Pretty much every show from the US worth watching ends up in Japanese.
*edit* And pretty much every show ends up online.

Nobody ever mentions variety shows. You don't have to worry about dealing with awful J-drama scriptwriting, acting etc with those and they can actually be funny. ホンマでっか!?TV is one I like, and ネブ＆イモトの世界番付 can be good too.

These sort of shows usually have a theme for each episode, so you can just watch the ones you find interesting, and you're not going to miss any plot (holes) if stop halfway through. I also think it's a decent way to familiarise yourself with Japanese pop culture, humour and other things that are hard to pick up without actually talking to people.

I did kind of like the drama ガリレオ though, but it still had a lot of the god-awful J-drama characteristics that probably gave you the impression they all suck. If you can't overlook the cringe-worthy parts, J-drama definitely isn't for you. Although, the Stilton-strength cheese factor in the classic 古畑任三郎 is what makes it worth watching.

Edit: 容疑者Xの献身 is the movie version of ガリレオ with the same actors minus the cheese. It's a pretty decent watch and the reason I ventured into drama land for ガリレオ.

Javizy Wrote:ホンマでっか!?TV is one I like, and ネブ＆イモトの世界番付 can be good too.

They don't seem to be on d-addicts. What's your media source?

nihon_lover Wrote:Hi minna,

it's been a while since I have posted a topic. I would like to ask you all, is there an alternative to J-dramas to use for immersion? I watched a comedy the other day and it sucked!!! This was not the idea I had for Japan or Japanese people. And yes I know that j-dramas do not represent the Japanese life style, but it was a culture shock for me. So any ideas?

I'm sorry but this is just too hilarious, combination of your nick+comment are exactly spot on Its like all stereotypes coming together in one perfect union:
- you ofc love Japan
- quick to pass judgement
- Japan not fitting your idea of 'Japan'
- no actual knowledge about life in Japan

Doesn't get better than this

Normally I'd consider trying other dramas because its ridiculous to give up after one show that didn't "click" with you (hint: there are tons of series from US that suck balls too, actually most of them do) but in your case I'd rather consider if you're actually all that interested in Japanese culture and people. I think it would be more productive for you to get a friend or have more regular interactions with Japanese people and find out if its anything like you'd expect and what you searched for.

Well,

@thurd, your post really caught my attention about what was my idea about Japan. When I started learning Japanese I was enchanted by anime and was watching all tons of stuff. Nowadays I really don't find anything in particular in anime that really draws my attention. I started learning Japanese because of Japanese Buddhism actually and had never really delved into Japanese pop-culture. Surely Japanese people seem to live life in extremes.

They were so many answers to my original post that I am overwhelmed . Right now I'm going through a bit of Japanese language learning crisis. I feel that if the Japanese life-style doesn’t appeal to me why do I bother learning Japanese in the first place? But to be honest I love the language, the history and the spiritual life in Japan. So, the conflict in me maybe is between traditional vs. modern life. Then again you cannot learn anything about a country before you stay for a while there and interact with its people...

thurd Wrote:in your case I'd rather consider if you're actually all that interested in Japanese culture and people

I'll admit the thought crossed my mind as well, also in regards to all those who recommend Western shows dubbed into Japanese. But then again there are all kinds of Japan lovers. I have friends that 'love' Japan for ninja, yakuza and samurai. I tried showing them my favorite shows that actually reflect normal Japan and their reactions were "What the hell are we watching?"

shinsen Wrote:

Javizy Wrote:ホンマでっか!?TV is one I like, and ネブ＆イモトの世界番付 can be good too.

They don't seem to be on d-addicts. What's your media source?

