I suppose u could call me lucky, I've been married to my wife for 16 great years. We have 4 kids all that are under 4 years olds.
Ive never really cared about studying Japanese, never really been interested in the culture I guess but now here comes the crunch time.
My wife has asked me to move to Japan, her father has become terribly sick and she is worrying to much about it.
We will be leaving the our country in a few weeks.

I'm not sure where to start on the studying part. I guess I need to learn kanji, I got the hiragana and katakana down no problem,
I know for a fact that I need to learn the kanji but the RTK method is the right way for me to go?
I guess I will be seeing Kanji alot and reading and writing will help me alot for work and stuff right?

Anyway actually anyone living in Japan and using this method, did it help ya? Or should I be doing the old fashion way like Japanese teaches . .

Use RTK Lite, because otherwise you'll take too long studying rare/uncommon kanji instead of focusing on the ones you'll be constantly seeing in Japan. Search the forum for it

In my humble opinion, if being able to read Japanese is important to you, then yes, RTK is a great way to become familiar and comfortable with the Kanji.

However, what we do not know is how long you expect to be there? If only for the duration of your wife's family emergency, then I think your time would be better spent working on conversational Japanese. On the other hand, if you expect to be there long term, going through RTK would be well worth your time. Again, IMHO.

You should know that basically every system for learning the kanji boils down to something similar to RTK. You learn the radicals, and typically give them a name, and then learn the kanji as a combination of those radicals. If your concept of "the old fashioned way" is by rote or by pictographs, I suggest you abandon the idea immediately, as it will get you nowhere. The choice to do RTK simply means you are associating a name with the kanji (keyword), and a mneumonic with the radicals to help you remember.

RTK does determine the kanji you learn though, so if you're just trying for a baseline comprehension, I'd agree with the suggestion of RTK lite. If all you need is some basic conversation skills, maybe just pick up pimsleur.

Wow thanks for the quick replies!

@DrJones

Thanks for the tips on the RTKlite,
@gibosi

Opps! Sorry about that, we have sold our flat, so probably for good! I guess its depends how I can adapt to the way of life in Japan. I dont think it will be a problem (fingers crossed) but u never know. I've been so much in a comfortable zone the last 12 years could be hard to change.

@Haych

I was thinking the "old fashioned way" was how Japanese kids learn their Kanji at school to be honest with ya.

Just a quick reply. Yes, I live in Japan, and yes, it helped me tremendously.

I tried to do RTK Lite, but found it was actually harder than learning all the kanji (since they build upon one another), so I abandoned that and did full RTK. That's what I'd recommend.

My strong advice is to learn kanji if you want to improve your spoken Japanese, not just your reading. Without kanji, it's like trying to remember an endless series of unrelated words. Kanji ties everything together, and you'll see why the word "shokuji" is related to "taberu." Once you see that, things will click and you'll be able to retain information more readily.

Well, off to work now. Good luck!

@JapaneseRuleOF7

Thanks for the quick reply

Just checked ur website Ill be reading that at work later if it isnt blocked

Haych Wrote:You should know that basically every system for learning the kanji boils down to something similar to RTK.

Absolutely not true. Learning keywords or "meanings" for thousands of Kanji up front is not in anyway similar to most other study methods.

OP - You have come to a forum here that was originally built around RTK so obviously everyone is going to recommend you do the book. If you go to most other online forums they will usually recommend you do NOT do RTK, so you might want to look for other opinions too before investing months completing that book.

I think much of it comes down to your ability to speak. If you can't speak any Japanese at all, for me getting some basics down would be my absolute first priority. Life becomes *massively* easier when you can at least say and understand some basic phrases, and you won't have to constantly lean on your wife's help for absolutely everything (at which is probably already going to be a stressful enough time for her too)

RTK will take months to complete, in your case during a move to another country it won't be easy to find the time and its not unrealistic it could take half a year to get through. After that point you will recognise the Kanji and be able to write them, but still won't be able to read anything at all and won't be able to speak anything at all. Given your situation I would say that's a bad idea and a bad place to put yourself into.

So my advice would be to not worry about Kanji for now (honestly, Kanji is NOT a big deal in the long run, don't stress it) and focus on studying some Japanese the normal way, ideally through textbooks like the Genki series. Once you have got the basics down, if you feel Kanji are causing you a high amount of trouble then you can go to RTK then, although even then it may not be necessary (I have never completed RTK and never had any problems learning how to read Kanji).

