kazelee Wrote:Ignore this person. Pretty soon he'll fade away.

You're right. It's no fun to argue against someone who is irrational. I'll start ignoring now.

kazelee Wrote:My suggestion to everyone:

Ignore this person. Pretty soon he'll fade away.

Jesus Christ, boy! At least learn to edit the quotations before posting!

Apart from that this was the very best post you have added - I mean the part I quoted here - and I strongly suggest you and your "friends" can restrain yourself enough to follow this clever advice. Now it's nothing but a kindergarten where the more mature and decent majority of this forum have no interest whatsoever in.

The wrong part was: I will not fade away! Read my lips: worse bullies than your amateur attempts have never been successful in getting me to "fade away" so don't expect such a miracle to happen. Sorry.

BTW ... "to everyone"??? Are you suddenly the leader of the pack now telling the rest of the membership here what to do and not to do?? My, my. The Not So Silent Minority is suddenly transformed into the Voice of Us All. Pretty tough task, isn't it?

The guys berating him are getting just as irritating. Stop please.

Bryan_Saxton Wrote:I'll start ignoring now.

Thanks! Very much appreciated. Hopefully all posters IN THIS THREAD with no higher ambition than to regulate the level of testosterone/adrenaline will fade away, instead of me. There is hope for a peaceful New Year!

zodiac Wrote:Even if wccrawford misunderstood your words, even if he did not read your post fully, saying "Do not people read simple English anymore??" is not polite.

Yes, I agree. It was a totally unnecessary embellishment, but I admit getting something of a shock seeing the first posts here, after starting my post with praising the kind and polite atmosphere here!!! It threw me slightly off the track, to be honest. Now I am more used. :-) But also rather saddened. Silly boys!

alyks Wrote:The guys berating him are getting just as irritating. Stop please.

So you had no serious intention with your previous post asking how "my method" differed from your Movie Method? Merely venting, you too? A pity, since my reply was indeed written out of curiosity and a desire to learn more.

KanjiHanzi, I seem to believe that the problem with your studying methods are not related to Japanese being to difficult, but a personal problem. You need to relax. All of your posts just seem to rant on and on without making any kind of real point.

I read your blog, and it was very difficult to keep my attention. It doesn't seem to follow any kind of path, but rather your thought process was quite incoherent. I really don't even understand the point of the website, nor do I see how any student could actually follow your musings to 2k+ kanji.

Also, this post is not a personal attack, although I can certainly see how it could be interpreted as such.

Also, are you seriously saying you are doing a kanji lesson for japanesepod101 when it took you, what, 8 years and still don't know the language?

KanjiHanzi Wrote:

alyks Wrote:The guys berating him are getting just as irritating. Stop please.

So you had no serious intention with your previous post asking how "my method" differed from your Movie Method? Merely venting, you too? A pity, since my reply was indeed written out of curiosity and a desire to learn more.

No dude, you're taking it the wrong way. I want people to stop saying things like "Being a dick is. You are being a dick." because it's not helping anything. Are we adults here? I mean, have we really sunk that low as to call other people names?

http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?p...0#pid37280

nest0r Wrote:LOL I love this guy.

Oooops! Something that COULD be just what it looks like at first sight: nice :-) But I am sure you mean EXACTLY the opposite but try to be a rebel against the Vocal Majority. Hehehe.

No one is bullying you, though a few have insulted you.

From what I read, you have nothing new to add, but are yelling from the mountain about something revolutionary. I looked at your website, it wasn't very well organized, nor did it offer anything I'm interested in. From what I've seen, people on this forum use ANY method that works. Heisig works, its been tried and tested, and hundreds here can attest. You, however haven't completed your own method, but are ready to publish a book on it. You have an answer to everything.

Why don't you copy and paste your exact 1st post on an anti-Heisig forum and see it turns out. I'm fairly certain that they won't like your attitude either.

I took a hint from Khatzu of AJATT http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/
He said, he DID NOT talk about AJATT until he used it extensively, and achieved acceptable proficiency in Japanese. I'm doing the same, and until I finish RtK I will not be talking about how great/horrible it is on my blog.

As always, good luck

alyks Wrote:I mean, have we really sunk that low as to call other people names?

I admit being more than surprised and also rather sad.

Nevertheless I hope to hear it from the source: How would you possibly compare the Movie Method with the not at all revolutionary approach I have tried to sketch here (among all the noise)?? No matter what approach I would use I would go ahead just like I do with Hanzi now: add the reading, meaning and Hanzi on a card in Anki and merely keep on learning and reviewing. no frills and no thrills.

