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+--- Thread: How to do reps fast (/thread-7097.html)
How to do reps fast - Cranks - 2011-01-23
jettyke Wrote:Holy crap!400 new cards per day is impressive. Lol, I'd burn out with the re-reviews after 1-2 weeks. Good going!
I can't believe it, but this interval timer thing works too well for me!
Yesterday I spent the same amount on studying & trying to study japanese as today.
I'm doing core 6k
Yesterday: 630 reps, 3.7 h, 200 new cards studied.
After discovering this method in the middle of the day:
Today: 1550 reps, 5.6 h, 400 new cards studied.
2 times more new cards studied.
about 2,5 times more reps in 1,5 x the time.
I was struggling to study with the old method, and was always burnt out. Today it seems that this timer's logically repetitious speed makes it more of a effortless routine.
Of course it's all speed. I don't know yet about how efficient it is, but I'm definitely saying it's worth a try.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-23
Cranks Wrote:400 new cards per day is impressive. Lol, I'd burn out with the re-reviews after 1-2 weeks. Good going!My aim is to study all the weekends, about 500 cards every weekend (more if I can). And review those cards during the week.
That would make about 500 per week, which is okay. Since I have 2000 until finishing core 6k. It would make me obtain roughly the vocabulary of N2.
I will be able to do those 2000 in a month if all goes well.
From my experience, seems that it's about how many times you have seen the words with intervals, rather than how many minutes you stared at them.
My learning speed was 4 times slower about a month ago.
What speeded me up:
Not writing down: x2
this interval beep every 10 seconds: x2
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-23
CarolinaCG Wrote:My reps are slow because I write the new words, I read the sentence out loud, I analyse the sentence, my reading velocity is increasing thanks to this (I think). That takes time. Don't you write the kanji? You just know what the sentece means and move on?I did it as well. I started Really learning as soon as I found core 6000 & found out that sentences are bad and slow in the beginning, vocab in sentences is better imo.
I was thinking about trying that approach because other than speeding my review time I could learn much more new cards a day, but my writing skills would decrease a lot, so I'm still "thinking" about it. I think it is the best option for JLPT takers (like me) but I have japanese classes, and the more kanji I can write the better, so I don't know...
The goal is to make the easiest cards possible, and the sentence context helps to understand and remember. Your reading velocity could also increase when you read books, it will probably be much more enjoyable.
I assume that you already have finished RTK, so you are already able to write kanji.
If that's the case, then I would write them down at a later stage. For example I could listen to an audio book or something, and make it slower with vlc and write everything down from memory at once.
You could make many different decks's as Ta12121. Production, pronunciation, etc. It's very slow to do everything at once...meaning it's maybe less rewarding, as the numbers are small.
You could search for Ta12121's progress threads and elsewhere to get information on why it's not so fast to write everything down. I don't know about the classroom part though.
It's up to you to decide.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-23
Kanjiiz Wrote:Doesn't Anki have a timer fr each card on the lower right corner?There is a timer, but what makes it much faster for me is A ringing bell/gong every 10 seconds, and I also use a warning 2 seconds before the end of the session.
Question:
What if there's no time to do something fun between the reviews, like there's homework, is the only solution is to learn less Japanese to avoid burn out?
Never learn less Japanese than you want! If you're burnt out, it means that something is wrong with the method with which you're learning.
Which means: Find the malfunction no matter what. I have found at least 4 of them and I'm still on the road...there are even more to come.
...Or else, switch to a different deck.
How to do reps fast - Rina - 2011-01-24
jettyke Wrote:I did it as well. I started Really learning as soon as I found core 6000 & found out that sentences are bad and slow in the beginning, vocab in sentences is better imo.I actualy have been srsing sentences for almost a year, but only about 5 months ago it became serious.
The goal is to make the easiest cards possible, and the sentence context helps to understand and remember. Your reading velocity could also increase when you read books, it will probably be much more enjoyable.
I assume that you already have finished RTK, so you are already able to write kanji.
If that's the case, then I would write them down at a later stage. For example I could listen to an audio book or something, and make it slower with vlc and write everything down from memory at once.
