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+--- Thread: AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? (/thread-7756.html)
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - domokun1134 - 2011-05-01
The info on the AJATT site is somewhat vague and doesn't show examples of the content. I'm left wondering exactly what this service is. Is it as amazing as Khatz says it is? Has anyone tried it?
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Kuma01 - 2011-05-01
I seriously doubt it. From what I've heard most of his 'products' are substandard and nothing you couldn't do by yourself. People should really stop treating the guy like some kind of language 'guru' that holds all the answers to easy language learning. Any person that would obsess over nothing but Japanese over a year would become fluent in it, unless they're mentally impaired or something.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - sesshomaru - 2011-05-01
Kuma01 Wrote:I seriously doubt it. From what I've heard most of his 'products' are substandard and nothing you couldn't do by yourself. People should really stop treating the guy like some kind of language 'guru' that holds all the answers to easy language learning. Any person that would obsess over nothing but Japanese over a year would become fluent in it, unless they're mentally impaired or something.Personally I think the AJATT site (and Khatz himself) is nothing more than a grand conspiracy to upset people here at RevTK. Or at least that seems to be the net effect of almost everything he does.
In every AJATT thread the ones who truly treat Khatz as a "language guru" are the ones saying he shouldn't be treated as a language guru. There are plenty of good threads and contributing members here which give this place value. Khatz's personality along with how he presents information are also valuable for different reasons.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - ta12121 - 2011-05-01
Kuma01 Wrote:I seriously doubt it. From what I've heard most of his 'products' are substandard and nothing you couldn't do by yourself. People should really stop treating the guy like some kind of language 'guru' that holds all the answers to easy language learning. Any person that would obsess over nothing but Japanese over a year would become fluent in it, unless they're mentally impaired or something.The more I think about it, the less impressed I become. I was really obsessed with being fluent in jp in the 1 year mark. Although I wouldn't call myself fluent still. I was really making serious progress. So 1.5-2 years to become fluent, doesn't sound so off. Seriously, if you spend 24/7 doing jp. I don't see why one couldn't become fluent in it.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Javizy - 2011-05-01
sesshomaru Wrote:Khatz's personality along with how he presents information are also valuable for different reasons.Information as the needle in a haystack of verbose, opinionated, over-the-top drivel? I only skimmed a couple of the things a few years ago, and that was enough for me. I guess you have a point about the personality though. People seem to buy into that "YOU can be successful, too!" style self-help stuff. Maybe he should start doing Tony Robbins style public events. He's certainly not hurting anyone, so good luck to him.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - aphasiac - 2011-05-01
Khatz was brought up in the UK, and has a typical british sense of humour. He bigs himself up in such an overblown way that it's obviously meant to be ironic and self-deprecating. I think this is why people either love him or hate him - the haters don't get it, and mistake this humour for arrogance.
For the real him, just watch those youtube interviews he did - he comes across as an friendly, intelligent, all round nice guy.
Obviously there are other ways of learning Japanese, it's just khatz found a really fun way that worked for him and wanted to share it with the world (remember the AJATT site was around for 3-4 years before he decided to make some money from it). I like his style of writing, I like how motivating the articles on his site are, and honestly if it wasn't for AJATT I wouldn't have continued studying Japanese, wouldn't have learn kanji, and as a knock-on effect wouldn't have met my girlfriend or be moving to a new country next month.
So yeh I wish him all the best in this new endeavour!
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - sesshomaru - 2011-05-01
aphasiac Wrote:Khatz was brought up in the UK, and has a typical british sense of humour. He bigs himself up in such an overblown way that it's obviously meant to be ironic and self-deprecating. I think this is why people either love him or hate him - the haters don't get it, and mistake this humour for arrogance.^This
For the real him, just watch those youtube interviews he did - he comes across as an friendly, intelligent, all round nice guy.