Good luck with the move!

@Nightsky

thanks for the input

if I go to another website and ask the same question. I'm guessing your right about mixed views. . .

The problem is that I'm worried about the kanji when you say dont..
Maybe my kind of work will be hard to find coz of my lack of Japanese speaking, writing and reading but if I managed to find a pastry chef position then I'm going to need how to know all.
I think it will be a hard task ahead of me but I'm going to give my dead best to try.

Yes, you will need to know everything probably eventually and it would be really hard work. You are worried about Kanji because you are a beginner and you see 2,000 of them staring at you in the face and you have no idea where to begin. And that's okay, almost everyone was the same.

Kanji is not the enormous barrier its made out to be, and at a more advanced level Kanji becomes helpful because it gives hints at meanings of new words you learn. Its just a big barrier from day 1 to get people reading for sure.

You should be more worried about the 15,000 words you have to learn to be able to speak and understand most things, that takes far more time and far more effort. 2,000 characters that you see all the time consistently is barely a problem in comparison!

I'd say go through RTK if you plan to be there long-term. Worth it. Though, you don't necessarily have to do it right at the beginning of your studies.

UptheVilla Wrote:I guess its depends how I can adapt to the way of life in Japan. I dont think it will be a problem (fingers crossed) but u never know.

It's probably best to appreciate the difficulty of living in another culture long-term before you go. Culture shock happens to everyone, it will take years before you appreciate how truly deep the differences are between your own culture and the new one, and there will always be certain parts of the new culture you are unable to accept fully. Personally, I find that all fun, but it's definitely full of challenges.

maybe also look into wani kani from tofugu. as long as you learn about the radicals remembering the kanji shouldn't be impossible.

I guess I'm the only person who's lived in Japan reasonably long term, experienced no significant culture shock and genuinely feels a million times more comfortable here than back their original country.

I suppose I understand if you were happy where you were to begin with though

dizmox Wrote:I guess I'm the only person who's lived in Japan reasonably long term, experienced no significant culture shock and genuinely feels a million times more comfortable here than back their original country.

I suppose I understand if you were happy where you were to begin with though

Yeah no, I don't think you're the only one.

dizmox Wrote:I guess I'm the only person who's lived in Japan reasonably long term, experienced no significant culture shock and genuinely feels a million times more comfortable here than back their original country.

I suppose I understand if you were happy where you were to begin with though

Hmm, interesting. Almost everyone I've ever met got a good amount of the frustration side of culture shock, especially in the half-a-year to 2 year period. After that it tends to come and go kind of randomly. I've read that an awfully high percentage of people who move to a different culture ultimately reject it.

Just to be clear, I also feel very comfortable in Japan, so much so that I may live here forever. But I definitely still have culture shock. For me it's mostly because it's impossible to get Japanese people to understand my point of view sometimes, simply because they don't understand the American cultural background enough for me to convince them, and even if I can express it through the lens of Japanese culture to some extent it's not enough for them to really get it. Happened recently when I got into an argument with my board of education about my commute route.

Many people point out that culture shock is a misnomer and should be called culture fatigue. You really never feel fatigued by cultural differences?

Having spent most of my life back in the UK being raised quite literally by the internet, anime and online games in a household that wasn't particularly British, I guess I always was in my own international bubble. I think when I was 14 I was planning on moving to America as it seemed like the center of the world to me back then.

I'm definitely not like a typical Japanese guy (apparently I don't seem like anyone from any country...), but there are more of the things I like and people I hit it off with here. (-8

dizmox Wrote:Having spent most of my life back in the UK being raised quite literally by the internet, anime and online games in a household that wasn't particularly British, I guess I always was in my own international bubble. I think when I was 14 I was planning on moving to America as it seemed like the center of the world to me back then.

I'm definitely not like a typical Japanese guy (apparently I don't seem like anyone from any country...), but there are more of the things I like and people I hit it off with here. (-8

Interesting story. Out of curiosity, how long have you been living in Japan and what are you doing there?

Admittedly only 1 year (with another 15 months left on my current visa), but I went back and forth for several years before coming. I'm just a normal graduate student living with my girlfriend here at the moment, but will probably be working in finance in a year or so (I interned at a couple Japanese companies this summer).

Didn't mean to derail the thread!