"Who's Online

4 members, 27 guests"

This is the case most of the time. Who are these guests? Sudden Japanese learners?

On another note, I want to invite members who have posted once or twice to contribute their experiences no matter how novice. Taking part in discussion about Japanese learning will hopefully be another motivator once people know you are there, learning Japanese somewhere. I see mostly the same lovely posters and once in a while on a 'what's your gender?' thread I'll see 'Long time lurker...'
tbh, I kinda forced myself to write more on this forum in the same way I force myself sometimes to speak in a language I'm still learning. どうぞよろしく。

edit: added the word 'lovely'.

Hmm, one of them could be me at times. I usually lurk around and only sign in if I think of something to say. A lot of the time I can't think of something to add, so I don't need to sign in. I'm not sure how many others do the same, but it could be one explanation.

One of those guests could be me, which is often a case of leaving the page open on the phone and forgetting to close the window. The same happens with being signed in, though. Sometimes the page is merely "closed" while being left signed in for long periods of time without being remotely near a computer/browsing via mobile device.

Wonder if the recent activity by Benny Lewis has increased people checking the site out?

As well as members who simply didn't bother to sign in, this site does get a -lot- of hits on google for a lot of obvious questions to ask about RTK, Kanji, Anki, and learning japanese, not to mention a bunch of specific learning resources that are primarily introduced here - rikaisama, kanjitomo, the novel formatter (jnovelformatter?), and surely others that I'm forgetting right now. (My own small contribution for subtitle viewing is likely not a significant factor. Most people just torrent the raws and use a normal player, I'm sure.)

Hi I'm TheVinster, long-time lurker first-time poster. I'm addicted to hating everything and I don't know how to stop. Going to apply for the JET but afraid I will chuck Japanese kids out of 3rd floor windows.

TheVinster Wrote:Hi I'm TheVinster, long-time lurker first-time poster. I'm addicted to hating everything and I don't know how to stop. Going to apply for the JET but afraid I will chuck Japanese kids out of 3rd floor windows.

This provoked a thought, do we have an introductions page on the forum? I did a quick search and didn't find anything. It could help some lurkers to get involved in the forum, as well as being a tool just to help people to get to know some of the members a little better (their background, future plans etc).

I'm basically a full time lurker and usually don't feel like I have anything to add, so one of those people could be me, especially if I'm on a school computer.

Lurking for one year and some* months. I check the site from work every night and don't bother to log in.

amaethon2000 Wrote:Lurking for one year and some* months. I check the site from work every night and don't bother to log in.

Congratulations on your first* post!

* +/- 2, 95% confidence interval

.

Yes, the forum gets a lot of hits on Google, then I guess the guests get sucked in some of the wild previous and current discussions =D

Arupan Wrote:I did create such a thread where everyone could introduce themselves in Japanese. [url](BROKEN LINK) http://forum.koohii.com/viewtopic.php?id=11483[/url]
So far only 476 people have seen it (sarcasm) but noone has really posted anything.

Ah I see, I could post there but it probably would only be about 3 sentences in length and probably pretty incoherent. I will post there soon though

I only sign in when posting a reply. I assume others do the same.

For some reason the site won't let me stay signed in... so I'm often a guest too.

[ファブリス]

SomeCallMeChris Wrote:As well as members who simply didn't bother to sign in, this site does get a -lot- of hits on google for a lot of obvious questions to ask about RTK, Kanji, Anki, and learning japanese, not to mention a bunch of specific learning resources that are primarily introduced here - rikaisama, kanjitomo, the novel formatter (jnovelformatter?), and surely others that I'm forgetting right now. (My own small contribution for subtitle viewing is likely not a significant factor. Most people just torrent the raws and use a normal player, I'm sure.)

Correct.

The forum sees nearly 50% new visitor traffic (as per Google Analytics). Lots of Google searches, and some incoming links from blogs and other social sites. To be exhaustive at any one time there's probably a few spam bots as well.

Shout out to one of the top incoming links (all things being relative, search engines represent ~38% incoming traffic in Awstats, while blog posts and other sites account for less than 3%).

How to Read Visual Novels in Japanese in 2 years time (or 1 year if you are fast) ― learn to read through VN or anime

There is indeed a surprising amount of specific searches coming from search engines, anywhere from "rikaichan android" to "my neighbor totoro japanese script" to "epwing xdxf convert". There's also people who google "koohii forum" instead of using a bookmark

I've been around, and posted a little here and there, but usually on side topics. I usually have no issues with stayed logged in on either of the computers I use.

