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Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - Shinichirou - 2012-01-30
Hi, there.
I have encountered several poems with katakana dominance lately which I find quite strange..Any ideas?
Thank you.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - zigmonty - 2012-01-30
Shinichirou Wrote:Hi, there.Modern or old school?
I have encountered several poems with katakana dominance lately which I find quite strange..Any ideas?
Thank you.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - Shinichirou - 2012-01-30
Sorry I did not eloborate...
Well, rather modern stuff. The most recent example that comes to mind would be Miyazawa Kenji I suppose...
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - yudantaiteki - 2012-01-30
What do you mean by "katakana dominance"? Loan words? In any case, I have no idea.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - JimmySeal - 2012-01-31
Kenji Miyazawa lived 1886-1933, so I wouldn't exactly call that modern. Before WW2, Japanese was written quite differently from how it is now. I could be mistaken, but my understanding is that kana in written works was usually either all katakana or all hiragana, not a mixture. The current system of using katakana for non-Chinese loanwords and ALL CAPS words, and hiragana for everything else is a newer convention.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - nadiatims - 2012-01-31
pure speculation as I never really read old stuff, but could it be that before the invention of computers/IME there was more katakana use in place of obscure kanji? (to make things more readable)
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - yudantaiteki - 2012-01-31
There was a much larger separation between stuff that was written with a lot of kanji (i.e. classical Chinese and other stuff close to that) and stuff that was written with few kanji (poetry, monogatari, diaries, etc.)
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - pm215 - 2012-01-31
JimmySeal Wrote:Kenji Miyazawa lived 1986-1933Neat trick :-)
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - Shinichirou - 2012-01-31
Thank you for your ideas so far. That makes sense...
Well, I can't remember the title of the other poem,
so let's focus on Miyazawa Kenji instead...In "Ame ni makezu" one
finds lots of katakana...
http://bookman.tsumikistudio.com/data/ebooks/ja/amenimomakezu.pdf
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - Thora - 2012-01-31
Wikipedia offers the following, but I'd be a bit wary about relying on it. You might find some detailed papers on the net. (It's his most famous poem, but I suspect his other stuff gets more academic attention.)
Wikipedia Wrote:Miyazawa chose to write the poem using katakana. This is stylistically odd from a modern perspective,[citation needed] as katakana is nowadays (usually) only used in Japanese writing to denote foreign words. However, at the time, katakana rather than hiragana was the preferred syllabary. The limited use of kanji might be viewed as a move to make his poem more accessible to the rural folk of northern Japan with whom he spent his life,[citation needed] or perhaps as similar to American poet e. e. cummings's style in using primarily lower case.[citation needed]I wouldn't say katakana was the preferred syllabary in 1930. Katakana-only wasn't used. Kanji & katakana were still used in official documents then, but popular stuff was in kanji & hiragana and had been for a long time. Even during the Edo period, some popular books were published using mostly hiragana with some kanji with furigana for those with poor reading skills. Katakana was sometimes used as a phonetic guide for kanji ateji loan words. Some newspapers would replace rare kanji with katakana early on. But kanji & hiragana was the norm for non-official stuff.
(People back then might have had a slightly easier time reading all-katakana, though, b/c it was taught first pre WWII and wasn't limited to loan words as it is now.)
Miyazawa wrote his other stuff in kanji and hiragana, so it seems unlikely that he wrote this poem in katakana to make it easier for the local farmers to read.
Rural farmers up north may have had a lower literacy rate than big urban centers in 1930, but compulsory education had been in effect for about 50 years by then. The elementary curriculum set in 1900 included 1200 kanji. Miyazawa had been working up north as a high school teacher. It seems reasonable that he'd expect his work to be published with furigana for any difficult kanji, as was the custom with newspapers and literary journals. His children's stories would likely have the appropriate mix of hiragana and kanji.
He apparently wrote this poem while he while ill shortly before his death. It was written entirely in katakana and found in a notebook in which he'd also written out the Buddhist Lotus Sutra many times. Miyazawa was apparently obsessed with the Lotus Sutra and trying to spread the ideas of the Nichirenism movement (an affiliation which some try to minimize). His other work reflects Buddhist ideas, but this poem is thought by some to be more of simple chant/prayer (I don't know the right word to use.)
His use of katakana might be related to the fact that buddhist scripture in previous centuries used katakana not hiragana. Also, the buddhist incantations had significance beyond their meanings. The act and sound of repetitive recitation was also important. A phonetic syllabary might also allude to that functional aspect of the poem.
Miyazawa was apparently a fan of a few foreign modernist thinkers and artists and influences have been noted. I hadn't heard about an e.e. cummings connection specifically - it'd be interesting to see where that came from. (I wonder if they're trying to connect it to the supposedly humble "i"?) It somehow feels unlikely and contradictory to me that Miyazawa would have experimented with what might be considered a self-indulgent gimmick in a poem such as this, which is a meditation on the ideal self-sacrificing charitable person he strives to be. But I have no idea.
I came across a comment that Miyazawa may have used katakana to convey simplicity. It's a kind of symbolic orthography representation of the values he espoused. Also, the poem itself is not as complex as some of his other stuff. He seems to be seeking the strength not to waver from his aim of actualizing Buddhist principles at a grass roots level by helping to allieviate the suffering of the poor farmers in his community.
Shinichirou, if you do look into this further, please let us know what you find out. Also, if you can remember the name of other poet who used mostly katakana, I'd be interested to know.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - JimmySeal - 2012-02-01
pm215 Wrote:D'oh!JimmySeal Wrote:Kenji Miyazawa lived 1986-1933Neat trick :-)
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - bebio - 2012-02-01
On several Early Modern Japanese texts that I have encountered, katakana is used instead of hiragana as Okurigana. Of course, this was one amongst several different styles: some texts are done with kanji only in normal order, others with kanji in very complicated ordering (they need to add small katakana and special kanji to indicate the correct order, as in a sort of notation device), others with a minimum of hiragana (much less than is common nowadays), and others. It is up to the preference or standards set by certain communities, groups, organizations and regions within Japan.
but yes, in the Early Modern Period it is not rare to find katakana being almost exclusively instead of hiragana.
Why is japanese poetry often written in Katakana? - Tefhel - 2012-02-01
Well if it's just the one author you are talking about then it is probably just stylistic.
If it is multiple authors then I don't know.