Youku and Tudou. If you like 世界番付 you'll probably like its clone 世界のみんなに聞いてみた

I love honma dekka and American tv dramas as well. Ps I hate kdramas but even then I think i found a potential kdrama that is actually goood... we will see. Like everyone said most American tv dramas and most Japanese dramas suck but u gotta find the 10% that is actually good and wort watching.im glad I didn't give up and found ones that are actually good ... For example I thought densha otoko was complete shit and despite that I wanted to believe there were quality ones but they don't comprise 90 or even 70 percent of dramas that come out every year. Definitely don't go by ratings in Japan or popularity in a forum to decide if the drama is worth watching till the end. If your instincts are telling you that it's shit then go onto another drama that might be potentially good


This is an interesting g jdrama blog
http://hamsapsukebe.blogspot.com/?m=1

This are my blog entries Abt jdrama reviews. Also I put up screen caps from talk variety shows in my other recent entries...
http://choronghi.wordpress.com/?s=Drama+...mit=Search
I have a lot on my to watch list but since then I've gotten shorter on time...
Unfortunately and also I love talk variety shows and there is a shitload of them

One drama I would recommend to u is liar game because its fast paced with a running time of 35 minutes. And also bc it'll make u want to watch the next ep for sure. Also the lighting isn't crap like in other jdramas

One thing I definitely cannot get from American tv is talk variety show like ariyoshi is brilliant and also kaidan 怪談話 ( some horror movies are so shitty and long yet watching somebody tell their scary story in Japanese scares me in a few minutes)

nihon_lover Wrote:When I started learning Japanese I was enchanted by anime and was watching all tons of stuff. Nowadays I really don't find anything in particular in anime that really draws my attention. I started learning Japanese because of Japanese Buddhism actually and had never really delved into Japanese pop-culture. Surely Japanese people seem to live life in extremes.

My experience was similar, I started Japanese to be able to play Final Fantasy games in all their glory and with no delays, but before I even got serious about it Square sunk the series into oblivion. But either way this got me hooked and before I knew I discovered other aspects of Japan that I liked, not only in various form of media but also their perspective on socio-economic problems, religion, work etc.
If Buddhism is your thing maybe try to explore that area more, traditional Japan is still there and I'm sure you'll find lots of interesting topics that could maintain your interest (I play Go for example).

nihon_lover Wrote:They were so many answers to my original post that I am overwhelmed . Right now I'm going through a bit of Japanese language learning crisis. I feel that if the Japanese life-style doesn’t appeal to me why do I bother learning Japanese in the first place? But to be honest I love the language, the history and the spiritual life in Japan. So, the conflict in me maybe is between traditional vs. modern life. Then again you cannot learn anything about a country before you stay for a while there and interact with its people...

If you can afford it I greatly recommend it, one of the best things in Japan is how they take traditional and modern and make it work.

howtwosavealif3 Wrote:Definitely don't go by ratings in Japan or popularity in a forum to decide if the drama is worth watching till the end. If your instincts are telling you that it's shit then go onto another drama that might be potentially good

This is very true, you are the best judge so go with your instincts first. If I find something that could be interesting on paper (synopsis etc.) I download 1st episode and check it out.
Some time ago I downloaded 3 shows with certain expectations about them (ordered):
1. Mirai Nikki
2. Lucky Seven
3. Poison
and after watching their pilots I got:
1. Lucky Seven
2. Poison

Lucky Seven had a really impressive pilot (2nd episode wasn't as good but still decent) with interesting plot and good action scenes, Poison got me intrigued (got some Liar Game vibe but w/o super cute protagonist) and Mirai Nikki was disappointing in almost every aspect and most difficult language wise from those three (I don't know why, maybe I watch too much crime dramas) so I dropped it.

Initially I was into anime but now I don't even care Abt anime that come out this season or whatever lol. Im interested in a very select few as well as older ones from the 90s and 80s tho. However I still like/watch/read a lot of Japanese stuff.

Snippets that i collected on mytumblr abt anime
http://tsukinofune.tumblr.com/tagged/アニメ
http://tsukinofune.tumblr.com/tagged/クソアニメ

Basically I noticed anime turned to shit so I was looking up people's thoughts and explanation for this phenomena and I found some interesting stuff. There's still a few 2ch archive Abt the topic I got to read. I loved welcome to the NHk and melancholy if suzumiya haruhi in 2006. Hell there was even nana and death note in 2006 but nowadays everything looks like and is shit and I just found it enjoyable to hear Abt people's theories as to why that happened and I found way more useful stuff in Japanese than english. It was a good way to confirm that other people have my sentiments as well.

