tameshi Wrote:How difficult is it to go the other way, as in prep for general understanding and then take the test if needed?

If you reach N3 level in a year, and then spend another year or two doing stuff in Japanese, then it's going to be fairly easy to prepare for the actual test.

tameshi Wrote:Nope, as of now I don't have access to native speakers or listening material. But I plan to start with JapanesePod101 and Lang8 as soon as I have the basic grammar and some beginner vocab down. I guess it'll be a few more weeks before I can start the JapanesePod101 and about a couple of months before Lang8. I've made progress, but I doubt it is sufficient to start out with these things right now...

Any reason why you can't start Jpod now? They have lessons for people who know literally zero Japanese. I started less than a month ago as a near-absolute beginner (~10 Pimsleuer lessons, 12 RtK chapters) and I couldn't be happier with the progress I've made.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a beginner. But after doing three to five lessons a day, plus Core 10K (300 words in), and a little bit of casual Tae Kim study, I can make sentences that a month ago would have given me a headache to look at/listen to.

I guess the format isn't for everyone, there is a lot of English involved, but I like it. And as someone who has been trying to learn Japanese forever but couldn't find the right solution, I'm sticking with it.

I made a new account and bought their "one time only" $1 offer which gives you a month of premium and lets you download all the lessons, all the dialogue, all the PDFs, to iTunes in one click. Now I have Japanese lessons covering levels that I probably won't reach for years.

Advice:
-Get everything. The PDFs contain example sentences of varying quality, but some are really good for solidifying what you've learned.
-But a cheap MP3 player off Amazon or something. My iPod used to be for music, now it's for comprehensible input thanks to the Jpod dialogue tracks.
-Set up a new email address just for your account. Peter really likes sending you emails. Like, every day.

Stansfield123 Wrote:

tameshi Wrote:How difficult is it to go the other way, as in prep for general understanding and then take the test if needed?

If you reach N3 level in a year, and then spend another year or two doing stuff in Japanese, then it's going to be fairly easy to prepare for the actual test.

Thanks, helps to know that. How difficult would it be to "convert" what has been learnt for the test? Is it like the usual look at the pattern, do a few mocks to get a feel of the test itself?

JKS87 Wrote:Any reason why you can't start Jpod now? They have lessons for people who know literally zero Japanese. I started less than a month ago as a near-absolute beginner (~10 Pimsleuer lessons, 12 RtK chapters) and I couldn't be happier with the progress I've made.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a beginner. But after doing three to five lessons a day, plus Core 10K (300 words in), and a little bit of casual Tae Kim study, I can make sentences that a month ago would have given me a headache to look at/listen to.

Thanks for the heads up, the reason I don't want to start right now is that I'm not confident enough that I can make sense out of even the beginner material. I tried listening to a few random "beginner" and "absolute beginner" videos on YouTube and DailyMotion and couldn't follow along. At this point both my vocab (~50 words?) and grammar (just got to the verbs part of Tae Kim) are weak. So, I want to stick to the read thru of Tae Kim and re-evaluate myself again after I've finished the "Basic Grammar" section. Hopefully, I'll have a better grasp on things then...

I the following part of the post about JPod101 or Pimsleuer or both? Sorry if its a noob question, I haven't tried either.

JKS87 Wrote:I guess the format isn't for everyone... (truncated)

I don't think you need to convert what you've learnt for JLPT. Like - there's nothing to convert - it's all just Japanese the same as you've been learning. By all means take a practice test or something to understand the format, but if you know it you know it and if you don't you don't.
Or better yet - stop worrying about stuff that's completely irrelevant when you only know 50 words. Your priorities might completely change by then.

(personally I think you're absolutely right to not be worrying about Jpod etc. now. Drilling words into your skull is going to give much faster and more immediate benefit and will make those kinds of resources vastly more useful when you do decide to use them. Disregard everything acquire words!)

tameshi Wrote:I the following part of the post about JPod101 or Pimsleuer or both? Sorry if its a noob question, I haven't tried either.

It was about JPod but it definitely applies to Pimsleur too. If anything I'd say that Pimsleur is even more of an acquired taste. But I like it a lot.

My review of Pimsleur after nearly 40 lessons (there are 90 in total):

The method itself is a little dated. Of course it is, I think Pimsleur probably died before Krashen came up with his i+1 business, so there's about 40 years of educational theory missing from the method. But for me, it still shows signs of brilliance (I'm a little bit biased, we'll get to that in a moment). I feel like pretty much anyone should have good retention of the material if the follow the course correctly, I've only had to repeat a few lessons (the pass threshold is 80%, according to Pimsleur).

Now, my favourite thing about Pimsleur is that it actually gets you speaking Japanese, and it does a really good job of it. I suffer from pretty extreme anxiety issues, I also have low self-esteem and on occasion I have had speech problems. The three don't exactly work well together and I'm not exactly in a prime position to be learning a language. Pimsleur gives small, but instant results that can be a huge confidence booster. What little Japanese I know I can speak clearly, and I dare say at a decent speed too.

The other thing I like is that it doesn't interfere with whatever else you're doing. Do it alongside RtK, Core, Tae Kim, whatever. Heisig told you not to learn any Japanese until frame 2,200? Doesn't matter, it's a pure audio course, do it anyway.

So yeah, I do rate it highly. And taking into consideration my own individual situation, I would genuinely pay the $700 for the CDs if I had that kind of money floating around. Most will disagree with me but I think that for the people who are going to get the most out of the course, and who can afford it, it's worth the money.

However, I'm not sure how many people would find it to be an economical use of their time, for a course that markets itself the way it does, you don't actually learn much Japanese. After the first 30 lessons you're way beyond tourist with a phrasebook level, but nowhere near where you should be one third of the way into a course that claims to be the last word on language learning.

Aikynaro Wrote:(personally I think you're absolutely right to not be worrying about Jpod etc. now. Drilling words into your skull is going to give much faster and more immediate benefit and will make those kinds of resources vastly more useful when you do decide to use them. Disregard everything acquire words!)

Thanks, when would you say is the right time to start with JPod101? I'm kinda lost with that... as of now I plan to start after I'm done with Tae Kim's basic grammar (before moving onto essential grammar).

JKS87 Wrote:It was about JPod but it definitely applies to Pimsleur too. If anything I'd say that Pimsleur is even more of an acquired taste. But I like it a lot.

Thanks for the details, as you say at the end it might not be the best use of one's time. Also, the investment in the course (cash) is something I cannot spare right now. Thanks once again for taking the time to make things clear, much appreciated.