After learning Japanese for two years, passing JLPT 3, and having knowledge (shape, readings, compounds) of around 400 kanji, I'm finding it increasingly difficult to take the step up to JLPT Level 2. So I've decided to go with Heisig.

My question is- is it really disadvantageous to learn the readings of kanji while following the Heisig method? I feel like I might as well make an effort to learn the readings while I'm learning the stories. What do you think?

I'm worried that any time spent on Heisig will deprive me of valuable time learning compouds, readings and vocabulary for JLPT2 next december- reassure me!

I just see it as a huge waste of time to try learning readings, set apart from the words they occur in, in the first place. Also, it takes time away from Heisig, which is nice to just get out of the way as fast as possible.
But if you don't mean that, and just mean you wonder if you can study Japanese in general at the same time, and therefore be learning vocabulary and etc, totally incidentally of Heisig, I would say that it isn't a problem. Ideally you would, again, want to get Heisig out of the way as quickly as possible but... Ugh, burnout.
But attempting to learn the readings of each kanji as you come to it in Heisig is a waste of time and defeats the purpose, in my opinion, unless you use some alternative method like the 'Movie Method' or whatever.

Off the top of my head, there are at least four problems with learning the readings of kanji along with Heisig:

1. You must remember more pieces of information with each Kanji (writing and reading)
2. There are too many readings for each Kanji
3. Because of 1. and 2., it will slow you down (take you longer to complete all)
4. Because of 3., it may hurt your chances of completing Heisig (thus, losing almost everything)

I think it's possible to learn the reading of kanji along with Heisig, but you may need superhuman levels of willpower and persistence - as if completing Heisig by itself is not hard enough by itself.

Starting after having 400 under your belt is by no means, too late.
What you learn in Heisig will help you into JLPT1, when you pick up more advanced vocabulary. Instead of being shocked by complicated Kanji, having seen them before in Heisig will help you tear apart 熟語 and learn them in an easier and more efficient manner. It's worth the investment.

Good luck.

I think you could to do RTK faster without trying to do the readings at the same time. That will leave you more time to learn readings and vocabulary later. You may find learning the vocabulary and readings much easier and faster once the kanji themselves are no longer a problem. There's also a "lite" version of RTK that reduces the book to only those characters on the JLPT2 list:
http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?p...9#pid16019
You might want to check that out if this is your main reason for doing it, but there is an advantage in doing all of RTK.

I came to Heisig super late -- I don't want to admit how long I've been learning Japanese or all the classes I've taken and books I've used. But this has been a great help in reading faster and more accurately, without relying on dictionaries nearly as much. I've found that once I know the RTK keyword and see the kanji in context, I often remember the reading without studying it (again) separately. I'm picking up and retaining new vocabulary faster, too.

Edit: fixed link

I had about 500 kanji/compounds in the "mastered" column on speedanki.com before finding this site. I don't know how many of those I could write. I just had the ability to recognize them and remember the readings. It took me forever to reach that point though. If you dedicate yourself, you will know how to write 3,007 kanji and know at least one meaning of each in about 3 months (skipping RTK2). Not a big sacrifice of time. The next nine months of traditional study will become much more effective.

Wow thanks for your comments, support and encouragement! I'll do as you say- learn RtK 1 first, possible while continuing to review vocab but not while learning readings.

Question 2- if I'm encountering kanji I already know, I don't need to remember the story, right? I only need to remember the primitive if the kanji has one, correct?

stevesayskanpai Wrote:Question 2- if I'm encountering kanji I already know, I don't need to remember the story, right? I only need to remember the primitive if the kanji has one, correct?

That's tricky. For super-easy Kanji like 人 and 日, you can probably get away with using your old memory (without a story). However, you may find that certain Kanji you >thought< you knew, you will forget while doing Heisig, because you didn't make up a story.

I would say don't worry about those too much. If you use a SRS, the ones you forget will come up - at that time, you can decide to use a Heisig story or not... ...the reason you don't have to follow this like a religion is, eventually the keywords will fall away.

One of the underlying reasons for doing Heisig (not often discussed) is actually to become familiar with all the general use Kanji, so when they come up in real vocabulary (熟語、動詞、副詞、など), you are not intimidated and can learn them quickly and efficiently.

kfmfe04 Wrote:

stevesayskanpai Wrote:Question 2- if I'm encountering kanji I already know, I don't need to remember the story, right? I only need to remember the primitive if the kanji has one, correct?

That's tricky. For super-easy Kanji like 人 and 日, you can probably get away with using your old memory (without a story). However, you may find that certain Kanji you >thought< you knew, you will forget while doing Heisig, because you didn't make up a story.

I would say don't worry about those too much. If you use a SRS, the ones you forget will come up - at that time, you can decide to use a Heisig story or not... ...the reason you don't have to follow this like a religion is, eventually the keywords will fall away.

One of the underlying reasons for doing Heisig (not often discussed) is actually to become familiar with all the general use Kanji, so when they come up in real vocabulary (熟語、動詞、副詞、など), you are not intimidated and can learn them quickly and efficiently.

I agree that for simple kanji like 人 and 日 you are unlikely to forget them. Probably EVER. However, for others it may not hurt to make a story. You may likely come across other kanji that are similar to ones you know, and just have not encountered yet. When you meet them, having two different stories for slightly different kanji will go a long way to helping you distinguish between very similar and easily confused kanji.

I can definitely see your point; doing RTK (as I am at the moment) seems like treading water because one is not increasing one's spoken vocabulary at all and since it requires a huge amount of effort and dedication learning new stuff on top of this is a very big ask. However, I sort of have the hope that doing RTK is like building solid foundations for learning Japanese, so once one has it under one's belt future progress will be much better than if one had not done it.

I started doing RtK after passing JLPT2. I completely ignored readings. It simply isn't worth the effort, you learn readings WAY faster by learning vocabulary.

You could learn all the ways 上 can be pronounced... or just learn words like 上がる, 上る and 上手. That way you learn words and readings at the same time, without ANY extra effort.

I also recommend learning stories for every single kanji. You won't save a lot of time skipping it and it's worth it so you NEVER forget how a kanji is written (it happens eventually, trust me). You don't need to actively know the stories but they should be there if you are ever in doubt. For example, if you're going to write 未だ you might be wondering if the top stroke is longer or shorter than the middle stroke. If you simply learned the kanji from exposure and haven't seen them in a while, chances are you will write it wrong. With the story, all you need is to remember a small small part of it ("Oh right, the branches have NOT YET grown out". You're just making your knowledge more independant, you won't have to worry about doubting yourself.