You could make many different decks's as Ta12121. Production, pronunciation, etc. It's very slow to do everything at once...meaning it's maybe less rewarding, as the numbers are small.
You could search for Ta12121's progress threads and elsewhere to get information on why it's not so fast to write everything down. I don't know about the classroom part though.
It's up to you to decide.
I finished RTK in September 2009, my kanji are fine, and I'd say they're one of my strongest points in the japanese language. I stopped reviewing them past summer.
hat I was asking is if you write the kanji in the sentences or just read them, because I couln't possible move on from sentence to sentence in just 9 seconds (it depends on the sentences, if it's a grammar one then I might).
Yup, thanks for the advice, I will seach ta12121's threads, I find them very motivating.
PS: I'm no begginer, I'm studying for 2kyuu at the moment,
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-24
CarolinaCG Wrote:hat I was asking is if you write the kanji in the sentences or just read them, because I couln't possible move on from sentence to sentence in just 9 seconds (it depends on the sentences, if it's a grammar one then I might).I do vocabulary in core 6000.
Yup, thanks for the advice, I will seach ta12121's threads, I find them very motivating.
PS: I'm no begginer, I'm studying for 2kyuu at the moment,
10 seconds seems to be enough for vocab .
I don't know if you're familiar with the format, but those vocab cards have an example sentence & word in the question, Kanjis and meaning in the anwser. At first I try to remember the word's meaning and kanji. If it fails, I look quickly at the whole sentence shown, and if this fails, I quickly look at the anwser, try to remember and push failed.
The whole point is to set the alarm at a convenient interval, so that it helps to move fast forward. More failures will be caused by this, but the speed increases.
CarolinaCG Wrote:PS: I'm no begginer, I'm studying for 2kyuu at the moment,It seems that we have this in common
But I won't be taking the test, I only intend to study.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-25
I've found 2 things that are slowing me down with this Interval based alarm method.
* Not having kept up with my RTK reviews - makes it harder/slower to visualize kanji when doing reps.
*Not being able to read hiragana as fast as a native. - to anwser the card fast I need to read the question fast. Need more reading practice.
I hope that these 2 things will get easier in the coming months though.
Now I've set this small timebox to 8 seconds, trying to get used to it.
How to do reps fast - overture2112 - 2011-01-26
jettyke Wrote:Yesterday: 630 reps, 3.7 h, 200 new cards studied.That's a pretty impressive improvement for something I thought would have no significance or even a negative one, but I guess that just goes to show that constantly adapting and trying new things is worthwhile.
After discovering this method in the middle of the day:
Today: 1550 reps, 5.6 h, 400 new cards studied.
I was struggling to study with the old method, and was always burnt out. Today it seems that this timer's logically repetitious speed makes it more of a effortless routine.
1) I noticed your average time per card went from about 21s to 13s. I managed a similar reduction in my time from mid-20s to just over 10 sec when I finnished RTK and was finally able to visualize an entire kanji at once instead of having to trace each individual component. You mentioned kanji visualization speed so I was wondering if perhaps you also changed your visualization policy in addtion to adding the timer?
2) How do you manage to sync your reps with the timer? If you figure one out before the timer is up do you delay for a second or two to let the next timer cycle start? Do you think it would be useful to have a trivial anki plugin based timer that resets whenever you go to the next card, or am I overestimating the problem?
3) How are you learning new cards? Do you "pre-learn" them in some way, or just see them in anki and fail them until they stick / leech ? I've been using a separate copy of my vocab deck with micro intervals to work from throughout the day, but it usually requires 10-12 reps per new word to get the interval past a few hours (and thus ready to un-suspended in my normal deck) compared to your 3.8 reps/word, thus I'm limited to more like 200 words with 2000 reps per day.
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-26
overture2112 Wrote:1) I noticed your average time per card went from about 21s to 13s. I managed a similar reduction in my time from mid-20s to just over 10 sec when I finnished RTK and was finally able to visualize an entire kanji at once instead of having to trace each individual component. You mentioned kanji visualization speed so I was wondering if perhaps you also changed your visualization policy in addtion to adding the timer?I actually write all my reviews in a notebook and currently am averaging 14 seconds a card, and I'm not really concentrating on speed. The quickest batch I had done was 32 minutes for 160 cards, so that was about 12 seconds per card.