Obviously there are other ways of learning Japanese, it's just khatz found a really fun way that worked for him and wanted to share it with the world (remember the AJATT site was around for 3-4 years before he decided to make some money from it). I like his style of writing, I like how motivating the articles on his site are, and honestly if it wasn't for AJATT I wouldn't have continued studying Japanese, wouldn't have learn kanji, and as a knock-on effect wouldn't have met my girlfriend or be moving to a new country next month.
So yeh I wish him all the best in this new endeavour!
However, I enjoy reading the Khatz hate. Its strangely amusing to read comments like 'he's arrogant' that gives him fodder for his site, which is then used here (RevTK) as evidence of his arrogance and 'coltish' following. Rinse, Lavender & Repeat.
I don't post much but do remember a time before AJATT charged any money. Heck, I remember when Jpod101 didn't charge money and worrying about the JLPT test was all the craze. Now J-Drama/Movies has a new audience, RTK is treated as a stepping stone to SRS'ing sentence and subs.
Am I rambling? Sure, but so what.
Grammar doesn't exist
Classes do suck
Monolingual Dictionaries are the coolest!
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Nagareboshi - 2011-05-01
I've been reading some way-back posts on this forum. Incidentally it was about AJATT and how it changed over the last couple of years. I refresh the window this topic was in, and what do i get to see at the top? Yet another topic about AJATT. I see this as an invitation to share my thoughts about AJATT. I would never buy anything from him. That said, here comes a relativistic view of what he does, and does not.
No detailed instructions are given, how to actually reach the 18 month fluency. Instead there is a rich source of ideas, and motivation as well, all over the place. He alters some of his ideas and methods, and sometimes improves on them. Kanji is no fun? Place the Kanji on the front of your card, and overload the flip-side with information, to name the most prominent changes to one of his methods.
The problem is, people seem to stop thinking, and start doing everything he suggests. 10.000 sentences? Boring as hell, but he reached fluency so i can too. Or do this or that deck, in combination with a grammar book, instead of traditional textbooks. Saves lots of money, but it isn't for anyone, but people still start doing it. This can be said for most of everything, from immersion, to change your computers environment to all Japanese. Which I, with a certain background to coding, and system maintenance, would never suggest anyone doing. Unless time has come where a person really understands what he is doing.
He does one thing very well. He clearly has the talent to express his ideas and explaining his methods in such way, that anyone who reads it, can understand him. Nobody who reads his blog needs an academic background. This attracts and puts off people from following him.
Whoever is able to distinct his ideas and methods, and is able to translate them into a way that best suits ones own learning process, can make the most of AJATT, Antimoon, koohi, Textfugu and so on and so forth. The claim "Reach fluency in 18 months," as reasonable as it seems, is not for everyone.
For instance, when i started learning french, i would not have been able to read René Descartes Règles pour la direction de l'esprit and understand it. I can now. I could not read The Illiad, in English, but i can perfectly well now. And i can talk to people in other languages as well. Not because i dedicated all my time, to immerse myself into language and culture, and nothing else. Oh no, far from it! I just kept at it, learned it, stumbled, fell, stood up, and eventually reached a degree where i can say: I'm fluent now, which i say is - when you are able to think in your target language, when you are able to read most anything that comes your way, and when you can converse with people.
This didn't take 30 days, or 9, 12, or 18 months, but eventually 3 years, or more. Some languages take more effort to learn, more time to understand, and more dedication to reach a certain level. But if one thing is for sure, not following a traditional path, and not being bound to school, college or university, one can do it considerably faster. If there is enough time for it, because there is still life, work, family going on. So, if anything, take his best ideas, and improve on them, or alter them your needs. Don't buy into any ideas, looking at it as the golden calf you have to worship and sacrifice to. Use your own head, and find the inspiration needed, to keep you going. This is AJATT, nothing else, no enterprise, no magic wand that you can touch, and nothing else. What counts is you, and not some guy on the internet, who "has made it."
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jcdietz03 - 2011-05-01
AJATT Silverspoon: One lesson per day for ~600 days with a fluency guarantee. I didn't see this summary anywhere in this thread.
I'm commitment-phobic, as his website says.