I'm really wondering about the tortoises vs. the hares for learning Japanese. I'm at over 2.5 years now on learning (finished RTK1 a bit past the one-year mark), and I'm just starting to get to the point - thanks to a focus on grammar for the past 5 months - where I feel that I can say and read more than 私は sentences. NHK News Easy is still really hard due to the grammar, though I'm still slogging through it daily, and working my way through Genki II.

My question is, are there a lot of people like me, who study for maybe 1-2 hours a day, and make steady but slow progress, or are there more people who study much more intensely, but burn out after a few months or a year, and end up yo-yo'ing? I'm sure there are some who manage to study intensely for long periods of time, but it seems like there are a lot more (anecdotal, from reading these forums) who end up on the yo-yo plan, alternating intense study with fallow periods.

It seems like my path is the least trodden. I took 7 months to finish RTK1, and have been similarly slow with Core 6k (80% done, started May 2012, on hold for now while I work on Genki and prepare for an upcoming trip). I've never actually stopped entirely on making progress, though. There don't seem to be many of the slow-but-steady types, at least on these forums, but maybe it's just because they're quiet like I am.

Quufer, I doubt that you are alone. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if you're not closer to the majority. Silent majority, perhaps.

I am about at the same level as you with similar amounts of studying. Although I don't think it's intended, these forums can be rather off-putting to tortoises. There are some posts from people who claim to finish RTK in nearly one month and most seem to think that 3 months is the outside. So, when 4 months in I am only halfway through and drowning in failed reviews... well, I feel like there's something I'm doing wrong, or maybe I'm just an idiot when it comes to language. I'm not, but sometimes I feel that way.

It doesn't help when you run across posts from people who say that if you don't have the time to study, then you might as well give up because you aren't dedicated enough, or some such.

I don't think there's anything wrong with going slowly. I don't have 3 hours a day to commit to learning a language, I doubt that I'll ever move to Japan (although I do want to visit again), and I certainly don't feel like throwing away all my English books, videos and music. But I make sure that every day I do something Japanese language related. It's a crawl, but when something clicks.. when I'm watching Anime and realize that I just understood the difference between what the character said and what the subtitle said, then it feels like time well spent.

Thanks for the Stats, ファブリス.
Quufer, Sounds like you have the most important practice down: consistency.
Is your upcoming trip going to be in Japan? Feel free to let us know how it goes and how you feel your comprehension (and output) is after studying outside of the country.
Kallistix, I think the silent tortoises and the talkative hares are not the majority. As Fabrice pointed out, 50% is new visitor traffic. I think that reflects the reality that lots of people want to study a language but most don't stick with it (albeit many are consistent learners who don't use these forums and are looking for epwing xdxf convert) and end up browsing the site trying to make a plan. Maybe that's where a 自己紹介 thread might be useful.
Seeing as silent tortoises are prevalent here and represent a certain learning approach/tendecy, I was hoping to encourage more input (no pressure!). Motivation is important in this game; keeping notes on your progress can be a helpful thing, especially if you can get feedback on those ideas and progress reports. It also makes you sort of indebted to the forum community to keep up your studies and report on it. New perspectives are always welcome.

Tashippy, the upcoming trip is to Japan. My wife (native speaker) is unlikely to be able to make it, so it'll probably be 3 weeks by myself in 中国地方 and 九州. I'm rather nervous about it; I can probably make do on reading things, but my listening is atrocious.

Get drunk with strangers! That is a good plan. I reckon Japaneseruleof7 and DrDunlap will concur.

Quufer Wrote:I'm really wondering about the tortoises vs. the hares for learning Japanese.

My question is, are there a lot of people like me, who study for maybe 1-2 hours a day, and make steady but slow progress, or are there more people who study much more intensely, but burn out after a few months or a year, and end up yo-yo'ing?
There don't seem to be many of the slow-but-steady types, at least on these forums, but maybe it's just because they're quiet like I am.

Another tortoise here. I'm been learning Japanese for 3 1/2 years, am currently reworking my way through KO2001 (I'm around the 950 mark), can read manga easily, read novels at a 5-6 grade level, and can understand simple simple anime without subs. My ability to have a real life conversation isn't great, and my grammar needs a LOT of work.
Reading some of the crazy fast pace of other users here can be a bit demotivating sometimes. Even reading Japanese Level Up where he talks about reading light novels without furigana around the 2 year mark, it makes me feel like I'm impossibly slow and not very good at learning.
But the most important thing is that progress is being made. And if a method doesn't work, don't be afraid to try something else (I've finally made peace with the fact that Anki isn't the method for me). Just because the tortoises around here are silent doesn't mean that we don't exist. Slow and steady is far preferable than not making any progress at all.

quark Wrote:Another tortoise here. I'm been learning Japanese for 3 1/2 years, am currently reworking my way through KO2001 (I'm around the 950 mark), can read manga easily, read novels at a 5-6 grade level, and can understand simple simple anime without subs. My ability to have a real life conversation isn't great, and my grammar needs a LOT of work.
Reading some of the crazy fast pace of other users here can be a bit demotivating sometimes. Even reading Japanese Level Up where he talks about reading light novels without furigana around the 2 year mark, it makes me feel like I'm impossibly slow and not very good at learning.