My writing speed has improved dramatically because of writing them all which I love
I don't have a timer I just try to get through the reps, if I spend more than a few seconds and nothing comes to mind I immediately fail the card.
How to do reps fast - ta12121 - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:I'm currently working with 3 decks. I like my progress so far, so I decided to keep each thing seperate. 1 production deck (going from kana to kanji). And then the vocabulary deck. Which goes kanji to kana reading/translation if necessary. And lasty is my sentence deck. I haven't added that much in it lately, but I've added a lot of japanese names (I want to be able to read a lot of names in the future). I like it because it separates each skill. Production I write kanji from memory,vocab I read/understand the vocab cards and my sentence deck to give my context/interesting sentences.CarolinaCG Wrote:My reps are slow because I write the new words, I read the sentence out loud, I analyse the sentence, my reading velocity is increasing thanks to this (I think). That takes time. Don't you write the kanji? You just know what the sentece means and move on?I did it as well. I started Really learning as soon as I found core 6000 & found out that sentences are bad and slow in the beginning, vocab in sentences is better imo.
I was thinking about trying that approach because other than speeding my review time I could learn much more new cards a day, but my writing skills would decrease a lot, so I'm still "thinking" about it. I think it is the best option for JLPT takers (like me) but I have japanese classes, and the more kanji I can write the better, so I don't know...
The goal is to make the easiest cards possible, and the sentence context helps to understand and remember. Your reading velocity could also increase when you read books, it will probably be much more enjoyable.
I assume that you already have finished RTK, so you are already able to write kanji.
If that's the case, then I would write them down at a later stage. For example I could listen to an audio book or something, and make it slower with vlc and write everything down from memory at once.
You could make many different decks's as Ta12121. Production, pronunciation, etc. It's very slow to do everything at once...meaning it's maybe less rewarding, as the numbers are small.
You could search for Ta12121's progress threads and elsewhere to get information on why it's not so fast to write everything down. I don't know about the classroom part though.
It's up to you to decide.
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-27
Ugh, I just updated anki and somehow my "due" list went from 160 to 254 >.>
Time to see what I can do about this whole "speed" thing.
Fastest I've done is estimated at about 12 seconds per card, let's see if I can match that today
How to do reps fast - ta12121 - 2011-01-27
Dustin_Calgary Wrote:Ugh, I just updated anki and somehow my "due" list went from 160 to 254 >.>I'm deleting a lot cards nowadays. I'm really getting in the mood of srsing 10-20% of the time and 80%+ immersion time.
Time to see what I can do about this whole "speed" thing.
Fastest I've done is estimated at about 12 seconds per card, let's see if I can match that today
How to do reps fast - caivano - 2011-01-27
I've been doing about 10/11 secs per card with a mix of vocab and grammar targeted sentences (kanji/reading > meaning).
12 seconds with writing sounds like pretty good going.
I was going to say suspending cards that aren't sinking in and targeting easy cards has helped, but I guess that gets total review time down rather than per card time.
today was 256 cards seen, 85.9% correct, in 43 mins (10.2s p/c)
no new cards as I added 100 grammar cards over then last few days
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-27
Well, I finished my stack of reviews, did batches of 5 or 10 minutes at a time to get a feel for both.
At first I was at about 13 cards/s then 12 cards/s
I got into a good rhythm and was consistently hitting around 10 seconds per card or slightly better.
254 total reviews 53 failed ( I only finished RTK a week or so again, and the tougher ones are piling up from the export to anki, but that is helping to clear them up due to the smaller initial interval )
79.1% retention ( steadily going up through the last week and a half )
10.37 seconds per card.
I write all my reviews ( this is just an rtk kanji deck keep in mind )
Now time to go clean up my fail pile
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-27
@overture2112
1) Before the timer I visualised more slowly and thoroughly. I don't know if anything changed as it's pretty complicated to keep track of visualizing changes.
