I listed some of the major differences between a short-term visitor's visa and a waiver above and don't see a need to go through every single detail. They are not just a nitpicking difference if you ever have to actually deal with them. When I first started talking to the immigration office the officer I was speaking with got confused at first and consulted some other people because I was referring to my waiver as a visa. Another time when I talked to them on the phone, the officer really emphasized that I had a waiver and not a visa. I got a strong impression that he had to deal with a lot of foreigners who ran into issues because they mistook the two.

Teachers at a language school are hardly an authority on immigration. The administrators of the school wouldn't be either since they don't deal with immigration if the students all just get waivers (as the school wouldn't be involved in the process at all).

Anyone who is planning on spending a lot of time in Japan owes it to themselves to do research into the immigration laws. When you start researching certain types such as spousal visas it gets very difficult since the requirements vary by city, and no one at the 市役所／区役所/immigration office knows exactly what you need. It's basically an apply and see if they ask for more info/paperwork a few months later process. At least you get an indefinite visa during the application process.

I'm pretty sure bureaucracies were invented to drive humankind mad with nitpicking, so it's best not to fool around and play fast and loose with terms and definitions, especially when your entire lifestyle depends on it. That's my expert opinion on the Japanese system.

nest0r Wrote:I'm pretty sure bureaucracies were invented to drive humankind mad with nitpicking, so it's best not to fool around and play fast and loose with terms and definitions, especially when your entire lifestyle depends on it. That's my expert opinion on the Japanese system.

I've seen many news articles about people playing fast and loose with the expirations on their student visas and end up arrested with fines, possible jail sentences, and blacklisting for years. They had warning posters all over my university.

Virtua_Leaf Wrote:The desire to make the move to Japan seems to grow everyday. Seems extremely complex and impossible, but at the same time you only live once, right? May as well try to fulfill my dream as early as possible?

My Japanese really has to improve before I even think of moving, but it'd be cool to know about this stuff in advance.

There are a few barriers for me, ie. I'm 18, never lived on my own, don't have a passport, reluctant parent(s) etc etc... yeah, any advice you can give? Magic words to make things all work out?

Cheers,

Lots of good advice on this thread. I lived in Japan for a couple of years and worked in Eikaiwa and as an ALT.

Don't take this the wrong way but a lot of younger people on this forum seem to have an unrealistic image of Japan. I'm not saying it is a bad country, but being a foreigner in Japan is not always that easy, and it is tough to find a good job. Eikaiwa and ALT pay is crap and you don't get any respect, also it is insufferably dull. Also Japan has plenty of problems just like any country. Also don't think you are going to move to Japan and work as a video game designer or anime artist etc, the chances of that are basically zero.

My advice to you is to get yourself an education before moving to Japan. It is tough enough to find a job with a degree and experience, without a degree it will be much tougher.

Also I don't think you need to view moving to japan as particularly difficult, I did it and in truth it wasn't that hard. Day to day living is not particulary difficult either. The challenges come from crap jobs and dealing with prejudice etc.

If I were you I would look at doing the following options in order of preference
1. Get a degree in some high demand field, really build up your japanese skills, try to get hired by a Japanese company or a multinational company that may offer you the option of transferring to japan.
2. If you are good academically complete a degree and then try and apply for a scholarship to study in Japan. Alternatively enrol at a university that has an exchange programme with a Japanese university.
3. Complete any degree, and then go to Japan with the JET programme.
4. Complete any degree, and then try to get hired by an Eikaiwa or dispatch company
5. Go on a working holiday

If you are rich go to Japan as a student and study at a Japanese language school.

Also once you are in Japan please don't walk around like you are cool just because you live in Japan, I see heaps of foreigners in japan that are like that. Sorry you aren't cool because you work at GEOS or GABA any monkey can move to Japan and do that.

Sorry for being blunt with my comments. I hope you are successful. Mostly I thought living in Japan was a good experience, but it isn't the promised land. I strongly recommend you think about a career in your own country as well as the opportunity for living in Japan. Have you thought about pursuing something like accounting, law, engineering etc at university?

Virtua_Leaf Wrote:There are a few barriers for me, ie. I'm 18, never lived on my own, don't have a passport, reluctant parent(s) etc etc... yeah, any advice you can give?