Now that you've mentioned poor acting, it's weird that it didn't really bother me, maybe because I think of most TV media as total crap and so didn't have good expectations?

Another notorious quality about Japanese drama is leaving you hanging at the end, very unsatisfying endings they make D:<
For example:
Summer Snow
Liar Game
Densha Otoko
My Boss, My hero.

Out of the Dorama and movies I've watched, I consider My Boss, My hero and Edison no Haha to be the worthiest, even though the main character's acting in these two was way too amateurish, but the stories and characters development were good!

Do you guys recommend "One Liter of Tears"?

One Liter of Tears is good, it was done really well for the most part. The cheesy stuff is definitely limited.

But seriously watch Japanese movies if you want good acting and good stories in general, dramas always tend to have some "cheesy" stuff in it.

nihon_lover Wrote:Well,


They were so many answers to my original post that I am overwhelmed . Right now I'm going through a bit of Japanese language learning crisis. I feel that if the Japanese life-style doesn’t appeal to me why do I bother learning Japanese in the first place?

Well what is the Japanese Life-Style? They eat, work, play, sleep like anyone else. Not that different from anywhere else in the world.

Question a): some of you mentioned that my nick name didn't quite much, so to say, the way I see Japan (by judging my post). So, do you feel that someone who loves Japan has to love everything about this country? I love my country, but I don't like everyhting that is happening here...

Question b): how many of you started watching j-dramas as a means to learn Japanese? Were you satisfied from the result...?

thnx in advance...

nihon_lover Wrote:Question b): how many of you started watching j-dramas as a means to learn Japanese? Were you satisfied from the result...?

I'll make an attempt at answering for some others, as I do not personally watch ドラマ series (would if I could):

It isn't watching to "learn"; more watching to utilize what we have learned in order to acquire more of the language. As I watch アニメ, the grammar and vocabulary I have studied is re-enforced through active listening. This process of viewing with greater understanding based on the results of language learning, equates to more comprehensible input and increase language acquisition.

This is my opinion of the matter, many may disagree.

howtwosavealif3 Wrote:Basically I noticed anime turned to shit so I was looking up people's thoughts and explanation for this phenomena and I found some interesting stuff.

It has hardly "turned to shit". There was just as much poor, cookie-cutter, cliched, fan-service based, low-brow アニメ in the earlier years as there is today, the only different is that production values have increased and a paradigm shift has made モエ and ロリ-esque sub-genres more appealing to the increasing large "Western" market.

On a volume-for-volume basis, there is probably no significant difference between the "great" shows of current and those five, ten, fifteen, twenty year ago. A lot of the criticism is based on the fact that what people liked is no longer being produced and instead what a different generation like is being produced. You're really missing out a handful of great アニメ, if you enjoy アニメ, by simply stating that it's "turned to shit".

Afterall, shows such as 「ようこそにＮＨＫ」とか「魔法少女まどか☆マギカ」とか「日常」とか「みなみけ」とか「宇宙兄弟」 are recent.

But I digress. It's silly to argue over opinions: you have yours and I have mine.

I'm currently watching, after a very long break, Gankutsuou, and wow, I'm totally blown away by it, I've never though I'd enjoy an Anime in such a way, maybe because it's based on a classic French novel. The art, mystery, world and topics presented make it a fantastic Anime.

uisukii Wrote:

howtwosavealif3 Wrote:Basically I noticed anime turned to shit so I was looking up people's thoughts and explanation for this phenomena and I found some interesting stuff.

It has hardly "turned to shit". There was just as much poor, cookie-cutter, cliched, fan-service based, low-brow アニメ in the earlier years as there is today, the only different is that production values have increased and a paradigm shift has made モエ and ロリ-esque sub-genres more appealing to the increasing large "Western" market.

On a volume-for-volume basis, there is probably no significant difference between the "great" shows of current and those five, ten, fifteen, twenty year ago. A lot of the criticism is based on the fact that what people liked is no longer being produced and instead what a different generation like is being produced. You're really missing out a handful of great アニメ, if you enjoy アニメ, by simply stating that it's "turned to shit".

