.

To become a Samurai.

sethg Wrote:So, here's my question: why do you want to move to Japan?

Actually, I don't. The grass is not greener on the other side. It's also not less green.

sethg Wrote:What hole do you think it will fill in your life?

Actually, I'm not spiritually lacking, if that's what you're asking. I'm content staying where I am and content learning the language.

sethg Wrote:How do you think it's better than where you are now?

I'm in the US but here's a quick list:

1. Americans are unhealthy and fat. Japan has a lot more healthier diet and a chubby Japanese is considered normal in America, when normal should be slim.
2. American CEO salaries are like 300 or 1000x the average worker salary in that same company. Japanese CEO salaries are a lot more reasonable.
3. Americans and their obsession with guns and gun culture. None of that in Japan.
4. In America, the worst thing a racist will do to you is beat the shit out of you and leave you in a coma. The worst thing a Japanese racist will do is stare at you, complement your shitty Japanese language skills or refuse to allow you to enter their establishment (because of your shitty Japanese language skills).
5. In general, the divide between the poor and rich in the US is worse than Japan. It is better to be a poor homeless man in Japan than one in US.
6. US shares a border with Mexico and all the problems that come with it (drugs, under paid illegal immigrants, etc). Japan is an island nation and a linguistically isolated one at that (good luck trying to do anything without knowledge of the language). Having said that, South Korea and China hates their guts so trouble might brew there. And also in close proximity to North (best) Korea.
7. Relatively speaking, Japan is a quiet and polite society. They're everyone's favorite tourists for a reason. Being quiet and polite, going to a music concert in Japan is optimal: you can actually hear and enjoy the music instead of being drowned out by useless crowd cheers, screams, and hollers.
8. Coming from a puritanical American society, Japan's attitude to sex and nudity is refreshing.
9. Similarly, due to them getting their butts seriously kicked in WW2 (atomic bombs, firebombings etc), their pacifist ideals are also refreshing and inspiring. Coming from a violence, war, and military-idolizing/worshipping American society.
10. Last but not least, in terms of variety and themes, Japanese comic books (and cartoons) are heads and shoulders above American comic books, which still can't get over its infantile underpants on the outside wearing super-hero trope (in the case of comic books) or cookie-cutter run-out-of-the-mill family-friendly comedy fun 3d cartoons (in the case of cartoons). Enough talking animals or talking what should be inanimate objects already.

sethg Wrote:酔っ払いのバカ

Have you considered that maybe the problem lies within yourself and that getting drunk won't help solve this problem?

I don't

Alternately:

Roketzu Wrote:To become a Samurai.

I've spent a total of 3 years in Japan, although I'm not currently there, I'm planning to go back.

That said, my reason for wanting to go back is a lot different from my first reasons of wanting to go there. I'd say my biggest reason for liking Japan is that I just prefer the way people in Japan handle interactions with each other. Be this on the street, on the train, or in someone's shop. Even in crowded city like Tokyo, the greatest amount of rudeness you might get from someone still doesn't match some of the stuff you might get in other cities in the US.

Among other reasons.
1) I have yellow fever. I could just as easily live in China or South Korea and be fine with this point, but living in East Asia just makes me feel normal when it comes to attraction to women. Put another way, I like the girls.
2) I like skirts. This was something I hadn't realized till I came to Japan.
3) Customer service. I'd rather have an always polite and fake-smiling shop attendant, than the possibility of a rude one that wants to chat you up about your shitty day. Plus, shop tenants actually try to help you out in Japan.
4) There is a lot better convenience in some things in Japan than in the US, but in other instances Japan just falls flat.
5) Safe, safe, safe. In most areas of Tokyo/Osaka, I can run at 1am in the morning and not worry about being shot or mugged.
6) Religion. Being an athiest, Japan is great. Religion holds a different place in society in Japan, so its great.
7) Everything I want to buy is there. All my hobbies originate from Japan and many things can't be easily be obtained outside Japan.

I also agree with many of qwertyytrewq's points although some aren't as big of an issue for me.

I don't really remember many of my reasons before I went to Japan some years ago. I do remember there was a point in time when I had tried to see if I couldn't go there and do my 4 year there but it wasn't really feasible and I'm glad I didn't as I hadn't quite realized many of the idiosyncrasies of Japan then. By time I finally studied abroad in my senior year in college, I had already read tons of 'horror' stories from other people living there and heard about a lot of the stuff that was annoying about Japan, so I had a good idea about what to expect before I went.