I really regret I didn't do this the last time with RtK when I finally finished all the 2042 Kanji. In Mandarin its absolutely effortless: the sounds/readings are almost instantly memorized in most cases, requiring more than the normal fade-out in Anki. But I am only six months into Mandarin where the first two months were spent learning pinyin, tones and pronunciation only; the only really difficult part in Mandarin, in my opinion. Perhaps there is a deep, black hole somewhere ahead, but I have seen no clues about what this possibly could be, stopping the smooth curve upwards.

KanjiHanzi, do you memorize the readings by rote?

Your anki deck sounds similar to mine. Some time ago I uploaded an anki deck to ExtraDecks on anki wiki. It was a deck of 9933 hanzi, reading and meaning. I had experimented with it and did not really like it. But you seem to have an easier time learning readings "effortlessly".

May I ask you how much hanzi you have in your deck?

KanjiHanzi Wrote:

nest0r Wrote:LOL I love this guy.

Oooops! Something that COULD be just what it looks like at first sight: nice :-) But I am sure you mean EXACTLY the opposite but try to be a rebel against the Vocal Majority. Hehehe.

Actually you're beginning to grow on me. Your gratuitous use of capital letters to emphasize whole words or highlight cliches, the way you reverse accusations against you without processing them, the short imperative statements and repetitions, the old-fashioned idioms. You have kind of a vintage carny persona, or a traveling 'snake oil' salesman. It's brilliant and I've been laughing quite a bit today thanks to your tenaciousness. I don't know what your ultimate point is, but you've certainly been entertaining. I imagine you've got some good ideas but everyone here does, I'll just wait till you find your balance amongst all the other independent-minded self-study folks active on this forum. Either that or you'll move on, whichever works.

oregum Wrote:From what I read, you have nothing new to add, but are yelling from the mountain about something revolutionary.

For the nTh time around: I have never claimed to have anything close to being revolutionary. It's entirely your reading and subjective INTERPRETATION of what i wrote. I really **LOVE** what I am doing - learning Kanji/Hanzi, Mandarin etc. - and may be overly enthusiastic about this pleasant fact of life. I am really easily satisfied: I can spend an entire day doing nothing but writing hundreds of Chinese Characters and consider it a very great day when I have this opportunity.

My only ambition with the post was to share a bit of this joy: look! It's fun and easy to learn Mandarin after learning the 2042 devils -) - beauties, I say, myself - in RtK 1. As you can see it's a matter of opinion, but my rather extensive experience with Japanese and a much short love affair with Mandarin, suggest a considerable difference in difficulty.

oregum Wrote:I looked at your website,]it wasn't very well organized ...

Since I haven't added much stuff there at all - this Kanji Lesson was actually the second post - so any lack of organization has to be blamed so far on the most common blog system in the world: Blogger. I think it's considered as THE standard among blog systems. But I can assure that I will be able to add much chaos and disorganization when I finally start to add MUCH STUFF! But not yet.

oregum Wrote:You, however haven't completed your own method, but are ready to publish a book on it. You have an answer to everything.

That is indeed an opinion you can have, but it's not based on facts. I have absolutely no intentions whatsoever to publish a book. Not now. Not later.

I most certainly have no answers to most questions you might want to ask (and I haven't received any honestly formulated questions apart from those few I have really replied to. On the other hand, I consider myself rather knowledgeable when it comes to Kanji/Hanzi after a long life admiring them and 8+ years studying them, and this is not a conviction I am shy about at all, no matter if it might prove to be nothing but hubris in the end :-)

oregum Wrote:Why don't you copy and paste your exact 1st post on an anti-Heisig forum and see it turns out. I'm fairly certain that they won't like your attitude either.

I am not enough familiar with Chinese Forums to say if it's dominated by anti-Heisig opinions or not, but I did exactly what you suggest there as soon as I have posted it here. It was rejected by the moderator of the very reason that it was a copy of the post here. It should have been an original post intended for THAT forum only, something I haven't yet had time to write. I am in no hurry at all, though.

oregum Wrote:I'm doing the same, and until I finish RtK I will not be talking about how great/horrible it is on my blog.

Since I finished RtK for more than a year ago, perhaps it's OK if I write about it on my own blog? Please?

oregum Wrote:As always, good luck

Always? :-) But thanks.

Why is this thing still going on?

This topic should be closed.

The only new contributions are borderline insults and defenses.

People either get it or they don't and it is obvious that they did not.

KanjiHanzi made a bad impression and defended himself/ herself with vigor and enthusiasm. He/ she has an answer for everyone.

I truley believe that KanjiHnazi is enjoying all of the attention. I mean, 5 pages in a couple days is impressive. What a debut. And over the same thing. It is either a big insecurity to defend yourself like that, or a huge dose of vanity to write out a defense for every objection or critique. I get the impression that KanjiHanzi hits the refresh button every 2 minutes to bask in the glory he/she created eagerly waiting to respond to the next insult. I could be wrong, but looking at the times posted almost makes it seem that way. I hope I am wrong

If the topic is not closed off, can we then just ignore it. It is ironic, "word of the day", that I need to make a post to suggest we stop posting.