I tried the forum for two months, then quit paying for it (using the commitment-phobic payment method). I was thinking of doing the same thing with this, just to see how it is. I have the cash to pay for Japanese materials too, so I think I'm a candidate.
I would like it if you could say, "I know everything for this day 1 that you're showing me - Can I have a refund for this day and skip to day 2?"
-------------
Also, I bought one of his products before (a cheap one), and I'm no longer satisfied with it.
1) I'll try to get a refund - I'll post results here if anyone is interested
2) I can use the cash to pay for the first month of this!
------------
It seems that even if you want to buy it, you can't at this point.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Thora - 2011-05-01
Who?
jcdietz03 Wrote:AJATT Silverspoon: One lesson per day for ~600 days with a fluency guarantee.Oh cool - new textbook! Or is more like online classes?
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jcdietz03 - 2011-05-01
Textbook. I think he's making it one day at a time. It's not a perfect analogy as it has things a textbook wouldn't, like how to study, media good for beginners, etc...
Also the very strange part is...how can it be sold out? Maybe controls on quantity raise the price? Or something.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - ueshiba - 2011-05-01
I don´t think it´s like a textbook, he says he´s gonna be like a mr miyagi, it´s a personalized thing, he´s there and says what you should, without you thinking. If he says wax the car for 30 hours, or paint the fence, you might think he´s crazy, but he knows what he´s doing and if you follow it your garanteed to develop.
Again, it´s a personalized thing, and it sounds it takes a good deal of work on his part, hence the limited number available.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Thora - 2011-05-02
I see. Excellent! And I just want to say that anyone who criticizes the idea of the painting-fence-fluency-method is a hater and just doesn't get it. Some people are just incapable of processing new ideas.
None of us are able to separate personality from product. I mean, no flawed individuals ever created masterpieces or had remarkable achievements, right? So Katzumoto being a nice guy means he's qualified to give advice... on anything.
AJATT changed my life, too. When I had dinner with my future in-laws for the first time, I kept one earbud in to listen to Japanese and maintain full immersion (as was specifically recommended). In keeping with that philosophy, I attend business meetings while listening to Japanese anime through one earbud. Whenever anyone complains, I take comfort in Katzumoto's dismissal of such haters.
#get used to Japanese
#suck less
#classes suck
#monodick
#winning (oops, that's that other guy I follow)
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - zachandhobbes - 2011-05-02
While I think Khatz has a considerable amount of experience and good achievement in his learning, his 'method' is too bogged down by senseless buzz words and pseudo-scientific motivational articles to be able to follow. I remember going thru the table of contents (before I ever found this site or RtK) and trying to just see exactly what the hell he did to get to 18 month fluency, and running into about 75% articles about "being one with Japanese" and "Not getting down on yourself!"
If I wanted self help articles I would go buy some weight loss books not a Japanese guide.
Granted he has some useful stuff there. It just seems that most of it is just filler. you can do it! Give up? Try again! You're amazing, and as good as me. -insert some khatz-style bad joke here about how great he is-
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jettyke - 2011-05-02
zachandhobbes Wrote:While I think Khatz has a considerable amount of experience and good achievement in his learning, his 'method' is too bogged down by senseless buzz words and pseudo-scientific motivational articles to be able to follow. ]“All Japanese all the time”. AJATT is all about maxing out the cause card. It’s too stupid and straightforward to fail. It’s based on the childlike realization that Japanese people, the people who are the best at Japanese, also spend the most time in contact with Japanese. In fact, the average Japanese person spends as many hours in contact with Japanese as she does breathing air.
No matter how I think about it, this last sentence doesn't make any sense.
We don't breathe air when we sleep?
This makes me doubt some other Khatz's "In fact"s
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - zachandhobbes - 2011-05-02
Thing about "AJATT" is that it doesn't maximize efficiency, it just maximizes immersion.
