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Kanji in Japanese schools - synewave - 2007-07-08
Chadokoro_K Wrote:I know that elementary school students in Japan learn approx 1,000 kyoiku kanji, and i thought they finished off the jouyou kanji in junior high school. As compulsory education only goes through junior high school, right? (Or is it too late at night, and my brain too muddled to recall this correctly.)Elementary school - 1006 characters (漢検６級）
If this is the case, what kanji do high school students in Japan study?
Junior high school - Finish 常用漢字 1945 characters (in total, inc. 1006 from elementary) （漢検準２級）
High school - Not 100% sure. But according to one of the 国語 teachers at my school (Junior high school) he reckons new characters are taught e.g. 名用漢字 (commonly used kanji used in names) as well as additional readings, jukugo, etc of kanji within the 常用漢字 set. （漢検２級）
I imagine (although someone working at a high school would know better) that at some point i.e. high school, less emphasis is placed on learning new characters and more time will be spent studying literature; writing; and discussing. Much the same as in the UK and USA, etc. where we don't really spend much time at high school level practicing hand writing and learning how to spell.
Kanji in Japanese schools - JimmySeal - 2007-07-09
Yep I stopped learning grammar in English class after 8th grade, though we did vocabulary all through high school.
I'd imagine that they don't focus much on new kanji in high school here but I don't know for sure.
Kanji in Japanese schools - amthomas - 2007-07-09
I dunno... From the workbooks that my students (admittedly, in Japan's rural countryside) use in their Japanese classes, I'd hesitate to say that htey learn all the Joyo Kanji in Junior High School. Maybe the *curriculum* says they are supposed to, but...
Based on the levels of Kanji Kentei that most of my students took recently, I'd say that by the *end* of High School they'll have more or less nailed down the Joyo set, but even that's stretching it for some of these kids... A lot of kids took Kanken level 3, pre-2, and 2 at my Senior High School.
One kid last year took 4, I remember, and he was ridiculed for taking such a silly, easy test... so 4級 is probably not HS level, but I know reasonably smart kids that struggle with 2級 kanji. *shrug*
I can't find it at hte moment, but if you can find a copy of the Kanji Kentei level explanations, (and IIRC) the official papers have a chart showing that 2級 is aimed at 2nd/3rd grade HS students.
They don't teach kanji in class, as far as I know, but they do have to do homework out of a kanji review drill book and have that marked by their Japanese teacher. So, kinda like home-study for the kanji, but still, it *is* a part of their education in HS...
Sorry for the incoherent post, btw...
Kanji in Japanese schools - synewave - 2007-07-09
amthomas Wrote:I dunno... From the workbooks that my students (admittedly, in Japan's rural countryside) use in their Japanese classes, I'd hesitate to say that htey learn all the Joyo Kanji in Junior High School. Maybe the *curriculum* says they are supposed to, but...Yeah. As with most educational systems that teach a specific amount of material regardless of student comprehension whether or not the kids know/remember the 常用漢字 set at the end of JHS is immaterial. According to the teacher I spoke to, that is what they are taught.
For kids doing kan ken, anything less than ３級 by the end of JHS isn't worth the paper it's written on. At the school I'm at, a percentage get 準２級 sometime in ３年生 and one girl just passed ２級。 This is just a normal state JHS so imagine it's pretty indicative of the rest of the country (possibly).
Don't have my kan ken book to hand but I know the bit you're talking about. From memory, grade 4 and 3 are the "JHS grades" then pre-second is soon after entering high school with grade 2 being high school graduate level (I think). This contradicts what the teacher I spoke to told me. He reckons that they JHS syllabus covers up to ２級。
amthomas Wrote:They don't teach kanji in class, as far as I know, but they do have to do homework out of a kanji review drill book and have that marked by their Japanese teacher. So, kinda like home-study for the kanji, but still, it *is* a part of their education in HS...Taught kanji lessons at JHS can be great for RTKers. I sat in on a lesson where the teacher was doing 'semi-pure groups'. I was loving it!
Kanji in Japanese schools - amthomas - 2007-07-09
synewave Wrote:For kids doing kan ken, anything less than ３級 by the end of JHS isn't worth the paper it's written on. At the school I'm at, a percentage get 準２級 sometime in ３年生 and one girl just passed ２級。 This is just a normal state JHS so imagine it's pretty indicative of the rest of the country (possibly).Hah. No, seriously?
Man. I thought my kids were a bit ... um... a bit disinterested in study, shall we say, but this really clinches it. I have students that are graduating from high school later this (academic) year that have serious problems with the 準２級 kanken, and when someone passes ２級 it's a *big* deal.
guess that's what I get for living in the middle of nowhere, eh? *grin*
The good part is that they are all incredibly friendly, which has helped a lot...
Anyway, what I'm getting at is that I agree with you. Despite what is *actually* being taught in schools or retained by the students' brains, a high school graduate should know 99% of the ２級 kanji without much hesitation, I believe.
Kanji in Japanese schools - synewave - 2007-07-09
amthomas Wrote:Anyway, what I'm getting at is that I agree with you. Despite what is *actually* being taught in schools or retained by the students' brains, a high school graduate should know 99% of the ２級 kanji without much hesitation, I believe.Completely. We just have to watch any of the shows where kanji ability is tested to see some of the タレント struggling with 中学 level stuff!
Kanji in Japanese schools - JimmySeal - 2007-07-09
I live in the middle of nowhere and my kids sure aren't braniacs but there are usually a few JHS 3d years who take the 準２級 and maybe one who takes ２級 every year.
You should bear in mind that even if they can read all the Joyo-kanji, that doesn't mean they know them backwards and forwards as required for the test. You can be perfectly literate and capable of reading almost anything and still not be able to pass 準２級. One of the teachers at my school took 準２級 two years ago and he was sweating about it. The 国語 teacher took and passed ２級 the same year. I think it's a big deal when any 日本人 passes ２級.
Speaking of quiz shows, has anyone heard of that new show Are you smarter than a 5th grader? hosted by Jeff Foxworthy? I wonder if they got the idea from Japan.