I actually did have one critique, but I will save it for something better.

One more thing:
Welcome KanjiHanzi. I hope you like it here. May we benifit from your insights for other topics. You are obviously a thinker, just a little misunderstood this time. I do hope you stay. I did not mean to offend, (if I did), just to make a point on how ridiculous this thread has gotten. (Actually I had a few laughs myself. Some of you guys are funny.)

Wisher (making a wish)

zodiac Wrote:KanjiHanzi, do you memorize the readings by rote?

I really don't make an effort to memorize them. I require of myself to be able to say the reading loud every time the Hanzi pops up. If I don't remember I look and speak. And sometimes take a trip to nciku.com and play the sound bite there. Rather soon I just remember the reading. Sometimes it only takes one attempt to have it glued.

I made a mistake to add an entire group of Hanzi revolving around what Heisig has named "Call" and just so because he got the etymology a bit messed up there. There is no strong relationship between Kanji 1484 (Even) and the Call Kanji 1485). Call is more from the same roots as the potato group of Kanji. I think (without checking mu facts again.) Nevertheless I got an overload of fairly similar Hanzi, with similar readings AND a totally different reading and a few compounds translated into exactly the same ENglish meaning. A mess that took me a lot of time to get out from!!! But that's the one and only exception to easy ride.

zodiac Wrote:Your anki deck sounds similar to mine. Some time ago I uploaded an anki deck to ExtraDecks on anki wiki. It was a deck of 9933 hanzi, reading and meaning. I had experimented with it and did not really like it. But you seem to have an easier time learning readings "effortlessly".

May I ask you how much hanzi you have in your deck?

I would not touch a deck like the one you mention. I create everything as soon as I encounter new stuff or have time to add from the 500 most frequent 'words' (actually Hanzi) book I mentioned here. As soon as I have cleared the deck I add some 10-25 new items a day and infrequently more than that. The problem is to get to that bloody bottom of the deck quickly enough!!

I really can't tell if I am unique in learning Hanzi/Mandarin reading very fast (since I have nothing to compare with apart from my own Japanese studies). What I DO THINK I benefit from is that I once in lifetime was very careful studying ONE (or three, actually) things first: Mandarin pronunciation/tones and pinyin. I just kept repeating and repeating until I could accept it as good enough to move ahead. Thanks to this patience I am rather confident with the very difficult Chinese sounds, at least compared with the absolutely straightforward Japanese sounds/syllables.

That's the only advice I can give: learn the sounds and learn them as well as you possibly can. Sooner than later. You can get along perfectly well with little or no ability with Japanese pitch accent, but the Mandarin tones: Required. You CAN even get away with a *moderately* sloppy pronunciation of the various sounds, since there is a considerable variation even among what is considered as Beijing Official Mandarin. But not the tones!

I wish I could tell how many Hanzi I have, but I have not kept Hanzi and 'words' apart in any way. There are even a bunch of carefully selected full sentences. Today I have 959 FACTS - cards - there and I would guess that 55-70% is single Hanzi.

That's it.

Wisher Wrote:Why is this thing still going on?

This topic should be closed.

Yet another border patrol. You guys just don't seem to get THIS: The site owner is the boss. He has managed to keep this a Very Nice place for years and I am absolutely convinced he will make the correct decisions now too. Whatever they are or will be I will bow and salute them.

Wisher Wrote:The only new contributions are borderline insults and defenses.

I can't really view my posts as "defenses" since there is really nothing here to defend against. What's the defense against ugly language and silly insinuations? Nada. I merely use my right to point out what I consider as either downright lies or severe distortions of what I have written here. I can't let that stand without correction.

Wisher Wrote:I truley believe that KanjiHnazi is enjoying all of the attention.

This is a typical example of what I consider totally unfounded insinuations. I don't have any need for attention. If that was the case I would have posted a lot here when I started to be a regular visitor. Years ago. My need for attention on the web has been satisfied by my WORK done and finished years ago. I've been running web sites with x00,000 visitors. More than 10 years ago. No more need for that kind of limelight.

I would much have preferred to have been totally ignored here instead of the mess you guys have created here, with the some minimal and benign support of yours truly. It has no usefulness at all to have that rather neutral, initial post to be buried in this kind of kindergarten. Really. Silence would have been golden.

If I had had the slightest hint that I was so wrong about the OVERALL friendly nature here - i.e. that no such mob as the one we have seen here existed on this forum - I would absolutely have decided against posting here. Absolutely.

But on the other hand I don't mind silly boys making fools of themselves. As a previous poster said: it can be quite funny and entertaining. But sad. Too.

KanjiHanzi Wrote:

Wisher Wrote:The only new contributions are borderline insults and defenses.