With all the visa discussion, most people have overlooked the passport question. Here's where you start: http://www.ips.gov.uk/passport/apply.asp

I'm American myself and our requirements are slightly different, but as I read this page, it seems that if you're over 16 you can apply on your own (no parental authorization required). The documentation required includes a complete birth certificate, evidence of your parents' citizenship, passport photos, and oh yes, some of those engraved documents :-) Looks like you do have to have it co-signed by someone who is a British citizen, is over 18, has a passport of his/her own, and has known you for two years. You will also most likely have to have an identity interview.

Your passport is your first step... may as well get started on that now!

Sorry for the late reply. Thank you everyone for your excellent advice!

Some of these ideas sound great but might be a little out of my reach, so I'll just touch on the responses that seem a bit more possible for me right now.

Okay, this Working Holiday Visa...

Ben_Nielson Wrote:Virtua-Leaf: You're a little lucky, as your profile says you're from the UK. The UK (and Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc...) has a really sweet program with Japan.

This means that you can get the Working Holiday Visa. http://www.uk.emb-japan.go.jp/en/visa/work_hol.html

Generally, in Japan, you're required to have a 4 year degree from a university to get a work visa. There are other exceptions (cultural visas, etc.) but these are generally difficult to get.

So, what the working holiday visa will allow you to do is to get a job in Japan for one year. Move there, decide if you like it, put back some money, and work on some kind of long term situation if you want to stay. Basically you can then think about applying to a language school or Japanese university, or head back to your home country and go to university there. I'd say this is a very perfect break between high school and college and, if you're very active, will allow you to work on increasing your Japanese level substantially.

This sounds like a good bet. So the max amount of time you're allowed to stay is exactly 1 year? So are you suggesting I use this to stay in the country for a while, get a job and then, if I like it, hatch a plan to remain there permanently?

MeNoSavvy Wrote:Sorry for being blunt with my comments.

Not at all, I really enjoyed reading them.

Truth is, I don't want to go to Japan to become like the next head of Nintendo or the godfather of the Yakuza or something. I just want to be there. Start some sort of life.

I keep hearing about these degrees. In truth, the only 'qualifications' I have are a handful of GCSEs. I dropped out of college after a month or two.

I know school history plays a big part in Japan so I always knew this was going to be hard. But, is that type of stuff only for if you want a decent job? Say if you'd be happy with just scraping by everyday, do you really need all that?

And finally,

annabel398 Wrote:

Virtua_Leaf Wrote:There are a few barriers for me, ie. I'm 18, never lived on my own, don't have a passport, reluctant parent(s) etc etc... yeah, any advice you can give?

With all the visa discussion, most people have overlooked the passport question. Here's where you start: http://www.ips.gov.uk/passport/apply.asp

Always a good place to start. Thanks for the site!

I don't think you need any degree at all for a regular work visa. What you need is an employer to support your visa application. Getting an employer without the degree is the hard part.

As Tobberoth says you don't need a degree it just makes it easier, you just need something to make the employer want to employ you and sponsor your visa being fluent in Japanese and having a lot of experience in the area your applying for a job will go along way.

I was in the same situation as you when I left school no real GCSE's and dropped out of college now I'm working my butt off to make up for this i.e. aiming for fluency in Japanese and many years in IT.

Tobberoth Wrote:I don't think you need any degree at all for a regular work visa. What you need is an employer to support your visa application. Getting an employer without the degree is the hard part.

Good to know. Would the Work Visa come after the Working Holiday Visa?

tibul Wrote:As Tobberoth says you don't need a degree it just makes it easier, you just need something to make the employer want to employ you and sponsor your visa being fluent in Japanese and having a lot of experience in the area your applying for a job will go along way.

I was in the same situation as you when I left school no real GCSE's and dropped out of college now I'm working my butt off to make up for this i.e. aiming for fluency in Japanese and many years in IT.

Cool, it does sounds like we have quite similar situation (a big difference being I'm crap with computers ).

How come I never hear anything about being a plain old translator? Translating scripts and what not? That's something I wouldn't mind being once I've reached fluency.

