So...I decided to take a break from reading, and spend some time memorizing all the "signal primitives" from RTK2. I'm working now on the "pure groups."

But my first real use of RTK2 in the wild left something to be desired.

I came across this compound: 無表情. I thought, aha! I know all the signal primitives, so this compound must be pronounced "bu-hyoo-sei". I looked up buhyoosei in my phonetic dictionary but there appears to be no such word. Then I discovered that the compound is in fact "mu-hyoo-zyoo".

So...I guess the RTK2 signal primitives suggest the on-yomi, except when they don't .

EDIT*EDIT*EDIT....

I discovered that the RTK2 book actually does warn when "pure" signal primitives have an alternate on-yomi.

For example, RTK2 frame 78 ("青") "sei" has another number in italics (1524). When you go to frame 1524 you see that "青" has another onyomi, "zyoo".

All in all, I'm enjoying working through RTK2. Right now I'm memorizing the readings of all the "signal primitives." Then I'm going to review by studying all the RTK2 compounds.

well, it's not bad, 無 is often pronounced ブ (especially as a prefix), and 情 could be セイ but is usually じょう

I haven't used RTK2, but I suspect the problem is less with the method, and more a problem of Japanese going crazy with multiple on-yomi

I think 風情 is the only word that uses the セイ reading for 情.

Quote:So...I guess the RTK2 signal primitives suggest the on-yomi, except when they don't .

Right, Heisig doesn't distinguish perfect groups (all kanji with the primitive only have the single on'yomi) from pure ones (all kanji share the signaled reading, but it may not be the only on'yomi they have). See this thread.

Vempele Wrote:See this thread.

I'm glad I did. Outstanding work Vempele!

Another point about Japanese in general, is that the m and b sounds are often interchangeable. A common example would be "sabishii/samishii" but one from the dialect of the area I lived in is "samui/sabui".

john555 Wrote:So...I decided to take a break from reading, and spend some time memorizing all the "signal primitives" from RTK2

Memorize the compounds, not the primitives. That way you won't be confused by the impurity of the pure groups.

Quote:So...I guess the RTK2 signal primitives suggest the on-yomi, except when they don't .

Every time an irregularity occurs, it is pointed out in the book and if there is any regularity in that other reading, it is categorized in some later group as well.

Of the 2200 characters, less than 2100 have a Chinese reading. There's ~2400 frames in RTK2. This means about 90% of the characters have only one Chinese reading, right? It isn't so bad.

Even if all the signals were pure, you'd still have to memorize words one-by-one because rendaku makes it impossible to guess the reading of a compound with 100% accuracy. This is also a good reason to use the signal primitives only to aid memorizing the compounds, instead of SRSing the primitives and/or kanji out of context.

john555 Wrote:I came across this compound: 無表情.

Whenever I come across 無, I'm really happy. For me almost every kanji has a face. I learned 無 in 音無 美紀子 おとなし みきこ http://noiri1986.com/profile/mikiko_otonashi.htm , one of my favourite actresses.
Then it was 無名 むめい in a 座頭市 ざとう いち movie. Then 無い ない in a story by 芥川 龍之介 あくたがわ りゅうのすけ. And then 無人機 むじんき - I'm particularly in love with it, because I simply cannot stand terrorists.

EDIT.
Just listen to it:
http://users.bestweb.net/%7Esiom/martian...a%20yo.mp3

BUMP. See my edit to my original post.