I can't really view my posts as "defenses" since there is really nothing here to defend against. What's the defense against ugly language and silly insinuations? Nada. I merely use my right to point out what I consider as either downright lies or severe distortions of what I have written here. I can't let that stand without correction.

I did the same thing against you. Took the parts of your posts that i didn't agree with and simply wrote why I didn't agree with them. Instead of taking my critique seriously, you simply ignored it or misinterpreted it (like saying I claimed people who don't use Heisig can't learn Japanese or Chinese, which is ridiculous since I already said I PERSONALLY learned Japanese before using Heisig). When I kept bringing the same critique up, even clarifying it, did you answer it seriously? Nope, you simply called me a rabid dogmatic (WTF?) and started to ignore me.

How can you seriously claim your above post isn't hypocrisy? Since our discussion, your posts have given me a slightly better idea what your "technique" entails... but I still can't find anything wrong in my earlier posts, and I can't find anything in them to make you believe I'm a dogmatic. I wouldn't mind if you could explain maybe by those QUOTES you seem to like so much, how I came of as a "rabid dogmatic" just because I criticised a small part of your posts.

KanjiHanzi Wrote:If that was the case I would have posted a lot here when I started to be a regular visitor. Years ago.

You keep saying this a lot. I'm NOT calling you a lier, but can you maybe tell us the username of your previous account? Since this one (kanjihanzi) has just been at the forum for a few days.

Tobberoth Wrote:

KanjiHanzi Wrote:If that was the case I would have posted a lot here when I started to be a regular visitor. Years ago.

You keep saying this a lot. I'm NOT calling you a lier, but can you maybe tell us the username of your previous account? Since this one (kanjihanzi) has just been at the forum for a few days.

Why on earth should I do that?? It's really none of your business. And I don't care if you call me a liar, you silly boy. Why would I bother here? In this thread?!?!

KanjiHanzi Wrote:

Tobberoth Wrote:

KanjiHanzi Wrote:If that was the case I would have posted a lot here when I started to be a regular visitor. Years ago.

You keep saying this a lot. I'm NOT calling you a lier, but can you maybe tell us the username of your previous account? Since this one (kanjihanzi) has just been at the forum for a few days.

Why on earth should I do that?? It's really none of your business. And I don't care if you call me a liar, you silly boy. Why would I bother here? In this thread?!?!

Why on earth WOUDLN'T you?

So, you've lied about your presence on this forum. Is it safe to assume that you're lying about your age and experience with learning languages too? Who knows, maybe you've been lying about how effective your technique has worked for you in Chinese.

You should care because you're trying to seem legitimate, what harm does it do telling us your real account name? No harm at all. Your insistence not to tells quite clearly that you've been lying and you're trying to hide it. Simply admitting that you haven't actually been here for "years" would have been a much wiser than simply refusing to tell us the name of the account.

I think kanjihanzi visited but did not post.

Yes, I shouldn't have insulted you personally. I feel bad about that and hope you'll accept my apology.

I do think you need to cool down though. Nobody has a personal grudge against you, and continually taking every comment in the worst way is going to cause you a ton of stress.

Also please stop calling us silly little boys all the time, it's just as demeaning as "foul language".

zodiac Wrote:I think kanjihanzi visited but did not post.

So you mean he hung around on this forum, for YEARS without even making an account? Possible, but very unlikely. And if that was the case, why didn't he simply say so instead of going "I WON'T TELL YOU MY PERSONAL DETAILS LIKE MY ACCOUNT NAME ON A FORUM"?

Tobberoth Wrote:

KanjiHanzi Wrote:

Tobberoth Wrote:You keep saying this a lot. I'm NOT calling you a lier, but can you maybe tell us the username of your previous account? Since this one (kanjihanzi) has just been at the forum for a few days.

Why on earth should I do that?? It's really none of your business. And I don't care if you call me a liar, you silly boy. Why would I bother here? In this thread?!?!

Why on earth WOUDLN'T you?

So, you've lied about your presence on this forum. Is it safe to assume that you're lying about your age and experience with learning languages too? Who knows, maybe you've been lying about how effective your technique has worked for you in Chinese.

You should care because you're trying to seem legitimate, what harm does it do telling us your real account name? No harm at all. Your insistence not to tells quite clearly that you've been lying and you're trying to hide it. Simply admitting that you haven't actually been here for "years" would have been a much wiser than simply refusing to tell us the name of the account.

And you think I would even bother to reply to this kind of crazy insinuations?!?! You can use your sick imagination until you turns blue. I really wouldn't mind.

"what harm does it do telling us your real account name"

None. I just simply refuse to get bullied around by weird little brats truing to be smart. My REAL account name is KanjiHanzi. Today. So now tell when you are approaching an appropriate blueness.