CreepyAF Wrote:

ryuudou Wrote:

CreepyAF Wrote:Especially the QRG video. People paid over $40 for that? I watched the first 20 mins of it and it's just Khatz meandering through AJATT concepts in a minimally prepared way. Worst of all, the background music is slightly too loud, so when he mumbles (which is often) I can't make out what he's saying.
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The mumbling and all of that was mentioned on the post for it. He emphasized that he mumbled for half of it and wasn't prepared. It's not like he said it was professionally done and then delivered something else.

You're right, in his "Fo' Shizzle" way, he mentions that he mumbles in a list of reasons why people shouldn't buy the product. However, when it comes to my comment on his meandering through AJATT concepts in a minimally prepared way, he doesn't actually mention that he was unprepared, rather he says, "All the points in the QRG are covered with sparkling wit and verve."

It's true that all of the points were covered well. He just mumbled a lot and was in sweat pants. Which is what exactly what he said.

qwertyytrewq Wrote:Fairly amusing to see applemilk there too

Wow. Haven't seen her Japanese youtube videos in ages.
Read her info to catch up.

She did a Japanese gravure idol video doing suggestive poses in a bikini.
She must be really messed up these days.

Seems like she hasn't posted any Japanese learning Youtube videos in a long time.
Maybe she gave up.

As far as Khatzumoto, i wonder if he is ok.
It's just like he ghosted all his AJATT followers.
Or maybe, he decided to walk away from everything.

chamcham Wrote:As far as Khatzumoto, i wonder if he is ok.
It's just like he ghosted all his AJATT followers.
Or maybe, he decided to walk away from everything.

I think he just walked away. My conclusion to all of this is the failure of Silverspoon, personal issues, and simply being out of fresh ideas has made Khatz throw his hands up in defeat.

It wouldn't surprise me if his daily visitor count had been dropping, too. A lot of us seem to hold the opinion that he buried the golden AJATT posts under a mountain of garbage. Maybe he realized this and decided it was time to pack it in.

So do you guys think he will ever come back?

kameden Wrote:So do you guys think he will ever come back?

Maybe Khatzumoto and/or Momoko are watching or participating in this discussion thread.
Khatzumoto has hinted at reading this website before.

kameden Wrote:So do you guys think he will ever come back?

I think he's done. He said what he has to say and that's that. One of his old posts was called "Don't be a Hero" and it was about not needing to spend all your time trying to fix what you see as problems in other people's methods- he probably started taking his own advice. I think he rightfully moved on.

I for one salute him, he's the reason I got into the game in the first place. In my mind he'll go down as the most interesting personality to ever grace the do-it-yourself language acquisition scene.

here here

mattimus Wrote:

kameden Wrote:So do you guys think he will ever come back?

I think he's done. He said what he has to say and that's that.

I for one salute him, he's the reason I got into the game in the first place. In my mind he'll go down as the most interesting personality to ever grace the do-it-yourself language acquisition scene.

I agree on both counts. He isn't leaving in defeat at all. Whatever his eccentricities (who am I to talk?) he left a splendid legacy to which many of us owe a great debt. Sometimes at second or third hand since he influenced so many of the people working and writing today.

Of course he might have wrapped things up more cleanly and explicitly, but he always did things his own way!

However, the idea that a project like his has to go on forever seems a little strange in itself. One has certain things to say. One learns more and talks about that. But in the end how much one usefully has to say on one subject, even a big one like learning Japanese, is finite.

I don't see myself doing KawaJapa forever either. Even though I do see myself using Japanese forever. But I'll be using it for further adventures, not for replaying the same one.

I am guessing this is what Khatzumoto is doing in one form or another.

Good old Khatz. I will always be grateful for his advice. It has served me very well.

The site had run its course. He had written all there was to write on the whole AJATT philosophy, and now it's up there for anyone to download and keep, and learn from. I think he did a great job.

Whatever he's up to now (mind-fudding, pimping etc.) I hope he's doing fine and living happily. Probably just doing more freelance translation work.

While Khatz was certainly an interesting personality... I don't think objection to his sudden abandonment of the site is the same as any demand that he continue to provide content that 'goes on forever'.

The issue is really more that when you take money (especially money in the hundreds or thousands of dollars!) in exchange for a promise to teach to a certain level or your money back... well... you should certainly keep teaching, and give money back to those that don't learn.

I think that's pretty basic. If you make promises, especially promises that are in exchange for compensation... you should keep those promises. It really seems like he -didn't- keep those promises.

