yudantaiteki Wrote:2. 子 cannot be used for the particle "no"; I think the initial person replied to the wrong post and others were trying to guess at what it could have meant.

[Edit: The following is wrong, so don't quote me on it! Since 子 was credited as an old version of "no" before in this thread I just assumed it filled the same function in the riddle without thinking carefully! The anecdote is still interesting though ^^]

Please forgive me for bringing something as obscure as this up but 子 has actually been used to represent "no" before. Emperor Saga, the 52th emperor of Japan is credited to have presented the following riddle to Ono Takamura during the Heian period: 子子子子子子子子子子子子. The solution to the riddle is said to be ねこのここねこ、ししのここじし (Child of the cat, kitten. Child of the Lion, cub).

I cannot seem to find the documents my professor gave me about this anywhere right now so I will have to refer to the perhaps not so scholarly japanese wikipedia website instead (http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%AD%90%E...0%E5%AD%90).

Of course, I'm not arguing that 子 have enjoyed wide usage as a substitute for の or that it has ever been used like this on any other occassion (as this historical incident is as far as my knowledge on the subject of 子-の goes) but rather providing a hopefully interesting little historical anecdote : )

Count the number of 子 and the number of syllables in the reading again. (The の is not represented in the kanji; it was commonly inserted in between kanji sequences in classical Japanese whether or not it was actually represented in kana. Thus the neverending debate about whether, for instance, 藤原定家 is Fujiwara *no* Teika or just Fujiwara Teika.)

This little tale is in the Uji Shui Monogatari; I've also seen it in a classical commentary to one of the travel Kokinshu poems that was written by Ono Takamura.

yudantaiteki Wrote:Count the number of 子 and the number of syllables in the reading again. (The の is not represented in the kanji; it was commonly inserted in between kanji sequences in classical Japanese whether or not it was actually represented in kana. Thus the neverending debate about whether, for instance, 藤原定家 is Fujiwara *no* Teika or just Fujiwara Teika.)

This little tale is in the Uji Shui Monogatari; I've also seen it in a classical commentary to one of the travel Kokinshu poems that was written by Ono Takamura.

You're right! And I cannot see why I didn't realize this as I rode the 山手線 (yama no te sen) just a month ago! Nevertheless, it makes for an interesting historical anecdote : )

That's what I get for trying to post on the forums without drinking any coffee in the morning!

By the way, as we seem to share a common interest in old Japanese writings, might I ask what your background with the langauge is? It's always fun to hear about how other people end up getting interested in this unusual field

I started studying Japanese in 1999 and read Tale of Genji (Seidenstecker translation) around that time, and it quickly became my favorite book. In 2003 I went to Japan on the JET program, came back in 2005 to start a graduate program, and 7 (ugh) years later I'm working on my dissertation....I hope I can finish it within 2 more years, but we'll see.

yudantaiteki Wrote:I started studying Japanese in 1999 and read Tale of Genji (Seidenstecker translation) around that time, and it quickly became my favorite book. In 2003 I went to Japan on the JET program, came back in 2005 to start a graduate program, and 7 (ugh) years later I'm working on my dissertation....I hope I can finish it within 2 more years, but we'll see.

It would be interesting to hear more about your dissertation when it is completed (I myself am merely working on my bachelors thesis at the moment but I find it pretty stressful to talk about a work in progress and I would imagine other people too prefer to not think too much about papers or theses until they are finally completed ^^).

Would you recommend Tale of Genji to someone interested in Japanese history and literature? I wonder what version I should pick up if I give it a try.

I think I'm getting better at 女, but the road radical is still hard for me to write... both getting the curves right, and actually enclosing the rest of the kanji with it

I really really hate writing the road primitive or stretching primitive when they are located in the middle of a character like in 鍵 or 髄. Another one I never seem to be able to get just right is the taskmaster primitive... I don't know why it troubles me so much. xP

ditto on the road primitive. I also hate the one Heisig calls "claw." 猫.

I hate cats with a passion.　犬 are much better.

"dissolve" (融) and "tiger" (虎)

For everday kanji, 　通 is obviously the worst kanji to write. Always looks ugly. Can't be helped.

水, incidentally, is my favorite. Simple and beautiful.

Yes! You can learn a lot from 水, especially the last stroke. It's also almost the same stroke type used in the last stroke of "road". You'll get the hang of it much quicker if you write with a brush pen. Quite satisfying, also.

Also, @yudantaiteki - sorry about that (since I was the one who 'bumped' this post). I really know nothing about general forum etiquette. I was just searching around via Google and did not at all look at the date... at least now I know it's something to better not do^^

系
It never looks right. ><

@Tzadeck: LOLZ Exactly the other way 'round here! My 水 looks always crappy, however, in kanjis like 線・泉 it looks good...

Favourite kanji: 藤

Ah yes, I hate writing 水 and 氷

To be honest, I don't even try... I just do this for both



Yep, I suck.