I don't want to; I've lived there several times but I never want to live there permanently. This is as much about me as it is about Japan.

That being said, don't feel like you have to give up all interest in Japanese and Japan just because you don't want to live there long-term. You don't have to live in Japan to keep your interest.

qwertyytrewq Wrote:Having said that, South Korea and China hates their guts so trouble might brew there. And also in close proximity to North (best) Korea.

I see the point about the governmental clashes with China and South Korea, but the "North (best) Korea" part confused me.

@TomTomHatesCats

"North Korea is best Korea" is a meme. I think he was just joking about that part.

In August it will have been 10 years since I immigrated to Japan. I'm still in love with the place, yes, even though there are some massive disadvantages to being here. The ridged rules drive me nuts from time to time, the rock star 'Ooh! Gaijin!' status has long since lost its luster, and of course the language barrier doesn't help.

But, that said... It's beautiful. My area (Nagano) is just down right gorgeous. The people are, by and large, if not overly friendly, are polite to a fault. There's a sense of actually caring what the other person thinks and thus trying to not get in their way that I miss when I return to the States for a visit and it seems that "Hey Buddy, ***** you" is the order of the day. Safety, politeness, cleanliness, common sense, all of these are reasons why I still like it.

I think the trick is though is to also acknowledge that Japan does have its faults as well, massive ones.

qwertyytrewq Wrote:2. American CEO salaries are like 300 or 1000x the average worker salary in that same company. Japanese CEO salaries are a lot more reasonable.

Your factoid is not true, the average CEO pay in the US is only about 19 times higher than the average wage ($780,000 to 42,000).

More importantly, the average worker in Japan makes less than in the US (and works a lot more). I shudder to think what kind of person considers that a positive as long as CEOs also make a little less. Please, don't move to Japan, you'll ruin it. Move to North Korea instead. No pesky high paid CEOs there.

I don't want to move to Japan, although I'd love to go there again to visit, especially to see more of Kyoto & other historical areas. I lived there for three months, and while I liked it, there are more opportunities for me in the US right now. That said, I can still import stuff from Japan here, and such, so it's not too inconvenient, and it doesn't mean I'm not a fan of Japanese stuff. I am, but I don't need to be there to enjoy it.

You aren't completely in touch with reality if you want to move to Japan permanently in this day and age. At the very least there's some heavy grass is greener stuff going on.

Granted, I wish that everyone could be able to experience what you've experienced in all of life. You're not the first person to put something on a pedestal that doesn't deserve to be there, but you've been fortunate enough to really experience what that 'something' amounts to in practice. You'll come out stronger (unless you can't deal with the truth and become a cynic instead). I hope you don't become a cynic.

As someone else already said: in order to become a samurai.

That's really the only reason anyone needs. To wear a kimono under a cherry blossom tree in spring and write haikus about how glorious battle and seppuku are.

qwertyytrewq Wrote:9. Similarly, due to them getting their butts seriously kicked in WW2 (atomic bombs, firebombings etc), their pacifist ideals are also refreshing and inspiring. Coming from a violence, war, and military-idolizing/worshipping American society.

Are you kidding me? What about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor? What about the way the Japanese tortured and brutalized American and Canadian POW (prisoners of war)?

I was flipping through a book written by a Canadian who was a former POW in Japan and the description of how the Japanese tortured their prisoners almost made me physically sick. I had to stop reading it.

john555 Wrote:

qwertyytrewq Wrote:9. Similarly, due to them getting their butts seriously kicked in WW2 (atomic bombs, firebombings etc), their pacifist ideals are also refreshing and inspiring. Coming from a violence, war, and military-idolizing/worshipping American society.

Are you kidding me? What about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor? What about the way the Japanese tortured and brutalized American and Canadian POW (prisoners of war)?

I was flipping through a book written by a Canadian who was a former POW in Japan and the description of how the Japanese tortured their prisoners almost made me physically sick. I had to stop reading it.

But there's a difference between what happened in the past versus a country's philosophy/outlook/reality on war today.

The events of WWII influenced Japan's more modern pacifistic views, while the US is basically going to war and sending drones to locations wherever there's someone who looks remotely middle eastern.

TsugiAshi Wrote:

john555 Wrote:

qwertyytrewq Wrote:9. Similarly, due to them getting their butts seriously kicked in WW2 (atomic bombs, firebombings etc), their pacifist ideals are also refreshing and inspiring. Coming from a violence, war, and military-idolizing/worshipping American society.

