[Feel free to move this topic into a better subforum if need be, or to respond by linking to a thread where this has already been discussed.]

I've been studying Chinese for about 10 months now and have gone through Heisig's Remembering Traditional Hanzi, parts I and II. Although I'd like to continue studying Chinese, I would love to be able to pick up at least a little Japanese for a trip to Tokyo this June. Although I know the Japanese and Chinese meanings of the Kanji can vary, I feel as though my prior study of them will come in handy.

My question is essentially whether anyone knows of a useful book (I generally prefer print to electronic/audio when it comes to language study, Reviewing the Hanzi website aside!) that would let me learn 'tourist Japanese' in the next two months as I finish up my college studies. I don't expect to even reach a 'beginning' level -- just to be able to greet people, order food and essentially be nice to people, in Japanese.

Also, do you suppose it's worth studying the katakana and hiragana for a week-long trip, or should I put that off until I decide to study Japanese 'full-time' in the same way that I'm now studying Chinese?

Thanks a lot!

[Zgarbas]

Kana does not take much time to learn, especially since you have kanji knowledge already. You could pull off a basic recognition within days without much effort =). I don't see any reason why you wouldn't.

It sounds like all you need is a basic phrasebook. A lonely planet guide, or any other phrasebook really, should suffice.

Zgarbas Wrote:It sounds like all you need is a basic phrasebook. A lonely planet guide, or any other phrasebook really, should suffice.

This is really is the best advice. The Lonely Planet phrase books contain pronunciation guides and some basic grammar patterns.

Apply the tips and tricks from The Quick and Dirty Guide to Learning Languages Fast would also be useful but maybe not worth the $12 price. The gist of the method is to focus on extremely important nouns and verbs because you can generally get by just by using one of each. As a Japanese example if you know the word eki and the word ikitai then you can generally get help finding the (nearest) station just by saying those two words.

にほんっごのかんじうべんきょうしてください、それだけだ。ね?

pauro02 Wrote:にほんっごのかんじうべんきょうしてください、それだけだ。ね?

Er . . . Google translate says, "Please get the feeling of your studying Tsu Japan, but that's it. Right?"

I wasn't joking when I said I'm just beginning to learn Japanese! :-D

[Zgarbas]

It's poorly written and doesn't really say anything (I think he was trying to say "just keep to your kanji studies"?), ignoring the fact that it blatantly disregards your inability to read kana. Don't worry about it =).
pauro02, though we're all studying Japanese here, it's an English-speaking forum so you might want to stick to writing in English. Thank you!

It's fine, he/she is probably just practicing. I completed the hiragana lessons for Remembering the Kana today -- katakana for tomorrow/the next few days. But then the question is, well, how do I use it? Would a lonely planet guide have hiragana so I could practice reading and writing as the Japanese would, or is there something a little more advanced (while still geared towards beginners of course)?

Thanks for your help everyone, it's nice to post on such a lively and helpful forum!

Zgarbas Wrote:It's poorly written and doesn't really say anything (I think he was trying to say "just keep to your kanji studies"?), ignoring the fact that it blatantly disregards your inability to read kana. Don't worry about it =).
pauro02, though we're all studying Japanese here, it's an English-speaking forum so you might want to stick to writing in English. Thank you!

Didn't he also post on another thread with 日本語 written as にほんっご, or was that someone else? An odd mistake; I've never seen it before.

(pauro02: It's にほんご)

Well, I made it through the hiragana and katakana -- probably rushed it and didn't let it soak in. But I couldn't wait!

I ended up ordering "Japanese at a Glance" off Amazon. It has really good reviews and I'm hoping a brisk read-through will give me a good foundation. As I learned with Chinese characters, it can be frustrating to know how to write a given symbol but not know how to use it in a sentence, let alone in a word. Thanks again for all your advice.

[RawToast]

KBurchfiel Wrote:Well, I made it through the hiragana and katakana -- probably rushed it and didn't let it soak in. But I couldn't wait!

Doesn't really matter too much, all studies beyond this point just re-enforce your the kana in your memory.

I went to Japan last year with my family and it was awesome. Unfortunately, my kanji knowledge was not super useful because they have English on pretty much all of the subway/train signs, and other places where we really needed it. My parents were still impressed that I knew the Japanese parts though :-).