Maybe on some deep subconscious level it helps but IMO, siwtching facebook to Japanese probably hurt me more than it helped because when I did it all I understood was the katakana that I could sound out and translate to an english word (terrible habit) and I just ignored all kanji, another bad habit I developed. It was pretty terrible for me.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jettyke - 2011-05-02
zachandhobbes Wrote:Thing about "AJATT" is that it doesn't maximize efficiency, it just maximizes immersion.I eventually got used to it in mixi and started learning stuff, actually.
Maybe on some deep subconscious level it helps but IMO, siwtching facebook to Japanese probably hurt me more than it helped because when I did it all I understood was the katakana that I could sound out and translate to an english word (terrible habit) and I just ignored all kanji, another bad habit I developed. It was pretty terrible for me.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jcdietz03 - 2011-05-02
jcdietz03 Wrote:Also, I bought one of his products before (a cheap one), and I'm no longer satisfied with it.Yep, he gave me a refund.
1) I'll try to get a refund - I'll post results here if anyone is interested
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jettyke - 2011-05-02
jcdietz03 Wrote:Did he write you something back too?jcdietz03 Wrote:Also, I bought one of his products before (a cheap one), and I'm no longer satisfied with it.Yep, he gave me a refund.
1) I'll try to get a refund - I'll post results here if anyone is interested
A letter of sorry or something
? lol
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jcdietz03 - 2011-05-02
1) I told him Nuh-uh-uh - No questions! like he said to when I bought the product.
He said:
1) Sent! Let me know when you get it!
2) Leave me some feedback at my product feedback page
Note that neither of these was required to actually get the refund.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - sutekiiii - 2011-05-02
jettyke Wrote:@jcdietz03jcdietz03 Wrote:Did he write you something back too?jcdietz03 Wrote:Also, I bought one of his products before (a cheap one), and I'm no longer satisfied with it.Yep, he gave me a refund.
1) I'll try to get a refund - I'll post results here if anyone is interested
A letter of sorry or something
How are you finding the silverspoon? (although its only been 1 day) I might consider signing up for it, in the near future.
Thanks~
__________
Edit: signed up, will see how it is!
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - jcdietz03 - 2011-05-02
sutekiiさん、
jcdietz03 Wrote:It seems that even if you want to buy it, you can't at this point.You can try giving your email here if you want to be notified when you can buy it.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - sutekiiii - 2011-05-02
jcdietz03 Wrote:sutekiiさん、Hey, I managed to, the monthly was still available. And I was kicking myself for not paying the full amount. I signed up for the monthly.jcdietz03 Wrote:It seems that even if you want to buy it, you can't at this point.You can try giving your email here if you want to be notified when you can buy it.
Thank you for the quick reply^^ ~
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - Gingerninja - 2011-05-02
About 2 years ago I read all of his stuff, and yeah it was very motivational, and I've taken some of his idea's combined with observations of my own and I'm doing ok. People shouldn't expect to have their hand held. There is no right and wrong way to learn a language, especially as different people learn better in different ways. He gets a lot of hate, and i think a lot of people don't get his humour. (Just from his writing I could tell he was raised in Britain, his style of humour is that obvious to me) but he's motivated a lot of people to do something which the may have not not without someone like him telling them they could, if they just shut up and do it, and ignore the naysayers.
AJATT Silverspoon- Thought's opinions? - aargh57 - 2011-05-02
Kuma01 Wrote:Any person that would obsess over nothing but Japanese over a year would become fluent in it, unless they're mentally impaired or something.I think this is the whole point of his method.
I don't get this idea that he's arrogant. In fact, when I read his blog I find him rather self deprecating. I remember reading something where he talks about wearing black undies so he doesn't see his skid marks and making a joke about how that represents how dumb he is. Doesn't sound very arrogant to me.
I will say that I'm a newb (Although I've finished RTK and am still trying after 3+ years) but I don't think I'd buy his stuff (although I have thought about donating as I've found him very inspiring and wouldn't have started RTK without his site.) I think his system would work and I hope to start implementing more of his ideas but I just don't have the drive to do All Japanese All the Time. I don't see how it would hurt though. As the famous banjo player (and comedian) Steve Martin said,"Obsession is a great substitute for talent."