Are you kidding me? What about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor? What about the way the Japanese tortured and brutalized American and Canadian POW (prisoners of war)?

I was flipping through a book written by a Canadian who was a former POW in Japan and the description of how the Japanese tortured their prisoners almost made me physically sick. I had to stop reading it.

But there's a difference between what happened in the past versus a country's philosophy/outlook/reality on war today.

The events of WWII influenced Japan's more modern pacifistic views, while the US is basically going to war and sending drones to locations wherever there's someone who looks remotely middle eastern.

Sadly the same outlook consists of "we did nothing bad in the previous war"-type of attitudes. Japan never really managed to come into terms with their horrible acts in the WW2 like the Germany did. The denial is real.

Not that every country prefers to look at their wartime actions in a more positive light (here it is hardly mentioned that we were a part of the axis of evil too, and were the ones to start the hostilities towards the Soviet Union in '41). But even then what Japan is doing is on a completely different scale.

.

Arupan Wrote:I don't see how they haven't come into terms with it. They are paying reparations to South Korea to this very day (or at least they were until last year as far as I know), although most people who experienced the horrors from then should be already dead by now. The only key difference between Japan and Germany is that the Japanese didn't allow their emperor to be killed, which is why everyone still blames them in my opinion.

Japan is also paying China for being a, get this, "developing country." I don't think they should pay neither.

There have been countless cases of even high ranking Japanese publicly denying and/or being skeptical regarding the war crimes Japanese committed during WW2. Even the history books in school are being whitewashed to indicate that no such things ever occurred during the war, or that the consequences were much less severe.

"Throw more money at the problem and hope it goes away while denying all responsibility" is truly The way to deal with any issue.

[s0apgun]

It seems like you really dislike Japan from your two posts.

.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_Massacre_denial

Two of the most common ways of denial are showcased back-to-back: that to criticize something must mean one dislikes it, and that "everyone else does it too".

Every country is guilty of something; which is precisely why the Glorious Pacifist Nippon is not without it's own faults after all. Making the comparison between the US and Japan an excellent case of the "grass is greener" syndrome. The US has been very good at making their self-inflicted terrorism threats and wars (dat lust for oil) be caused by some external party.

I want to do either my Masters or PhD in engineering there but I must admit being a female, I am very vary about the divide in the workplace.

I'll just point out that this derail on the denial of past deeds has no affect on whether Japan is pacifist or not. 'Actions speak louder than words' -- Japan has had little to no presence in conflicts since WW2.

Betelgeuzah Wrote:You aren't completely in touch with reality if you want to move to <COUNTRY> permanently in this day and age. At the very least there's some heavy grass is greener stuff going on.

Ask the right people, and you can find people that can fill in every country on the planet.

Don't get me started on Luxembourg!!

as a very tall white male who goes to the gym regularly and can speak the local language, japan is an awesome place for dating.
better than nyc which isn't bad at all.
there's something to be said for being super different from everyone else here in a number of ways that are looked upon favorably by a society.

I've stayed here for 3-4 months over the summers for the last 3 years, living in kagawa and kyoto and tokyo. Its really great...bordering on paradise.

that being said I would never want to live here permanently.
Getting a full-time job in japan is about the most awful thing I could imagine if I were to dream up some kind of last-round of dante's inferno.
And both the police and government are corrupt and racist, generally treating you like a criminal who they just haven't managed to catch red-handed yet...

but the girls are super cute and friendly, once you figure out how to break the ice... that part is definitely trickier than in the west.

as for all this historical talk, I feel like a lot of americans really believe what is written in their history books. you know that you won the war right?
do you understand that winners write history books?

try reading about the colonization of asia. the west ruled every pacific nation other than japan and korea, and did truly awful things wherever they went. japan complained loudly about their asian brethren's treatment and was embargoed oil and steel. their only choice was to attack the western colonial armies that caused the embargo... europe and america. (yes hawaii was a colony... attacking pearl harbor was attacking a colonial army) they weren't attacking their friendly asian neighbors. they were attacking the white people enslaving their friendly asian neighbors.
you won't read about that in your history books tho. just how japan committed war crimes. but how about dropping nukes on civilian centers? shouldn't that be an equivalent war crime? everyone did awful things back then so to say that this now-pacifist country hasn't finished coming to terms with it is some real pot-kettle mess considering that americans won't even begin a discussion about their own war crimes.

but I get that it's a real feel-good story if you start paying attention at pearl harbor...