Haha! Let me give some motivation
I started learning Japanese around the time I signed up in this website. That is over four and a half years ago! And guess what? You are way ahead of me! It's because you were consistent and I wasn't. I almost stopped studying after about 9 months when university started and I didn't manage my time properly. Then I fooled myself into thinking that I have to stop learning Japanese to do great at uni, very big mistake! I had to start from SCRATCH after finishing uni and working for sometime, because I realized I still had passion to learn Japanese. That was in March 2012. It's been about a year and a half now after returning to Japanese, and I'm sticking to it! Sometimes I don't learn anything new for a week or even a month, but I keep up with my reviews. I try my best, but my mind has been in a total mess for the last two and a half years, that's why I'm very inconsistent, but I never totally stop. Maybe I deserve the slowest learner trophy LOL! But here I am still working in it. TBH seeing some people who started less than 6 months ago doing much better than me motivates me to study harder!

So...

Anyway, let's do our best!!

undead_saif Wrote:Haha! Let me give some motivation
I started learning Japanese around the time I signed up in this website. That is over four and a half years ago! And guess what? You are way ahead of me! It's because you were consistent and I wasn't. I almost stopped studying after about 9 months when university started and I didn't manage my time properly. Then I fooled myself into thinking that I have to stop learning Japanese to do great at uni, very big mistake! I had to start from SCRATCH after finishing uni and working for sometime, because I realized I still had passion to learn Japanese. That was in March 2012. It's been about a year and a half now after returning to Japanese, and I'm sticking to it! Sometimes I don't learn anything new for a week or even a month, but I keep up with my reviews. I try my best, but my mind has been in a total mess for the last two and a half years, that's why I'm very inconsistent, but I never totally stop. Maybe I deserve the slowest learner trophy LOL! But here I am still working in it. TBH seeing some people who started less than 6 months ago doing much better than me motivates me to study harder!

So...

Anyway, let's do our best!!

I think you can fairly deduct any time when you had stopped studying from your Japanese learning total.
It would be interesting to see how many people have stopped and started in the beginning and how many times it took before learning Japanese started to stick. I know that I started to learn a few times and quit pretty early into it, and I don't count those times as I only had learned a few hiragana, or a few words from Rosetta Stone. Those early start and stop efforts weren't real efforts. My official starting time is when I bought Japanese for Everyone and started working on Japanese every day.
You're definitely right though that keeping up that momentum, no matter how small, and never stopping is so important.
皆さん頑張れ！

quark Wrote:I think you can fairly deduct any time when you had stopped studying from your Japanese learning total.
It would be interesting to see how many people have stopped and started in the beginning and how many times it took before learning Japanese started to stick. I know that I started to learn a few times and quit pretty early into it, and I don't count those times as I only had learned a few hiragana, or a few words from Rosetta Stone. Those early start and stop efforts weren't real efforts. My official starting time is when I bought Japanese for Everyone and started working on Japanese every day.

I propose the formation of a Koohii committee to define precisely what constitutes a student's actual prior study amount. We could give it a sweet name like the "Koohii Persistent Study Duration Index" or something else appropriately illustrious-sounding.

Because I, too, have a study history that is complicated to succinctly define.

Edit:

Oh no

Log in you lazy goofs =P I'm trying to procrastinate here, and nobody's helping!

zurisu Wrote:Log in you lazy goofs =P I'm trying to procrastinate here and nobody's helping!

But lurking is fun. XD
All in all, knowing that certain people with certain accounts are browsing doesn'pointelp anyone really.
It's like watching someone do laundry or wash dishes: dull, and watching doesn't really benefit you. Besides, we can all pretty much guess that users with rising post counts must be posting new things at some point in time, and we can check their post timestamps to tell when they post.

It would be nice if those without accounts would register, though to be fair, this forum can be pretty intimidating at first. In my case, I only signed up to post in the "I finished RTK1" thread, and didn't post again until a long time after. Everyone seemed so good at Japanese, I figured everyone else could answer questions better than I could, and I thought there was nothing I could bring to a conversation compared to them, as well as the forum arguments turned me off. Then I got better at Japanese, and picked up some useful tools and ideas from browsing the forum which newcomers often asked, so I ended up answering questions when I could, and adding links to things I found on the forums to the wiki. Overall it's not the easiest forum to get involved in, so I can see why some unregistered users might want to lurk. I still love it though.<3