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How many books until fluency in reading? - jettyke - 2011-01-15
With English, If to think back then it took me approximately 15-20 (200-300p) books in English to read stuff like Murakami with ease, without problems. At first slimmer books of course, but that's about the amount of books.
In addition I studied English in school back then, so I guess it really takes really a lot of reading to be able to read at least upper-intermediate japanese with ease?
Of course it all depends on various factors, but it seems that I need a lot of reading material...
How many books until fluency in reading? - ta12121 - 2011-01-15
This is one of those things that are different about japanese then english. If you want to be able to read jp fluently. You need to understand a lot of kanji/know how to read them in context. I know a lot of kanji in jp novels are provided furagana(kana on top of the kanji). So those you don't need to worry about (since those are the rare readings+kanji at times)
But it really comes down to how much kanji/context/and how much words you know. My japanese friend said in terms of reading. If you can read a newspaper 100%. Then you should be fine in terms of reading most context. She said you don't really need to know more than that.
How many books until fluency in reading? - yudantaiteki - 2011-01-15
I always find that the "newspaper" bar is somewhat out of date and not that relevant for most learners; newspapers use a particular style and set of words generally dealing with politics, economics, and the like. I have trouble reading newspapers but that has very little to do with how well I can read (for instance) an article on Genji.
(I also think that the Internet has greatly decreased the value of being able to read Japanese news sources -- that is not to say that it's totally useless to a foreigner, but you're going to have access to English news no matter where you are in Japan without putting forth much effort. And since you can't vote even as a permanent resident, local news isn't necessarily that relevant, and the TV news may be easier to follow.)
There's no magic number of books; I'm not sure how long it took me but I was mostly reading video games instead of books...
How many books until fluency in reading? - Aijin - 2011-01-15
Agreed, newspapers aren't a great measure, nor the best goal for a learner to aim for.
How many books it takes until one reaches a pretty high level of reading comprehension is going to of course depend upon the books, and one's additional studies outside of reading. My personal opinion, as always, is that one should work with material that is at their level, and progress gradually, book by book, into harder material. This means starting with books written for children, and working one's way up to adult novels.
There are plenty of fantastic children's and young adult books at the level of beginners and intermediate students, and if you need recommendations I'd be happy to mention some
How many books until fluency in reading? - TheVinster - 2011-01-15
Well, Aijin, I myself would look into some children's books to start my progression. Or just ones considered easy. I really need to actually read.
How many books until fluency in reading? - julianjalapeno - 2011-01-15
![[Image: tootsieowl.jpg]](http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_SpJTRREPOsk/TA8Ou-Szh6I/AAAAAAAABnk/Apeebmjp7yY/s1600/tootsieowl.jpg)
Three.
How many books until fluency in reading? - hereticalrants - 2011-01-15
So far I've only really read a few thousand pages of manga, a few games(I've finished maybe 6 Japanese visual novels), bits and pieces of some light novels, and song lyrics. .......Oh, and some origami books, but the language in those is very repetitive.
「内側をひろげてつぶすようにおる
カドを内側に折る
反対側も同じ
途中の図
カドを後ろに折る
カドを内側に折る
中わり折り
カドを内側に折る
できあがり」
Aijin Wrote:There are plenty of fantastic children's and young adult books at the level of beginners and intermediate students, and if you need recommendations I'd be happy to mention someYoung adult books, please! I like fantasy and other speculative fiction.
How many books until fluency in reading? - jettyke - 2011-01-15
Does anyone know anything easy on aozora?
The site contains a lot of free books, but I don't know whether everything is so hard as it seems...
How many books until fluency in reading? - Cranks - 2011-01-16
I've found Naruto is a nice start. It is easy enough to get in both English and Japanese and you can watch the anime at the same time. Bleach goes well with it. I pretty much started with Deathnote (which has furigana). That wasn't a great idea - it's pretty hard when your N5/4 in grammar (the vocab isn't that challenging, but the manga is beautifully written, so pretty tough.)
I'm mid-pre-intermediate and I've read Deathnote 1-3 + Air Gear 1 and Naruto 1 (75%). I can sort of get the gist of the newspaper, but it's like 15% comprehension. With Naruto I probably know 60% of the words on the page and 80% of the Kanji with maybe 35% of the readings. I can read signs, but it takes awhile. I can't read heavy text without furigana. I can read websites to about 35% comprehension without Rikachan. I think I'm about average for my level, except in grammar which I need to work on a bit (I should realistically be low N3 for what I'm doing).
