the better you'll become.

ahibba Wrote:

Quote:I'm willing to bet you already do this with familiar endings such as desu, arimasu, etc.

That's right. I'll try read more.

The other problems are:

1. I don't know when a word begins and when it ends in Japanese, because words aren't separated by spaces.

2. How can I distinguish between 'ha' and 'wa' (the particle)?

I'm pretty much a beginner as well but honestly just stop worrying about it is my best advice. It will just happen. The human brain is all about pattern recognition. After a while it will start recognizing the patterns and will know which kana are together without you even thinking about it.

Also from what I've seen at least reading actually gets "easier", in terms of word separation at least, the more advanced you get because beginner texts often put words into Kana that would normally be in Kanji. This can create the wall-o-kana effect that you wouldn't find if the text was intended for native adults.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong on that last part.

Yea a lot of beginner text (or certain video games like pokemon) can be difficult to read because it uses so much kana. However I think its still very important to be able to read this type of text, because people aren't always going to use kanji. Sometimes I think it is easy to become a bit dependent on kanji.

That s why production cards in anki are really great :besides learning to draw kanjis , you really learn to read kana high speed!

ahibba Wrote:I can recognize any hiragana/katakana character, but when I try to read a sentence in kana, I pronounce it one by one as a child started learning to read!

e.g. na-tsu wa a-tsu-i NOT natsu wa atsui

I started learning Japanese using Romaji. I know it's not good for the learning process, but it was easier and faster.

My reading speed in English is 400-600 words per minute. Can I reach half of this speed in Japanese, so I can scan pages and find particular words in seconds?

I don't know Japanese myself and just like many here I am learning but the answer to your question is *learning Japanese*.

The problem is not reading the Kana. In English you don't read each single letter at a time, you read whole words automatically. Eventually the same will happen in Japanese. So don't focus on speed reading Kana if you don't even know what it says in the first place, focus in learning the Japanese language.

Zarxrax Wrote:Yea a lot of beginner text (or certain video games like pokemon) can be difficult to read because it uses so much kana. However I think its still very important to be able to read this type of text, because people aren't always going to use kanji. Sometimes I think it is easy to become a bit dependent on kanji.

Oh, irony!

A lot of reading is the only cure.

I only learned kana 2 months ago, and I had the same questions as this thread. I knew it would improve, but it starts out so clunky, that it makes you wonder these things. It's an unfamiliar feeling, as none of us have had it since early childhood. But in only 2 months, less even, I read it much much faster, and now it's even starting to feel fluid. My SRS goes Kanji to Kana, so I read the Kana every time I do a sentence. My only problem (temporary) is Katakana.....it just doesn't pop up in my sentences as much, so I'm not nearly as fluid (actually I suck at it LOL).

And I thought the same thing about ha and wa....but in a short time you'll see that it quite naturally is a non issue. The SRS/sentence reading will iron out all your clunky kana recognition, and soon you will breeze through it.

I think the main problem for a beginner is, that everyone try to read KANA-only texts. It would be a lot of easier to start with texts written in Kanji using Furigana.

Another problem is, that most sentences in every normal text would have to difficult grammar. And very much grammar exceptions usage. (I don't know how to say it in english better.)

That was my problem as a beginner and still is. But I can see that it is better than a year ago and I think it will be better in the future.

I learned reading Kana more fluently, with physical vocabulary cards. I wrote them itself. I think for the first 1000 Words, it is even better to learn with text from a textbook and use self written cards.

In school you learned not only reading, you learned at the same time writing, too. Don't forget writing.

It didn't helped a lot with Katakana, because it is in most texts very seldom.

It would be fine to get a Hiragana -> Katakana Converting Programm or Internetpage. So I can printout texts in Katakana and learn to read them.

In another thread you can find Children Bible Stories. I think they could be easier to read for a beginner. It should be easer to see word also, but I think it is not easier to understand:
http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?tid=2964

ahibba Wrote:

Quote:

1. I don't know when a word begins and when it ends in Japanese, because words aren't separated by spaces.

2. How can I distinguish between 'ha' and 'wa' (the particle)?

1. Most of the time kanji separates words. CONTEXT!
2. Once you get used to the language is trivial to distinguish them. Just like the readings of kanji with different CONTEXT. 「ー日　いちにち」　「ー日　ついたち」

To read faster, spend time working on "only" reading faster (no comprehension). Say 15 min reading as fast as possible. Once you get good at it you can do comprehension and speed reading.

Just read novels or manga outloud over and over until you get better at it

Just practice reading and it will come. Try reading the same material over & over.

Katakana is more difficult. When I first started looking at Japanese I subscribed to yesjapan.com, and they had a useful game that showed a hiragana letter and you had to select the matching katakana letter (or vice-versa) as fast as possible. It helped build speed at recognizing both hiragana and katakana.

I had also copied the idea and made it into a DS homebrew game, and playing it over a couple of days did a lot to improve my speed. Sadly I lost it.

vosmiura Wrote:Just practice reading and it will come. Try reading the same material over & over.

Katakana is more difficult. When I first started looking at Japanese I subscribed to yesjapan.com, and they had a useful game that showed a hiragana letter and you had to select the matching katakana letter (or vice-versa) as fast as possible. It helped build speed at recognizing both hiragana and katakana.

I had also copied the idea and made it into a DS homebrew game, and playing it over a couple of days did a lot to improve my speed. Sadly I lost it.

The game or the speed lol?

I just started doing sentences, and I had that same problem. (I guess everyone starts at the same square). I've only gone through about 150 sentences in my SRS, and I'll read some sentences from the goo dictionary. Though my reading speed is still slow, I have noticed that I'm a bit faster.

Also, I've had a huge improvement with particles. を, obviously is easy to spot, but with は, で, に, etc., it took some time, but I'm really getting a grasp on it now.

The thing is, vocabulary helps A LOT. If you can recognize words, the particles jump out at you. If you think you're having trouble figuring out where a word ends and begins, that gets much easier, too. You'll start to realize that certain parts of speech (adjectives, verbs, etc.) end similarly.

As for katakana, you might have to drill those on the side, they are easy to forget.

blackmacros Wrote:The game or the speed lol?

lol, the game.