Work Visa is not really the same thing as a Working Holiday Visa. WHV is a special visa for just a few countries I don't think it's very hard to get. Work Visa demands you actively find a job in Japan before you go there and get the employer to apply for the visa for you. You basically have to get a job without even being in Japan, not easy

As for being a translator.... crappy payment, unsecure job, often demands college credentials and experience... it's basically a part-time job which is hard to get

Tobberoth Wrote:Work Visa is not really the same thing as a Working Holiday Visa. WHV is a special visa for just a few countries I don't think it's very hard to get. Work Visa demands you actively find a job in Japan before you go there and get the employer to apply for the visa for you. You basically have to get a job without even being in Japan, not easy

As for being a translator.... crappy payment, unsecure job, often demands college credentials and experience... it's basically a part-time job which is hard to get

Not sure if this is true but I remember reading some were that if you found an employer willing to sponsor your working visa while you was on a working holiday visa you would be allowed to stay without having to leave the country (although they don't actively promote this), anybody know if this is true?

If you don't have a degree, no problem, you can get a TESL or TEFL certificate in about three months. Once this is done, go online for teaching jobs in Japan and apply. The company you get your certificate from may help you with job placement. The company that hires you will sponsor you so you can get your visa. Of course you need to get your passport on your own. Once all this is done you're all set.

Because the original poster has never been to Japan, maybe doesn't know if it's for him, and maybe hasn't traveled much, I would suggest the following:

Work a lot, save a bunch of money--enough to cover your expenses for the say, 3 months or so of tourist visa allowed. Take some classes part-time or whatever just to get your college education a little underway. Study some Japanese in the interim, even just a good grasp of traveler's Japanese. When the money is saved up (travel/accomodations/food/transportation/fun money), just get your passport, your traveler's visa and GO. Stay in long-stay houses as have been mentioned, stay in youth hostels to meet other travelers (you're young, they're still bearable when you're young). Go, see as much of the country as you can, take it in. Experience Japan in a 3-month joyride of freedom, meeting other travelers and locals along the way. It will be an experience you NEVER forget and you'll learn a lot.

After that experience you'll know for sure what you think of Japan. You may fall in love with it, and will want to be fluent, and will want to get back by any means possible. Or you may decide that it was a helluva lot of fun, but not for you long-term, then you go on with your life. I would not go blindly into a teaching job at your age. If you decide you want to try for a long-stay later, you'll love Japan enough already to put up with the headaches about which stories are legion.

So, work, save money, go and have a blast. Then decide what to do long-term. You're so young. Just do it.

i just wanted to let you know, if you plan on visiting the Tokyo area, i highly recommend staying at the Yoshida House hostel: http://yoshidahouse.net/en/index_en.html it's about $500 a month or $22 a day... i stayed there on several occasions with my fiance... the best thing about it is that they won't charge you by how many people you bring with you (this is a common way to charge in Japan) but only by the room... so you could bring a friend and split the cost if you like.... there are several bilingual people that live there that would be more than happy to help you out...

I stayed at a hostel in Kyoto for three months for only 900yen per night. http://k.fc2.com/cgi-bin/hp.cgi/kyoto-inn/?pnum=0_0
Many Japanese used it as a cheap starting point when looking for an apartment in the Kyoto area after moving from other parts of Japan. You have to get the sleeping bag bunk option that has no padding. There is free internet and a cool lookout point from the roof. There is a 99yen shop a ten minute walk away for cheap food as well. It centrally located near NiJou castle

Japan isn't a fantastic wonderous utopia of a country, you should really try to see the real side of it before wanting to migrate there.

It is filled with problems such as racism, a ridiculous government, and obscene laws and a police force that is probably the worst in the world.

Doing the ALT gig for a year or two is probably the most you will ever want to experience, unless you have no hopes and dreams of ever having a decent wage or self-respect.

Wizard Wrote:Japan isn't a fantastic wonderous utopia of a country, you should really try to see the real side of it before wanting to migrate there.

It is filled with problems such as racism, a ridiculous government, and obscene laws and a police force that is probably the worst in the world.

Doing the ALT gig for a year or two is probably the most you will ever want to experience, unless you have no hopes and dreams of ever having a decent wage or self-respect.

Absolutely not reflective of my experience. It was the greatest time of my life and I plan on moving back in a year or two.

I'm with Wizard to an extent. Thinking you will want to permanently live in Japan just because you've learned some Japanese and have seen some Japanese dramas and anime just isn't very educated thinking. Real life Japan is completely different from what you think it will be, no matter what you think it will be

My year in Tokyo made me realize that while I love tons of things about Japan, there's also quite a lot to dislike. While I love how polite Japanese people are, I'm annoyed by how shallow they can be at the same time. It often feels like their politeness is just trained, it isn't any actual real feelings. There's definitely issues with their government. The whole educational and working system is crap, they work waaaay to hard in school without really learning much (they need to cut down on rote memorization all over asia...) and they work every hour of every day, endlessly... without any real use for the money since they are always working!!