How many books until fluency in reading? - Aijin - 2011-01-16
Here's some recommendations. I'll update it more later, as I'm currently sick with the flu so can't stay on the computer long. For those that live in the states, all of these books and series can be purchased online at kinokuniya, which has very reasonable shipping fees in comparison to other places since they're shipping from their bookstores in the US.
１０分で読めるお話 - Compilation of short stories from across the world, including fairy tales, myths, parables, and others. Each story is short enough to read in ten minutes, thus the title of the series. These are graded readers, designed to be reading supplements for elementary school children working on their reading skills. It goes from 1st grade to 6th grade, with two books per grade. The lower grades contain less kanji, large print, simple vocabulary and grammar, and then progress grade by grade from there.
なぜ?どうして?科学のお話 - By the same publisher as 10分で読めるお話, these are graded readers designed to teach elementary school kids science. They explain basic science facts, such as why skin becomes pruney in hot water, and can be informative even for adults.
魔女の宅急便 - All of you have probably seen Kiki's Delivery Service, and the novel it's based on is fantastic for learners: it uses simple grammar and vocabulary, and is a great book to read if you're just starting on Japanese books. The plot is completely different from the film as well, so it's interesting to compare the two. If you enjoy the novel, there are five sequels at about the same difficulty.
民話と伝説 呪いの巻物 - A series of scary folktales and legends, split into books of world legends, and others that are just traditional Japanese tales. If you have an interest in Japanese mythology, mainly in ghost stories and the monsters, this is a fantastic series.
獣の奏者 - A popular fantasy series that also spawned manga and anime adaptations. I'll just steal Wikipedia's blunt plot summary of, "It focuses on a girl who can control the greatest of beasts as she gets involved in a war between two kingdoms."
It's one of the more difficult reads in children's literature, compared to simpler books like 魔女の宅急便, and after this series a learner should be ready to progress out of children's books.Will post more later, when I'm not on the verge of dying
How many books until fluency in reading? - Aijin - 2011-01-17
I'll create a separate list for online resources:
絵本 - Contains simple fairytales with pictures for each page. There are many different language options, so if you can always compare the English translations with the Japanese versions if you're stuck on any spot.
ふぁんた時間 - Children's stories that have full audio to go along with the text, so you can get in listening comprehension practice alongside reading practice. Some stories are also told in the form of short animated movies.
How many books until fluency in reading? - jettyke - 2011-01-17
Aijin Wrote:Will post more later, when I'm not on the verge of dyingThanks Aijin, and don't die!
We still need your help.
How many books until fluency in reading? - hanear21 - 2011-01-17
Regarding 魔女子の宅急便, I was searching on google and found what appears to be the story here: http://novel18.syosetu.com/n3541j/#
Can't verify since I don't have the hard copy, maybe someone else can.
How many books until fluency in reading? - Asriel - 2011-01-17
@hanear21 -- It appears to be a really long fanfic. Quite sexual too. That's why it's telling you not to read if you're under 18. I'm pretty sure it's not the actual story, if it talks about ウルスラ getting money by exposing her privates to strangers at the age of 10...
[edit]I didn't read much of it...just noticed the age warning at the beginning, and searched for some terms I thought might come up if it were like that. Lo and behold...
How many books until fluency in reading? - hanear21 - 2011-01-17
haha...that's hilarious...I only read the first paragraph, and I'm obviously not a strong reader. Well maybe someone will find some use of it...
How many books until fluency in reading? - yudantaiteki - 2011-01-17
Note that the actual suggestion is 魔女の宅急便, not 魔女子.
How many books until fluency in reading? - Aijin - 2011-01-17
hanear21 Wrote:Regarding 魔女子の宅急便, I was searching on google and found what appears to be the story here: http://novel18.syosetu.com/n3541j/#That is incredibly funny. I don't know how anyone could write a story like that with a straight face.
Can't verify since I don't have the hard copy, maybe someone else can.
How many books until fluency in reading? - Cranks - 2011-01-18
Those are two rather crazy books, guys. Approach links with care kids.