Anyway when I see a card now I try to get the feeling of a certain kanji, and move on to the next steps of the card. Every kanji has a feel to it. So I guess at first I try to visualize the whole kanji, if it fails I visualize the essential radicals and try to get the feeling of that Kanji...If it comes out that that feeling is wrong, then I fail the card.
When I see kanjis that are hard to remember I try to visualize EVERY radical. Just to make sure that I will actually remember the whole thing later.
Actually I think that visualizing is so individual and hard to explain that perhaps it shouldn't be explained
2)As I learn vocab, I don't read the context sentence most of the time due to limited time.
*When I figure one card out before the timer: I read the whole sentence and try to learn as much as I can from the answer side of the card in the time left until the alarm.
* Or if a card is easy then I try to do 2 cards until the alarm.
*As for the anki plugin, it wouldn't be bad to experiment, but as the learning time for each card is as small as a few seconds then you might as well learn the card more thoroughly in the given time.
*But I could imagine it getting annoying when talking about mature cards, as they don't need so much time for anwsering.
* It could be good for concentration if there was this kind of a plugin, as one could at least close the browser window and concentrate on studying. Also, It could speed up the anki loading times... unfortunately my computer has been slowing down anki reviews' loading time partly because of the browser window being open.
*On the other hand I somehow get the feeling that if the timer was in an anki plugin, I would concentrate too much on watching the time left in case it was shown, which would better not be shown...just the beep would be good. Watching the time left could slow down and perhaps make one feel nervous.
3) It isn't 3.8 reps per word, I also had due cards that day. About 300-400 due cards.
So that would make it about 2.5+ reps per word.
I don't pre-learn, nor have I tried it and maybe I should try it.
With 10 second intervals I set the leech threshold to 8.
With 8 seconds, to 10.
to justify the faster speed...
I'm not sure, but I get the feeling that your cards might be too difficult if it takes you 10-12 reps to make them pass a few hours. On the other hand I'm not familiar with your micro interval technique so I can't be sure.
After those 2 days my due cards per day have been: 500, 300, 300, and today...300!
I studied 200 cards on the first day, 400 on the second day of learning new cards. It might be that this speed working well could be bullshit after all.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-27
Dustin_Calgary Wrote:I don't have a timer I just try to get through the reps, if I spend more than a few seconds and nothing comes to mind I immediately fail the card.The problem for me is that I forget the right time when to fail the card. And the outcome is spending too much time on one card.
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:I'm kind of the opposite, I tend to be a bit trigger happy on failing them pretty quickly, I probably have close to a 5 second "remember or fail" window since it also takes a few seconds to write it out.Dustin_Calgary Wrote:I don't have a timer I just try to get through the reps, if I spend more than a few seconds and nothing comes to mind I immediately fail the card.The problem for me is that I forget the right time when to fail the card. And the outcome is spending too much time on one card.
There have been a few times where i knew as soon as I saw it that it was on the tip of my mind and a few more seconds would have resulted in a correct answer, however I would rather fail it til I can get a fast response, then keep passing it while struggling to remember it.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-27
Dustin_Calgary Wrote:I write all my reviews ( this is just an rtk kanji deck keep in mind )Well you definitely SHOULD write if you're doing rtk, at least the first times you see a kanji.
There's no questioning that. But sentences and vocab is a different story.
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:I definitely agree with writing rtk, but I have to see what works for me with vocab/sentences. I've started the core2k deck after mastering steps 1 and 2 on the website, and have been writing out the kana > kanji sentences and simply saying the kanji > reading sentences and this is resulting in averages upwards of 20-25 seconds per card on average which is a bit excessive, but I love writing as much as I can.Dustin_Calgary Wrote:I write all my reviews ( this is just an rtk kanji deck keep in mind )Well you definitely SHOULD write if you're doing rtk, at least the first times you see a kanji.
There's no questioning that. But sentences and vocab is a different story.
It will get way too hard to keep up like this I think so we'll see what happens.
