Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 794
Thanks:
7
There's a lot of primitives and radicals that have different origins but look the same. I'd be more confused if I had to try and tell them apart and give them different names. It's not like Heisig's primitives have accurate names anyway.
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 98
Thanks:
0
There are quite a few of these; there are some examples mentioned in the "stroke order rules" sticky.
In cases where it's just a matter of appearance, it might not even be worth mentioning; you sort of pick that stuff up automatically. But when the difference is in stroke count, order, or direction, and Heisig doesn't mention it, I don't think it can be considered anything other than an error. I mean, by following his book as it's written, he's teaching you to write quite a few kanji wrong. This is for me the only really disappointing thing about the book, which I'm generally a fan of. I don't know whether the 5th edition has improved in this regard...
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 57
Thanks:
0
Heisig doesn't mention the different stroke count, so I think he made a small error there. The reasoning for separating it into two, perhaps closely related, primitives would be because that's a good way to remember it. A note would suffice though.
I don't really worry about the different stroke orders in 牛, 物 or 左,右,石 or other characters for now. My reasoning is that since actually being able to write the characters is almost overkill nowadays, the stroke order is certainly beyond what I need to know at my level.
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,219
Thanks:
0
There are plenty of primitives that lose strokes or slightly change shape depending on their location and still remain the same primitive: 食, 良, 長, 羊, 乙. If you want to make the two-stroke cornucopia a separate primitive, go ahead, but frankly, there aren't enough instances of it to merit a separate primitive.
Edited: 2007-10-31, 9:24 pm
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 98
Thanks:
0
It's not necessary to name a separate primitive for these cases, but he should mention the difference, especially when it's something as fundamental as stroke order, count, or direction. That's the issue. He *usually* does this, but he misses quite a few, too (of the ones you list, 羊 is another example). To me, this is no different than printing an incorrect stroke diagram.
Being able to write the characters is "overkill?" The book only promises two things, and one is that you'll be able to write the characters.
[in the "stroke positioning sticky, Katsuo mentions that Heisig explains about the differences in the "cornucopia" primitive in the 3rd edition, but there's no explanation in my 4th edition -- he says they're all 2-strokers with the same order]
Edited: 2007-11-01, 8:13 am