On a personal level I've always been ambivalent about Khatz... he's certainly an -interesting- personality, but I've never really been too sure that anything he says is actually useful for anyone to learn Japanese. OTOH, a lot of what he says is certainly -motivating- for people trying to learn Japanese, and that in itself is a good thing (that is, from the point of view that more people learning Japanese is a good thing... which is my point of view ) I've never bought any of his products or subscribed to any service of his, but I've certainly followed his posts with interest.

Straddling the fence is never comfortable between the Khatz worship on one side and the Khatz rage on the other side, but whatever with that, the point now is that it's simply not acceptable to make product guarantees and then abandon them, taking thousands of dollars with you while failing to honor your guarantee. He'll probably get away with it because international lawsuits are a pain in the ass, but there's nothing -at all- admirable about running from your financial obligations when your business plan doesn't work out as you imagined.

I can't really understand how people can say he's just run his course with the site and moved on when, y'know, moving on means leaving people with thousands of dollars invested in the lurch without their paid-for product or any means of compensation. If he had limited himself to selling premium memberships and various sentence decks i'd be totally on board with that point of view, but that's not the case since he decided to introduce Silverspoon... and abandon it.

Nobody said he didn't/isn't honoring guarantees. If he was "running from paying people back" he still wouldn't still be paying for his website.

He renewed the domain recently. That's not how you hide.

Maybe... hrmm...

http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Katyana-Ro...nt-1116749

The first time I read this I thought he was saying the $100 payments had stopped two weeks ago, but re-reading it I think he's just saying that they aren't answering his e-mails for two weeks since the first payment came (the day he expected a full refund.)
Depends on how you take the meaning of 'since my refund was due', but I think the latter is correct because otherwise he would've been clearer that he was -not- getting a refund, not that he didn't like the refund process.

^I always thought he had talent as a con man, but that I never would have dreamt.

Why are Japanese students such suckers?

He's giving him the refund, what's the problem exactly?

kameden Wrote:He's giving him the refund, what's the problem exactly?

I think refunding a one time payment, after making some one wait two years to claim it, by paying $100 a month is pretty shitty, but then again, I never signed up for it.

RandomQuotes Wrote:

kameden Wrote:He's giving him the refund, what's the problem exactly?

I think refunding a one time payment, after making some one wait two years to claim it, by paying $100 a month is pretty shitty, but then again, I never signed up for it.

Also, money in the future is worth less than money now. Not only because of inflation, but also because you could invest or get value out of that money if you had it now.

That link is from the beginning of January 2014, and again nobody said he didn't/isn't honoring guarantees. If he was "running from paying people back" he still wouldn't still be paying for his website which was recently renewed in contract well into 2016.

On the contrary most likely he'd let the website expire (or simply take it offline/and or replace it with an error), and then pretend he died. Khatz also continued to update AJATT+ almost until the middle of 2015 despite stopping updates to main site updates near the end of 2014. Not the behavior of someone running.

As SomeCallMeChris points out, this line is really the main point of confusion in the Ripoff report:

Quote:It's been more than two weeks since my refund was due and they're no longing responding to me [...]

Due to its wording, it seems to imply that the person is no longer receiving their refund. But I think they are just referring to responses to questions about the refund system, not the refund itself.

And as I mentioned earlier in this thread...

That Amazing Person Known As CreepyAF Wrote:I think the perspective of the whistleblower is hard for me to relate to. Only once have I shelled out that much money on the internet, and it was for a product I'm deeply satisfied with (computer).

The person appears to be complaining about Silver Spoon's customer service, and that their refund is coming in instalments. This is where I feel it's hard for me to relate. If I were in that person's shoes, I would feel annoyed and tricked, but not ripped off. The refund was/is being fulfilled, just not all at once.

I've got a feeling most people don't share my sentiments, and likely for good reason- my inexperience with money in internet limbo makes me feel naive on this subject.

I've never asked for someone to honor a $2700 refund only to see it come back in $100 increments, so I don't know how it would feel being in limbo like the person in the ripoff report. But considering the refund started January 2014 and at this very moment it still isn't paid off, I think I'm starting to understand where the outrage is coming from.

[ファブリス]

ryuudou Wrote:If he was "running from paying people back" he still wouldn't still be paying for his website which was recently renewed in contract well into 2016.

That's not really an argument, since domain name renewal is like 10$ a year. A dedicated server, which usually costs 100$ upwards a month, now that would be more significant.

I'd hope (and would like to think) that Khatz is still out there behind the scenes keeping the programs that he sold running for the people who purchased them, through the remaining term of the purchase. I recall that within the past year he sold a JLPT prep sort of Silverspoon program which was staggeringly expensive IMHO. I recall it was in the area of $5000! I don't recall if it had the same sort of money-back guarantee as Silverspoon however.

