Aside from you know, using sources from someone not very well educated and therefore who makes lots of incorrect grammar errors?

I've been watching lots of anime and tokusatsu, which probably aren't the "best" materials as they're aimed at children and are probably filled with more slang language, but still basic grammar rules have to apply right? As well as some actual vocabulary?

[Zgarbas]

Anime speech is unnatural but not incorrect. It's true that if you emulate anime speech it will stick out in real life, but for listening purposes anything you enjoy works =)

Do you want to be able to understand anime? Then anime is a good listening resource.

(It's more efficient to listen to things with higher word densities though, since shows and movies have much less words than nearly the constant speech of an audiobook or podcast for example)

Anime is great when starting out because they often speak more clearly in anime, although some of the voices are kind of unnatural, but it's easier to pick up words in anime usually. I don't know about tokusatsu, but if you're enjoying them then why not? Once you can understand most things in the anime & tokusatsu you watch then it might be time to add in harder study materials, but I wouldn't worry about that now.

I would say if it is by Japanese people for Japanese people then you are learning Japanese. If you only ever listened to one kind of thing you might get a rather lopsided take on Japanese, but since you will probably end up hearing various kinds of material, you will get to know what is slangy, what is very formal, what is normal friend-to-friend talk etc.

I don't think it matters a great deal where you begin. You are picking up Japanese all the time and will gradually be picking up the idea of what kinds of speech fit where. I know a six-year-old boy who frequently refers to himself as ore-sama. He'll grow out of it. So will people who listen to Japanese media grow out of any early odd language they pick up.

I am not sure where this idea that "listening to anime will ruin your Japanese" comes from, but it seems to be founded on the notion that one will only ever listen to anime, probably only to the same kind of anime, and never develop a sense of where different speech patterns fit into the overall scheme of things.

In practice that isn't likely to happen. Even in anime you will start to become aware of the ways in which speech is stylized to display different kinds of character. At first you won't see that and it won't matter because at that stage you are just picking up enough Japanese to work with. It doesn't matter if you go through an "ore-sama phase" (I am sure no one is literally going to call himself ore-sama. I mean a phase where you don't know what "register" people are talking in). It is part of the process of growing in Japanese.

And everything you hear in Japanese contributes to that process.

Are there some anime series that are more naturalistic than others? What about films with a more serious subject matter like The Wind Rises or Sarusuberi?

(2016-03-12, 7:14 am)debrucey Wrote: Are there some anime series that are more naturalistic than others? What about films with a more serious subject matter like The Wind Rises or Sarusuberi?

Even if they have a serious subject those are historicals, you might not want to reuse everything you hear in those.

Uchuu Kyoudai & Aku no Hana are the most realistic, non-anime-sounding anime I've seen. The former was too laidback for me though, and the latter too...experimental for me I guess. You might like them though. Ghibli movies tend to use regular actors (not voice actors) to voice characters, so they sound less anime-like, although still clearer than non-anime Japanese.

(2016-03-12, 7:14 am)debrucey Wrote: Are there some anime series that are more naturalistic than others? What about films with a more serious subject matter like The Wind Rises or Sarusuberi?

Wind rises has natural voices. I think most ghibli stuff does. A lot of the time they don't even use pro voice actors (anno hideki in wind rises, 糸井重里 for the dad in totoro, etc.) to make it more natural. (← edit: didn't notice bokusenou said same thing above xD)

Also, I guess you could say The Wind Rises is a historical setting, but I don't recall any 'old' Japanese in there like you get in Mononoke.

ANYTHING and EVERYTHING made by natives for natives is good! (except if it has bad writing or grammar, but you get what I mean)

If you have the common sense not to use あたし and だわ in your speech, I would say that there is absolutely no need to worry that your speech will resemble an anime character's!  

As debrucey mentioned, Mononoke is an awesome anime filled with old Japanese.

I know this isn't what Risu-san is talking about, but a professional level I would argue that "bad writing" tends to be better than good writing for learning purposes.

I say at a professional level - ie published authors - because they won't be full of really bad grammar and such. But good writers often use a large vocabulary and use language in clever and innovative ways. "Bad" writers tend to use cliches, repeat similar phrases often and employ a more everyday vocabulary. All of this makes them better for learning everyday Japanese unless one is really quite advanced.

Just a thought. A little off-topic though. Sorry!

(2016-03-12, 3:55 pm)CureDolly Wrote: I know this isn't what Risu-san is talking about, but a professional level I would argue that "bad writing" tends to be better than good writing for learning purposes.

I say at a professional level - ie published authors - because they won't be full of really bad grammar and such. But good writers often use a large vocabulary and use language in clever and innovative ways. "Bad" writers tend to use cliches, repeat similar phrases often and employ a more everyday vocabulary. All of this makes them better for learning everyday Japanese unless one is really quite advanced.

Just a thought. A little off-topic though. Sorry!

I totally agree with this! When I first started out learning I started reading a couple Visual Novels which were super badly written. Even I as a beginner could tell how bad it was! The writing was so stale and boring that I lost motivation to read.

Later I made the jump to LNs which were much harder in terms of vocabulary, grammar and basically everything but the writing was so much smoother, so much more engaging and compelling and good that I found myself reading more and more despite having to look words up every other sentence!

Reading is like SRS. Reading something difficult is like doing a hard grammar deck, except that the intervals stay the same. When you read stuff that's well written, your brain familiarises itself with grammar structures that your brain might find hard, conquering frontier after frontier!

Reading under your level helps you refresh and review your understanding of the fundamental grammar too.

All in all -- reading does wonders for language learning