This would be more for speaking (which I think would also be useful): I used Michel Thomas Japanese (Beginners) before we traveled. It had about 9 hours of "class time" in the audio. You learn the structure of basic grammar and get a decent amount of practice built-in. If you pair that with some essential basic vocab, you would be able to ask where things are, and form some useful sentences.

I think Michel Thomas has changed their format, so it may be called something slightly different now. But the beginners version was enough to string some sentences together for people to understand me.

Like others have suggested, I also agree that it would be good to learn some kana before leaving.

Otherwise, maybe just try to learn the kanji/kana associated with some basic vocab?

It's pretty easy to get around in Tokyo even if you don't know Japanese, especially if you are just visiting for a little while. So don't stress about it and just have fun!

皆、酷い。あなた達は日本じゃない、だからうるさいな。またく。

.

Arupan Wrote:まあ、間違いだらけだと言ってもこのサイトの利用者の大多数と違ってちゃんと日本語で書いているから評価できますね。これからも頑張ってくださいね、パウロさん。

えっと、KBurchfielさんはかなが読めないと言ってたのに、パウロさんはかなで返事したんです。ちょっと失礼でしょう？

パウロさん、日本語で書いても構いませんが、適切な返事をしなければならないと思います。スレッドのトピックと今までの話を考えてから返事してください。

(Translation for the OP--since I mention him and he's new at Japanese:
"Umm, KBurchfiel said he couldn't read kana, but pauro responded in kana. Isn't that a bit rude?

Pauro, I don't mind if you write in Japanese, but replies must be done appropriately. Take into account the thread topic and what has been said so far when you post.")

jishera Wrote:This would be more for speaking (which I think would also be useful): I used Michel Thomas Japanese (Beginners) before we traveled. It had about 9 hours of "class time" in the audio. You learn the structure of basic grammar and get a decent amount of practice built-in. If you pair that with some essential basic vocab, you would be able to ask where things are, and form some useful sentences.

I had no idea there was a Michel Thomas for Japanese. Especially since he didn't speak himself, I guess they are just slapping his name on the box to help sales? =/

Michel Thomas is excellent for both French and Spanish though! But I have my doubts about the Japanese one, I don't think his method would translate as well.

(sorry for being slightly O/T)

Tzadeck Wrote:

Arupan Wrote:まあ、間違いだらけだと言ってもこのサイトの利用者の大多数と違ってちゃんと日本語で書いているから評価できますね。これからも頑張ってくださいね、パウロさん。

えっと、KBurchfielさんはかなが読めないと言ってたのに、パウロさんはかなで返事したんです。ちょっと失礼でしょう？

パウロさん、日本語で書いても構いませんが、適切な返事をしなければならないと思います。スレッドのトピックと今までの話を考えてから返事してください。

(Translation for the OP--since I mention him and he's new at Japanese:
"Umm, KBurchfiel said he couldn't read kana, but pauro responded in kana. Isn't that a bit rude?

Pauro, I don't mind if you write in Japanese, but replies must be done appropriately. Take into account the thread topic and what has been said so far when you post.")

はい、分かったょ。じゃ、ごめなさい。そして、日本語が教えてこれ。ｘD　I would be very much happy and contented if I will at least reach N3 level. Not merely taking the exam, but at least professional speakers will at least grade me to that level. Anyways, how I will reach that far via online? Any url or free tutorial?

[RawToast]

NightSky Wrote:I had no idea there was a Michel Thomas for Japanese. Especially since he didn't speak himself, I guess they are just slapping his name on the box to help sales? =/

Michel Thomas is excellent for both French and Spanish though! But I have my doubts about the Japanese one, I don't think his method would translate as well.

It's the same method, just done by Helen Gilhooly (she does some other Japanese learning CDs). Starts of with things like 'I drink coffee' and slowly moves on 'I want to drink coffee', 'Will you drink coffee with me', 'Tomorrow I will go to Tokyo with my boyfriend to drink coffee' etc.

Quote:would be very much happy and contented if I will at least reach N3 level. Not merely taking the exam, but at least professional speakers will at least grade me to that level. Anyways, how I will reach that far via online? Any url or free tutorial?

Iknow or core 6k via anki would easily cover the vocab. Tae Kim would be borderline N3 grammar, you'd definitely need to cover a few extra points which you could get from Imabi and then memorise with grammar decks.