Afterall, shows such as 「ようこそにＮＨＫ」とか「魔法少女まどか☆マギカ」とか「日常」とか「みなみけ」とか「宇宙兄弟」 are recent.

But I digress. It's silly to argue over opinions: you have yours and I have mine.

Well then let me like what I like and you like what you like. You're contradicting yourself by saying we all have different tastes and thattheres no point arguing abt it and then saying I'm missing out so much as if I'm being super close-minded . Im not missing out. im saying i know its shit and thats why im not making myself continue watching crap. If you're curious as to why I think that then you can read the stuff I linked... and i really thought nichijou is shit. Madoka is one of the few I have expectations of being acually entertaining but I haven't see it yet. just watch whatever u want but do not say you're missing out so much bc we don't like the same shit show for show. And like I said read up a lot up on people's insights and analysis as to why anime nowadays sucks so muchand I posted my collection of the text. I really seriously think there are some really awful trends nowadays after reading all that. And of course I agree there were a lot of shitty anime in other decades. What I'm saying is that the stuff I read mentions issues that exist today in the anime industry and how that contributes to the crappy low quality. I just have this opinion and after I read all that i gained more understanidng as to exactly why or possible reasons. I found it to be a fascinating read. I don't want to do the cliche old anime vs new anime argument. That been done a billion times on any anime forum

I have no problem if you like what you like but don't make it sound like I'm missing out just bc I dont like the same shows as you. Your argument is very tip of the iceberg and I understand its one forum post and its not a thread Abt anime... Hence if you're curious as to why I feel that way then read the stuff I linked. And if you'd like to spend your time doing something else besides reading that... That's fine then Leave the whole issue alone

Tzadeck Wrote:I have trouble finding shows I like in any language, haha.

Yeah I'm not too into TV in my home country, especially the commercials. I can't watch anime on crunchyroll or whatever too long either because of streaming issues and English language commercials that are always louder than the show.

nihon_lover Wrote:how many of you started watching j-dramas as a means to learn Japanese? Were you satisfied from the result...?

I am getting as much enjoyment out of the fact that I'm watching a show that

uisukii Wrote:As I watch...the grammar and vocabulary I have studied is [reinforced] through active listening. This process of viewing with greater understanding based on the results of language learning, equates to more

fun/satisfaction for me than TV in my native language.

howtosavealife Wrote:It was a good way to confirm that other people have my sentiments as well.

nonetheless, did you find that there are some anime that cater more to gaijin taste or to nihonjin taste or have more fandom one way or the other? I guess i mean among fans, not just as a result of marketing and availability. i.e. of course Naruto is popular abroad because it has large distribution and availability. (i'm at work and the computers here don't display kanji, otherwise I'd read your blog some before asking.)

nihon_lover Wrote:I started learning Japanese because of Japanese Buddhism

This is kind of what I had in mind when you said that Japan/the Japanese weren't conforming to your idea of Japan/the Japanese.

The VAST majority of Japanese are Buddhist by title only and know nothing about Buddhism except that you go to temple (but really a Shinto shrine will do just as well) on New Years and when you die you will have a Buddhist funeral service. Most Japanese are completely apathetic toward anything religious/philosophical (since many believe Buddhism is not a religion but a philosophy).

You want to 'celebrate' Christmas by putting up a fake tree and ordering kFC? That's cool.

You want to have a fake 'Christian' wedding with a fake 'priest' (who's really just an eikaiwa teacher doing this on the side) because 'western' weddings are so much cooler than Japanese style weddings? That's cool, too.

You want to call a Shinto priest to 'bless' a piece of land you are planning on building on? Sure, why not?

This is probably 99% of Japanese people's mentality toward religion.

nihon_lover Wrote:Question b): how many of you started watching j-dramas as a means to learn Japanese? Were you satisfied from the result...?