How many books until fluency in reading? - Cranks - 2011-01-18
#Heads to bookstore.
How many books until fluency in reading? - jettyke - 2011-01-25
Hey I found this site: http://tb.sanseido.co.jp/kokugo/kokugo/dokusho/j-100/index.html
100 books recommended for middle school students.
Unfortunately it seems that those books are recommended by teachers so can't be sure about how interesting they are, but at least their level should be that of a middle schooler.
How many books until fluency in reading? - ta12121 - 2011-01-25
Aijin Wrote:Agreed, newspapers aren't a great measure, nor the best goal for a learner to aim for.I always liked news sites/newspapers due to all that kanji. Or maybe it's because I like kanji in general, so the more the better I guess...
How many books it takes until one reaches a pretty high level of reading comprehension is going to of course depend upon the books, and one's additional studies outside of reading. My personal opinion, as always, is that one should work with material that is at their level, and progress gradually, book by book, into harder material. This means starting with books written for children, and working one's way up to adult novels.
There are plenty of fantastic children's and young adult books at the level of beginners and intermediate students, and if you need recommendations I'd be happy to mention some
How many books until fluency in reading? - Seamoby - 2011-01-25
I was thinking today if it was a good idea or a silly one to read 日本語 children's books, so I'm glad I saw this thread again. I dropped by the used books store and saw the Kodansha AoiTori Bunko series. They looked like nice paperbacks with illustrations and furigana, so I bought a couple of them. The series looks like it has both original Japanese and foreign children's books. I got 大きな森の小さな家 (Little House in the Big Woods) and 宇宙人のしゅくだい (Howework Alien). Yay, talk about regressing!
Here is the Kodansha AoiTori Bunko website. You can read samples from the different books. I want them all, lol!
http://shop.kodansha.jp/bc/aoitori/trialreading.html
Anyone tried these books?
How many books until fluency in reading? - Bokusenou - 2011-01-25
Seamoby Wrote:I was thinking today if it was a good idea or a silly one to read 日本語 children's books, so I'm glad I saw this thread again. I dropped by the used books store and saw the Kodansha AoiTori Bunko series. They looked like nice paperbacks with illustrations and furigana, so I bought a couple of them. The series looks like it has both original Japanese and foreign children's books. I got 大きな森の小さな家 (Little House in the Big Woods) and 宇宙人のしゅくだい (Howework Alien). Yay, talk about regressing!As long as reading material keeps your interest, I don't see how it can be a bad idea.
Here is the Kodansha AoiTori Bunko website. You can read samples from the different books. I want them all, lol!
http://shop.kodansha.jp/bc/aoitori/trialreading.html
Anyone tried these books?
I read a lot of manga Japanese fables before I tried my first novel because I love manga and youkai-related things, and they really helped, but if I'd known about Aoi Tori Bunko then I would have jumped on it. The books seem well done and have lots of furigana judging by the previews, so I usually recommend them to people just starting to read fiction. I think there's even an Aoi Tori Bunko version of the Suzumiya Haruhi series, which are not the easiest light novels to read in the original version, which makes me wonder if they dumbed it down or just added a bunch of extra furigana...
How many books until fluency in reading? - Seamoby - 2011-01-25
Bokusenou Wrote:As long as reading material keeps your interest, I don't see how it can be a bad idea.Right, looking at the Aoi Tori Bunko books that I just bought, they are well-formatted, with well-spaced (not crowded) writing and generous illustrations. All kanji seem to have furigana, not just the harder ones. The ones I got have about 200 pages each, so there's plenty to read. I'm as giddy as a school kid.
I read a lot of manga Japanese fables before I tried my first novel because I love manga and youkai-related things, and they really helped, but if I'd known about Aoi Tori Bunko then I would have jumped on it. The books seem well done and have lots of furigana judging by the previews, so I usually recommend them to people just starting to read fiction. I think there's even an Aoi Tori Bunko version of the Suzumiya Haruhi series, which are not the easiest light novels to read in the original version, which makes me wonder if they dumbed it down or just added a bunch of extra furigana...
How many books until fluency in reading? - Aijin - 2011-01-25
Learning a foreign language is a great opportunity for people to get in touch with their inner-child