How to do reps fast - overture2112 - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:*On the other hand I somehow get the feeling that if the timer was in an anki plugin, I would concentrate too much on watching the time left in case it was shown, which would better not be shown...just the beep would be good. Watching the time left could slow down and perhaps make one feel nervous.I was thinking audible only.
jettyke Wrote:So that would make it about 2.5+ reps per word.So you basically see it for the first time, fail, and then (on average) succeed when it comes around again or the next after- and then presumably remember until it comes up again the next day? I'm sure my micro interval settings aren't optimal, but I think my knowledge of readings is too poor to pull that off. Still, just knowing that it's possible is uplifting and motivates me to try more tweaking.
...
I'm not sure, but I get the feeling that your cards might be too difficult if it takes you 10-12 reps to make them pass a few hours. On the other hand I'm not familiar with your micro interval technique so I can't be sure.
jettyke Wrote:I have the same issue. Also I like the idea of a warning slightly before time is up.Dustin_Calgary Wrote:I don't have a timer I just try to get through the reps, if I spend more than a few seconds and nothing comes to mind I immediately fail the card.The problem for me is that I forget the right time when to fail the card. And the outcome is spending too much time on one card.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-27
overture2112 Wrote:So you basically see it for the first time, fail, and then (on average) succeed when it comes around again or the next after- and then presumably remember until it comes up again the next day? I'm sure my micro interval settings aren't optimal, but I think my knowledge of readings is too poor to pull that off. Still, just knowing that it's possible is uplifting and motivates me to try more tweaking.On average ( according to the last week) it seems that I fail a card 2 times, and the 3rd time I succeed...for the first day. Then when it comes up the next day it's kind of a 50-50 whether I'll remember it.
The failures of next days depend on how difficult the cards are, some stick right away.
Just instead of learning the cards a lot in the first day, I tend to make learning them more spaced out. I might fail a new card 7 days in succession, but perhaps I'll get used to the card in the end.
And maybe I'll save time doing this, not sure.
So instead of failing 10 times the first day, I'll rather fail once every day for 10 days.
I'm also bad with readings, only about 750 kanji covered so far.
Note that I just discovered this and I'm not sure at all myself about what I'm talking about.
How to do reps fast - ninetimes - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:What do you think of this?I've long thought a plugin for anki that did something similar would be really useful. I also tend to get distracted and drift off during reviews, even while using short timeboxes. If nothing else it'd be interesting to have something that just auto-failed after 20s or whatever as an upper threshhold. I try to do it myself, but, again, easily distracted...
http://www.speedbagforum.com/timer.html
How to do reps fast - Dustin_Calgary - 2011-01-27
ninetimes Wrote:I think if I ever got to 20 seconds on a single kanji I'd want to put my head through the desk :pjettyke Wrote:What do you think of this?I've long thought a plugin for anki that did something similar would be really useful. I also tend to get distracted and drift off during reviews, even while using short timeboxes. If nothing else it'd be interesting to have something that just auto-failed after 20s or whatever as an upper threshhold. I try to do it myself, but, again, easily distracted...
http://www.speedbagforum.com/timer.html
I've got some distractions too, 3 1/2 year old twins running around screaming while I am trying to do my reviews lol. Maybe I'm just a bit impatient, at least it seems to benefit me here, I rarely even get past 6 or 7 seconds before hitting that fail button, it's gotta be almost instant or fail, if it's 4-5 seconds, it's hard anyways.
How to do reps fast - jettyke - 2011-01-27
ninetimes Wrote:Auto-failing them would result in trying to answer the question for 20 seconds, and then failing without ever seeing the answer. In this case there should be some additional few seconds, which would be meant for learning the anwser side of the card.jettyke Wrote:What do you think of this?I've long thought a plugin for anki that did something similar would be really useful. I also tend to get distracted and drift off during reviews, even while using short timeboxes. If nothing else it'd be interesting to have something that just auto-failed after 20s or whatever as an upper threshhold. I try to do it myself, but, again, easily distracted...
http://www.speedbagforum.com/timer.html
How to do reps fast - overture2112 - 2011-01-27
jettyke Wrote:Auto-failing them would result in trying to answer the question for 20 seconds, and then failing without ever seeing the answer. In this case there should be some additional few seconds, which would be meant for learning the anwser side of the card.I don't like auto-failing. That would end up frustrating me as I would probably often hit spacebar a split second after an auto-fail and end up seeing the answer to the next question.