I definitely want to go there again, live there again. I'll even want to work there some. But live there permanently? No way.

Screw that, I'm going to be a yakuza. Japan is filled with high technology and zen monks and junk, I'm going to have my own robot.

nest0r Wrote:Screw that, I'm going to be a yakuza. Japan is filled with high technology and zen monks and junk, I'm going to have my own robot.

Will it be a robot catgirl maid that also fights crime?

Jarvik7 Wrote:

nest0r Wrote:Screw that, I'm going to be a yakuza. Japan is filled with high technology and zen monks and junk, I'm going to have my own robot.

Will it be a robot catgirl maid that also fights crime?

Don't be ridiculous.




It'll be a robot bunnygirl maid that also fights crime.

QuackingShoe Wrote:

Jarvik7 Wrote:

nest0r Wrote:Screw that, I'm going to be a yakuza. Japan is filled with high technology and zen monks and junk, I'm going to have my own robot.

Will it be a robot catgirl maid that also fights crime?

Don't be ridiculous.




It'll be a robot bunnygirl maid that also fights crime.

Technically if it's part animal, it will be a cyborg guys, let's be clear here.

I went to Japan for 16 days and got to stay with a host family (it *was* only 16 days, so take this with a grain of salt). We did touristy stuff a little bit, but for the most part it was hanging out with the kids at and after school--doing the stuff they do everyday. It was a great experience. Beforehand I thought I would love every second of it. I thought, dang, this is Japan, this is going to be the experience of a lifetime. And it was. It was probably some of the best 16 days I've ever had. But, I can sympathize with some of the above comments. I thought it would be perfect, but it wasn't. One huge issue that I had was that I found many of the Japanese males that I encountered very, very sarcastic and obnoxious towards me specifically. They didn't do this to the other guys on the trip. They did it to me. I think it's just because I was different. I *hate* sports, and I'm very bad at them. I'm not extremely weird or anything, but I knew there was something about me they didn't like. Now, I'm not saying all Japanese males are like this. And my emotional state from being in Japan away from home on such an awesome trip for 16 days was probably a tad askew. But, still. It wasn't quite what I expected. Half of the time everybody loves you because you're a foreigner and the other half the time they're sarcastic because you're different. Another thing was that I had a huge probably just doing stuff day to day as far as interacting with other people. They almost never tell you to do something outright. They suggest that's a possibility or a good idea. Or they say that you could do X if you wanted. Remember, these are my own personal experiences interpreted through my own bias, so don't judge the country based on them. But, after all these weird experiences, I did, however, discover what I did and did not like about Japan. This sounds weird, but a short trip might very well be the best way to determine your "compatibility" with Japan. You'll be surprised at what you do and do not like.

I would not want to be born in Japan. The quality of life for an average Japanese is far less than their Western counterparts. For a Japanese national, the educational system is crap, workdays are long, neighboring countries hate you for things that happened 80 years ago, and if you are arrested for anything, there is a 99.9% conviction rate. Being a Gaijin in Japan affords most of the positives with few of the negatives.

I loved the convenience of everything. There is an awareness of the smallest details when buying anything service oriented. Food is healthy and fresh. People are very friendly if only for the reason of practicing their English. Being a Western guy in Japan affords its own perks if you are single. Even the skiniest, geekiest guys walk around with hot girls in their arms. You will never feel as safe in a big city as you do in Japan. Forget your wallet at the bus stop? There is a good chance it will still be there a few hours later to retrieve it.

I think Tobberoth is wrong about not needing a degree for a regular work visa; I've heard that it's not technically a law, but it's a guideline issued by the government which all businesses comply with. Trust me, eikaiwas would hire kids fresh out of high school if they could, or at least consider degreeless applicants with TESL training.
Of course, as everyone says, Japan is neither a Utopia nor Hell, but different people have different experiences. Just have an open mind and wait & see -- that might be the best approach.
And Wizard, "the worst police force in the world?" I don't mean to sound rude, but give your ***** head a shake. That's not only ridiculous on its face, but really insulting to anyone living in a country with a truly oppressive police force. Maybe you just meant it as a figure of speech, but get real. That's just the kind of hyperbole that helps nobody.