That being said, I don't imagine that people who were seeking refunds from Khatz for Silverspoon or the JPLT prep course would have much recourse for pursuing refunds if he didn't give them out willingly. I purchased a number of his sentence packs over time, and I think I always paid for them thru PayPal, which has a limited amount of time for disputing a purchase.

rochel Wrote:That being said, I don't imagine that people who were seeking refunds from Khatz for Silverspoon or the JPLT prep course would have much recourse for pursuing refunds if he didn't give them out willingly. I purchased a number of his sentence packs over time, and I think I always paid for them thru PayPal, which has a limited amount of time for disputing a purchase.

I remember hearing that the UK recently passed a law regarding refunds for online purchases, but I haven't read it to see if it would apply to any UK citizens that purchased one of Khatz's products.

ファブリス Wrote:

ryuudou Wrote:If he was "running from paying people back" he still wouldn't still be paying for his website which was recently renewed in contract well into 2016.

That's not really an argument, since domain name renewal is like 10$ a year. A dedicated server, which usually costs 100$ upwards a month, now that would be more significant.

It is an argument, not because the price, but because if you're trying to hide it makes a lot more sense to take the site offline and pretend something happened to you.

And if he's renewing his domain then he's also renewing his server as well.

dtcamero Wrote:

JapaneseRuleOf7 Wrote:And Khatz is far from bankrupt. He has plenty of money to pay people back immediately. Why he would choose not to might have more to do with his style of doing business.

well if this is his main income source and conservatively he's spending about 20-30万/month living in tokyo, then i could see him burning through all of those subscriptions in a few years time, easy... I imagine that like a ponzi scheme, after a while all the new money was either being spent immediately, or used to pay down the $100/month refunds.
Well it would only take a few years for that to snowball, and like Sholum mentioned, people are less likely to forget about a $2,500 lifetime silverspoon payment than $50 for a sentence pack. So you have more and more refunds requests coming in, and after a while all the new revenue is only paying down the interest, so to speak. This probably explains the ad that Rochel saw for $5,000... Khatz sees this going down the tubes and tries to squeeze out a few more checks from some of his most die-hard, buy-anything people before 夜逃げing.

then his wife leaves him for not being able to support her, he starts getting a little desperate for cash and looks online for someone, anyone that might need his services in web-design and translation, and here we are.

pakapa.com dates from 2009. SilverSpoon was started in 2011.

https://who.godaddy.com/whoisstd.aspx?do...id=GoDaddy

blaah Wrote:

dtcamero Wrote:

JapaneseRuleOf7 Wrote:And Khatz is far from bankrupt. He has plenty of money to pay people back immediately. Why he would choose not to might have more to do with his style of doing business.

well if this is his main income source and conservatively he's spending about 20-30万/month living in tokyo, then i could see him burning through all of those subscriptions in a few years time, easy... I imagine that like a ponzi scheme, after a while all the new money was either being spent immediately, or used to pay down the $100/month refunds.
Well it would only take a few years for that to snowball, and like Sholum mentioned, people are less likely to forget about a $2,500 lifetime silverspoon payment than $50 for a sentence pack. So you have more and more refunds requests coming in, and after a while all the new revenue is only paying down the interest, so to speak. This probably explains the ad that Rochel saw for $5,000... Khatz sees this going down the tubes and tries to squeeze out a few more checks from some of his most die-hard, buy-anything people before 夜逃げing.

then his wife leaves him for not being able to support her, he starts getting a little desperate for cash and looks online for someone, anyone that might need his services in web-design and translation, and here we are.

pakapa.com dates from 2009. SilverSpoon was started in 2011.

https://who.godaddy.com/whoisstd.aspx?do...id=GoDaddy

Doesn't mean anything. Most domain names have existed for quite a while, and people buy and sell them to others. Apparently it's pretty good money if you can get some good names.

JapaneseRuleOf7 Wrote:It pays to be honest with people.

Whether it's okay to charge customers as much as $5,000 for your learning methods, well, people can decide for themselves. But not honoring your stated guarantee isn't right. Now, I've got nothing against Mr. Rogo-Manduli, and I've no interest in "doxxing" him, but I know he's got plenty of cash to pay back his customers, and it has nothing to do with his job or website. Don't ask how I know. Sometimes Tokyo's a small place for foreigners, especially high-profile ones.

Anyone who really wanted to know more could find it on the net. Even I'm getting a bit creeped by this whole business, so for now I'm out.

So you've seen him in Tokyo. He went back to Japan after his divorce? Is he still there.