I learned Japanese because of anime and manga, if it wasn't for manga, I wouldn't even be interested tell you the truth. I don't really find stuff from Japan 'fascinating' like a lot of people. Yeah I like their movies, I read Japanese novels, but that's just all entertainment stuff, but you know what's funny, a lot of Japanese learners can't even name 10 Japanese books/magazines/movies/songs off the top of their heads....kinda weird if you ask me.

howtwosavealif3 Wrote:What I'm saying is that the stuff I read mentions issues that exist today in the anime industry and how that contributes to the crappy low quality. I just have this opinion and after I read all that i gained more understanidng as to exactly why or possible reasons. I found it to be a fascinating read. I don't want to do the cliche old anime vs new anime argument. That been done a billion times on any anime forum

Read manga then, they have tons of more variety and none of the "issues" or whatever that stuff is you're talking about.

If you don't like to watch drama, how about just downloading and reading the subtitles?
It'd be like reading a book. Except that it's 100% spoken dialogue.
You can copy/paste/analyze/SRS all of the kanji and words in the script.

On average, a 1-hour drama episode contains about 400-550 unique kanji characters in the script.

Of course, people don't always speak like they do on TV, but if you can understand a drama script, chances are you can understand almost any common conversation you'll hear in real life. I'd say that's one of the biggest advantages of drama over anime. The fact that drama consists of humans speaking to other humans face-to-face (and not voice actors recording themselves in an isolated vocal booth).

nihon_lover Wrote:how many of you started watching j-dramas as a means to learn Japanese? Were you satisfied from the result...?

thnx in advance...

J-dramas are currently my primary source for learning Japanese. I watch them with Japanese subtitles and look up every new word. I have a pretty elaborate system for this, so when I encounter a word I don't know I can see how many times I've actually come across it before, when and where (including extra context with text from other doramas).

I feel that this method is better than basic "immersion" (listening without effort). Sure, it takes longer to see an episode but I believe slowing down and paying attention is helping me learn better.

I don't like Japanese drama but FC2 has plenty of US stuff if you're interested. It's expensive for some but in the past 12 months I've obtained seen these shows (and more), not to mention the thousands of dubbed movies, j-drama, variety & anime. Its well worth the money if you ask me.

Terminator Sarah Connor Chronicles (Complete)
White Collar (Complete)
Prison Break (Complete)
Walking Dead (Season 1-2)
Dexter (Season 1-3)
Lost (Complete)
Big Bang Theory (Season 1-2)
Three and a Half Men (Season 1)
Gossip Girl
Mentalist
Nightrider (Complete)
V (Complete)
Flash Forward (Complete)
House (Season 1)
Cold Case (Complete)
Criminal Minds
Covert Affairs
Nikita (Season 1-2)
Nip Tuck (Season 1-2)
Sex And The City
Drop Dead Diva (Season 1-3)
Blade (Complete)
Quantum Leap (Season 1)
Spongebob 80+ episodes
Friends (Season 1)
iCarly
Eureka (Season 1-2)
Supernaturals (Season 5)
South Park
Lie To Me (Complete)
Stargate (Complete)
Simpsons 100+ episodes
8 Simple Rules (Season 1-2)
Charlie Brown 10+ episodes
Burn Notice (Season 1-4)
Bones (Season 1-4)
Glee (Season 1)
CSI
24 (Complete)
Sopranos (Season 1 & 5)
NCSI
True Blood (Season 1)
NCIS
NYPD Blue
Heroes (Complete)
X-Files (Season 1)

uisukii Wrote:

howtwosavealif3 Wrote:Basically I noticed anime turned to shit so I was looking up people's thoughts and explanation for this phenomena and I found some interesting stuff.

It has hardly "turned to shit". There was just as much poor, cookie-cutter, cliched, fan-service based, low-brow アニメ in the earlier years as there is today, the only different is that production values have increased and a paradigm shift has made モエ and ロリ-esque sub-genres more appealing to the increasing large "Western" market.

On a volume-for-volume basis, there is probably no significant difference between the "great" shows of current and those five, ten, fifteen, twenty year ago.

Actually the total amount of shows being produced took a nose dive around the time of the (2007-2008) financial crash (and the proportion of 13 episode runs compared to 26 episode runs increased), so I think that had an effect. There just isn't as much money in the industry anymore so there is not much room for experimental high budget shows (well this is the only explanation I can think of).

Quote:I watched a comedy the other day and it sucked!!!

My reaction to every sitcom ever.