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+--- Thread: Sound = Kana? (/thread-9521.html)
Sound = Kana? - Marble101 - 2012-05-29
I understand how some words have emphasis on certain syllables,, but from following the furigana in the following video:
I just can't understand how the singer comes up with the pronunciation of the kana during parts 0:59 - 1:02.
The kana reads: tsu yo ga ri wo hi to tsu kii te ku re
But it sounds like: tsu yo gar ri wo shko shkin de ku re
EDIT: added "yo" and "i"
Sound = Kana? - JimmySeal - 2012-05-29
Marble101 Wrote:The kana reads: tsu ga ri wo hi to tsu ki te ku reYou're missing a yo in both lines, and an i in "kiite":
But it sounds like: tsu gar ri wo shko shkin de ku re
tsu yo ga ri wo hi to tsu kii te ku re
In fluid speech, it's not uncommon for /hi/ to be pronounced more like /shh/ when the /i/ after it is devocalized. It's just what the mouth naturally does when you're talking fast.
And don't forget that /u/ and /i/ can be devocalized between unvoiced consonants and after an unvoiced consonant at the end of a word.
So I guess a representation of the line that's closer to how it's actually being pronounced here would be:
tsuyo gari wo shhto tskiite kure
The rest sounds perfectly like what's written there, and you seem to be just mishearing it. Try using a program like Audacity to slow the audio down and that should elucidate it for you.
Sound = Kana? - Marble101 - 2012-05-29
What do you mean by "unvoiced"?
They just don't pronounce the vowel?
Sound = Kana? - JimmySeal - 2012-05-29
Yes. Any decent Japanese learning guide (including textbooks) should explain that. It's pretty important.
Sound = Kana? - yudantaiteki - 2012-05-29
Also the "h" sound in "hi" is different from the "h" sound in ha, he, and ho. It can sound like "sh" although it's not the same sound. Pronouncing ひ as the English word "he" (i.e. he/him/his) gives you a foreign accent. (The IPA symbol for the consonant in ひ is [ç].)
And as JimmySeal says, devoiced vowels (or "whispered mora" or whatever term your book uses) is a very important concept. It's said to be a feature of Tokyo Japanese although I'm sure it's present in some other dialects as well. The basic rule is that a vowel is devoiced when it's between two voiceless consonants, or at the end of a phrase/sentence after a voiceless consonant.
Sound = Kana? - Inny Jan - 2012-05-29
I can hear exactly what is written there but then again my receptors are conditioned with a different sound system from yours so what I can hear doesn't have to be what you do.
Sound = Kana? - SammyB - 2012-05-29
It sounds exactly how it's written to me too... o_O
Sound = Kana? - temporary - 2012-05-30
The 'h' in ひとつ is a voiceless palatal fricative. Pronounce it as in the English word 'hue'. Examples in other languages are on the Wikipedia article linked above.
Also useful: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_phonology.